Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The leadership for a unit of orcs is equal to the number of orcs in it (max 10). How is this affected by modifiers? Do the modifiers come on after you count up the number of orcs (or cap out at 10) or do they come before? More specificaly, if a 20 man unit of orcs loses 5 men in hand to hand and doesn't cause any wound in return, do they need to make a break check against leadership 10 (15 orcs - 5 wounds = 10) or do they check against leadership 5 (max leadership 10 - 5 wounds = 5)?

IIRC, Ork mobs of 11+ models are fearless so they wouldn't have to make a check.

More specificaly, if a 20 man unit of orcs loses 5 men in hand to hand and doesn't cause any wound in return, do they need to make a break check against leadership 10 (15 orcs - 5 wounds = 10) or do they check against leadership 5 (max leadership 10 - 5 wounds = 5)?

No test cause they are fearless. Instead you'd have to take 5 armor saves.

I agree with the above two posters, but would also add that in the case of 10 or less Orks, yes you get to use the Ld value equal to the number of Orks in the unit and then you add in any modifiers.

So if a squad of 10 Orks loses combat by two, they would be testing on a Ld of 8 (Ld10-2).

You only take armour saves when losing combat and fearless if you're outnumbered.

So if you're a group of 5 undivided CSM against 30 gaunts and you lose combat by 1, you'll take a test on a 9 with a reroll and probably not run.

If you're a squad of noisemarines, though, and lose by 1, you'll then take 7 armour saves because your 4 remaining guys are outnumbered 7 to 1. So.... it's WORSE to be fearless if you're outnumbered? Life sucks ><

Being outnumbered has no effect in 5th. The only thing that matters is wounds scored on either side.

Spellbound wrote:You only take armour saves when losing combat and fearless if you're outnumbered.

So if you're a group of 5 undivided CSM against 30 gaunts and you lose combat by 1, you'll take a test on a 9 with a reroll and probably not run.

If you're a squad of noisemarines, though, and lose by 1, you'll then take 7 armour saves because your 4 remaining guys are outnumbered 7 to 1. So.... it's WORSE to be fearless if you're outnumbered? Life sucks ><

Good 4th ed answer. In 5th it's based on the number of wounds you lose by.................

Spellbound wrote:You only take armour saves when losing combat and fearless if you're outnumbered.

So if you're a group of 5 undivided CSM against 30 gaunts and you lose combat by 1, you'll take a test on a 9 with a reroll and probably not run.

Im preaty sure you'd be taking the test against a 9-4=5 LD, which leaves you with a good chance of breaking and being run down.

If you're a squad of noisemarines, though, and lose by 1, you'll then take 7 armour saves because your 4 remaining guys are outnumbered 7 to 1.

For 4th, No Retreat never goes above 3 wounds

Guys,
Sorry to revive an old thread but I keep seeing reference to a fearless orc squad if over 10 models. I can not find anything refering to this in any of the GW FAQ's and I thought the BRB left any stat at 10 maxed. Where can I find an official ruling that states the orcs can have a leadership test over 10?

You won;t, as that is not how the rule works.

Mob Rule states that the Mob may use it's current size (in models) in place of their normal Ld value. So if you have 10 Orks in a mob they are at Ld10. It then explains that, if you have 11 or more they have Ld10 AND they are fearless.

Fishboy wrote:Guys,
Sorry to revive an old thread but I keep seeing reference to a fearless orc squad if over 10 models. I can not find anything refering to this in any of the GW FAQ's and I thought the BRB left any stat at 10 maxed. Where can I find an official ruling that states the orcs can have a leadership test over 10?

They can't, the LD is capped at 10.

Most Ork units who are 11 or more strong gain the Fearless USR, as per the codex. They still count as Ld 10 for anything that might need it.

Edit: Ninja'd by 9 Seconds.

Damn Vampires

So the fearless rule is in their Codex...Thanks that is exactly what I needed.

The Fearless Rule is actually in the BRB, the Mob Rule which lets them be Fearless is found in the Ork Codex

Semantics FTW!