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Gert, my units of Nurgle Daemons have barely any upgrades. The difference between a tooled-up squad and a naked one is +1 to advance and charge, and a bonus if you roll a 1 on morale.

It’s handy-but it’s not nearly the difference between a naked Devastator Squad and a tooled-up one.

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
The difference is that most of the people who trend towards "spamming the most powerful/lethal options" won't play Power but will trend towards points.

Got any evidence to back that up?

Literally any thread discussing Power v Points good enough for you?

Also, you've yet to actually say what makes PL desirable over Points.

And you have yet to actually say anything that is meaningfully true about PL over Points.

Granularity.

What’s the difference between 6 bare-bones Tac Marines and 10 Tac Marines with a Lascannon?

I hate myself for joining in on this thread and sincerely hope it gets locked soon, but I'll bite.

Why do you need to have 6 when the system is obviously based on a similar paradigm as AoS where you buy 5/10 bodies at once for a troop unit and not individual bodies?

Ultimately the PL system is designed around people actually getting themselves upgrades and not run barebones. I have no idea why you are so focused about a mythical 6 man barebones tac squad, but that is ultimately something you have to decide for yourself or discuss with your campaign manager on why they insist on you running it like that. It is quite obvious the PL system is not designed around people wanting to run weird numbers like 7 because it is the number of their Chaos God.

Also, points sadly do not cover everything or balance as many options are either useless, excessive, or would only be taken if they cost 0 points because they are "just there". I mean, just for tac squads there are so many options that you will most likely never pick or use in the current edition with their current datasheets because the options don't cost 0 points. It's one of the reasons I would rather have less and more focused options rather than gazillion and one options that trip over themselves and it becomes a mathematical formula to find the best pick of the season.

However, to make myself clear: I use points in Matched Play, and play around with PL in Crusade. For me that's the point with Crusade: To feth around and have fun with stuff you rarely get to use in Matched Play.

I've love to see a system akin to what they're trying with X-Wing using Power Level and an upgrade budget personally.

That system makes a lot more sense (though I think right now the consensus is that its poorly implemented as far as X-Wing goes).

It costs what, 4 guardsmens worth of points to buy a lascannon (20 pts, yeah?), but you don't get any additional survivability for that cost (i.e. you're not getting additional wounds/bodies), and the additional lethality is only situationally useful (if you're trying to kill termagants or aeldari guardians, the 4 guardsmen are a better points investment). I think its really hard to stat wargear correctly relative to models/units and I think thats probably a big source of many balance problems. Creating a separate wargear budget for unit upgrades would be a good way to alleviate that, and is - in a way - a much better way of implementing actual point granularity into the accounting system instead of simply shifting the decimal place over another point to the right.

this is a very basic problem of 40k

because there are many weapons that work against all targets, you always are going to take the univeral one that will do everything instead of a specialised one

a 5 model Squad, has the option between 1 Anti-Tank Gun and and 1 Anti-Infantry Gun
no Problems with Power Levels or genereic per unit point cost because on of the options is better
Now we add a 3rd weapon that is good against both and you are always going to take that one

this is were points in 40k came in, to give the illusion of choice again
because the univeral weapon will be the most expensive one and the player has the choice between the best loadout or the cheap loadout

This is the reason why we have points per weapon, to keep the illusion of choice
and also the reason why PL in 40k do not work, because 1 option is always better than all the others