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Ezekiel-170

5 Man Veteran Squad-150
-Power Fist, Power Weapon, Heavy Bolter

5 Man Veteran Squad-150
-Power Fist, Power Weapon, Heavy Bolter

5 Man Veteran Squad-150
-Power Fist, Power Weapon, Heavy Bolter

5 Man Tactical Squad-115
-Melta Gun
Veteran Sergeant
-Power Weapon

5 Man Tactical Squad-115
-Melta Gun
Veteran Sergeant
-Power Weapon

Landspeeder Tornado-100
-Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter

Landspeeder Tornado-100
-Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter

10 Man Devastator Squad-235
-2 Lascannons

10 Man Devastator Squad-235
-2 Lascannons

10 Man Devastator Squad-235
-2 Lascannons

I'm not really sure what kind of tactics you're going for.  Looks like you're trying to make a firing-line army,but here goes.

I don't like Ezekiel for the points.  170 is too much to pay for an HQ without an Invulnerable save.  Yeah,he can use Force Barrier to save one wound a turn,but if he uses that,he can't pop models with his force weapon or shoot with the Hellfire psychic power.  His special Mind Worm power is borderline useless in most games,too,IMO.  If you really want a Librarian,I'd personally just throw out a generic one in Terminator armor.  Truthfully,an HQ with the Rites of Battle ability will be more useful,overall,since your army seems to be relying on a lot of 5-man combat squads.  But,if you really want a Libby,a Termie Libby will work out better,IMO,and save 25 points.

I'm not understanding why you've got 3 10-man Devy squads with 2 Lascannons each,which I'm assuming are going to be combat squadded up to make a total of 6 5-man units with Lascannons.  Drop one of the 10-man Devy squads,then buy the extra 5 marines and a Lascannon on each of the Tactical Squads.  You get the same amount of Lascannons,but you save 45 points since Lascannons only cost 20 points in Tac Squads and you're not having to buy the Vet. Sgt. in the 3rd Devy.  You also get the advantage of setting two of your Lascannons up during Troops setup,and free up a Heavy slot.  For added mobility in the army,you could also buy twin-linked Lascannon Razorbacks w/Extra Armor for the Combat squads for the same points cost as the "back half" with a Lascannon.

I don't really like having 3 Vet squads out there running around,either.  I'm not really feeling the PW/PF/HB combo in them,either.  They're too good in assault to waste sticking a heavy weapon in them.  I'd drop one of the squads,and drop the Heavy Bolter out of the other two.  Buy a twin-linked heavy bolter Razorback with Extra Armor for each of the other squads.  This will give the army some much needed mobility and the ability to claim objectives. 

If you've done all that,you should have about 105 points left over.  Here,I'd go with either another LS Tornado or a Predator Destructer with H.bolter sponsons to add more troop killing firepower.  You could also bump both Vet. Squads up to 6-men,add a second PF,and throw a Flamer into those squads,too.

If you want to use Ezekiel use that Assassin that lowers their leadership to 7 then try it, I am dying to make a Carnifex fall down and cry tears of bio-acid over the number of worlds he has helped digest.

you dont need to buy VT sgts of any kind in any DA army all units come with one or they cant have them

Posted By Franki on 05/07/2007 10:05 PM

and you're not having to buy the Vet. Sgt. in the 3rd Devy

you dont need to buy VT sgts of any kind in any DA army all units come with one or they cant have them

Every DA unit that contains a veteran sergeant pays the extra cost for it, whether the player wants it or not.  That lack of flexibility 's part of the reason that making DA lists is just about as boring as making Necron lists.

whats with the veteran squads with a power fist a power wpn and then a heavy bolter thats point less in my view i mean you cant fire the heavy bolter then charge you cant move them fire the heavy bolter so WHY?

Here is a rough idea of the better DA lists I have seen, they have all be variations of this concept.

HQ

Varies greatly, usually one with Rites of Battle will do you well. Or a CC one with a CC squad. Since you are not depending on Deathwing or Ravenwing, the masters arn't neccessary, and you will probably get more use out of a standard character because they are cheaper.

Elites

Either 8-man Veteran Squads in Drop Pods or cheap shotgun scouts in Drop Pod. One or two of these units.

Troops

2X 10-man Tactical w/ Lascannon, Meltagun, Powerfist in Razorback w/ Heavy Bolters

Fast Attack

Assault Squad for CC punch if you take a character to lead them.

Heavy

2x cheap Predator Distructors

10-man Devestator Squad w/ 4 Missle Launchers

The essential tactic of this list is a shooty one. Between the Ravorbacks and the Drop Pods, you have your own terrain on the table. The Razorbacks and the Predators can put out a ton of move-and-shoot fire power. The Lascannons and the Missle Launchers put down a pretty agressing gun-line. The other half of your tactical squad plays tank hunter or counter assalt and can use the razorbacks to get into a good possition. The scouts and/or veterans bring the Drop pod terrain with them to. The veterans are really good at absorbing most charges beacuase they are base 2 attacks and you can hide a pretty impressive array of CC attacks.

So you see you can put down a pretty decent combined arms army.

Posted By Franki on 05/08/2007 10:29 PM
whats with the veteran squads with a power fist a power wpn and then a heavy bolter thats point less in my view i mean you cant fire the heavy bolter then charge you cant move them fire the heavy bolter so WHY?

Franki- Please make an effort to use basic punctuation, capitalization, spelling and grammar in your posts. As they are now, you are largely going to be ignored, and if they are particularly bad, we'll just delete them.

-The Mgmt.

Exekiel was actually there to make everyone within 12 inches from him fearless... helps a lot when you're running 5 man squads.

 

The dev squads are there because I was not aware that normal DA marines could have lascannons... this of course could be an AB mistake.

The PF/PW/HB is there because for 4 out of 6 turns I don't plan on moving forward with them... they'll sit in the gunline, fire their heavy bolter, and when someone makes it to me, the run forward and attack..... having them without a heavy bolter makes them useless for 4 out of 6 turns. And razorbacks... like rhinos... are useless.

 

A pure gun line army will have massive problems with objective based missions, or even table quarters.

Razorbacks primary purpose is mobile terrain, 2 of them can form a nice wall and dictate how your enemy comes to you. While they are alive they can contribute a decent amount of firepower.

I think the error in your thinking towards the list is that it is better played as a combined arms list. You have to balance the elements of your force. Most competitive play these days does not favor armies with little to no mobility. Once an assault army hits your lines, it's over for you.

Yeah,really the only way a pure gunline army can win is to completely wipe out the opponent and move some units to the objectives at the end of the game.   Space Marines,and the new DA in particular,aren't well suited for this at all.   The only real armies I've seen have any success with this at all are Imperial Guard.

Trying to bunch a lot of units around Ezekial isn't a great idea,IMO.  First,you're not going to be able to make as effective a use of cover as you would normally,and second,any player packing ordinance weapons,like Guard and Chaos,will be sitting there licking their chops.  Giving the whole army Ld. 10 for less points is better than making 4-5 combat squads Fearless by bunching them up.

The problem with your tactic with the Veterans is that anybody with a decently balanced force and half a brain is going to use the ranged elements in his army to shoot up those squads before his assault units engage other targets.  He's also probably got ways of getting his assault troops there before turn 5,unless he's not too bright and trying to footslog them accross.   

uh huh so whats so important about grammer and propper spelling on a forum its not like its a letter to the queen or some other stupid figure head

Probably because people will either:

A. Not take you seriously

or

B. Just skip over your post

Nobody is the grammar Nazis, just an effort to make your posts legible, is always appreciated.

Posted By Franki on 05/12/2007 12:05 AM

Franki- Please make an effort to use basic punctuation, capitalization, spelling and grammar in your posts. As they are now, you are largely going to be ignored, and if they are particularly bad, we'll just delete them.

uh huh so whats so important about grammer and propper spelling on a forum its not like its a letter to the queen or some other stupid figure head

Franki, while we welcome your participation in the forums and your enthusiasm for the hobby, we are not particularly fond of badly constructed, hard to read, ungrammatical posts.  Most of your stuff is legible, but not capitalizing letters doesn't really save you any time, and it honestly makes your posts look and read like crap. 

Do you douse yourself in skunk oil and put a paper bag over your head before walking up to talk to someone you're attracted to?  No, because it would obviously be counterproductive.  Same theory applies to written communication.   If you make your posts annoying and unpleasant to read, the ideas contained in them will be taken less seriously, or potentially ignored altogether.  If that's what you want, then perhaps posting here is not the best use of your time.