Is this fair?

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**halo3uber**

In the rulebook, it says "What you see is what you get." So is it fair for my friend to change his Khorne Berzerkers into Nurgle Berzerkers? They lost Furious Charge and the mark of Khorne and gained FNP and the Mark of Nurgle. They still cost 21 points, get an extra attack for 2 weapons and another on the charge. He hasn't taken away the attack given by the Mark of Khorne, he conveniently "forgot". That's 4-freakin' attacks. Plus, he's one of the only two people who plays 40k so I can't exactly stop playing him, that would've been a 100+ dollar waste. So, is it fair?

**Gwar!**

That's called cheating. If he doesn't stop, don't play him.

**Uriels_Flame**

Recruit new players and make sure he can read the rulebook as it doesn't "forget" anything. Now GW, maybe they do . . .

**Mad Rabbit**

Yeah. That's straight up breaking the rules.
What you see is what you get means that the model's gear must reflect the upgrades you bought for it IN YOUR CODEX. Your friend is doing this the other way around, and it's absolutely illegal.
If he swapped out their bolt pistols for bolters and painted them in Nurgle colors, they could be plague marines. That is where WYSIWYG would come into play. But you can't model whatever you want and then expect WYSIWYG to back you up.

**halo3uber**

He he he. It's not like I can get that many people, though, it's a freaking expensive hobby. Hopefully I'll post pics of my WIP army, though I don't know how to do so...

Automatically Appended Next Post:
He painted them green and put baking soda in the paint to make 'em bumpy. The layer was uber thick and it looks like thick, nasty cake icing. Or other white stuff

Nurgle-y indeed.

**Gwar!**

So tell him to use them as Plauge Marines. He cant use them a Nurgle berserkers.

**Lordhat**

OR He can use them as "Nurgle" Berserkers, but he has to use the rules AS IS for berserkers.

In other words:
You cannot mix the rules for Plague Marines, Berserkers, Thousand Sons, Noise Marines, and Chaos Space Marines. Each is a completely separate entry and can only use the rules homogeneous to that particular entry.

However you can CALL them whatever you like and give them whatever paint job and aesthetic you please:

Nurgle Berserkers with pustules and ulcers, Khorne Plaguers with fresh manure still clinging to their ears, Tzeentch's Pretty Pretty shinies covered in suntan lotion and hot pants, whatever you like.

**nosferatu1001**

You asked this on warseer didnt you? If not it was a VERY similar posting.

The answer here is the same as over there: let him use "nurgle" bezerkers but they have the stats of normal bezerkers with no changes. It is most definitely not fair - unless you get to do a unit design of your own as well. Maybe Eldar with T8, 3 wounds each, and a 96" rangfe gun that hits and wounds on 2s at AP1 which removes the model from play (bypassing eternal warrior) regardless of vehicle or unit. Oh, the "2+" to hit and to wound is on 2 dice added together, just to make sure.

After all - that is as fair as giving all the advantages f 2 units to one and maiking them cheaper....

**LunaHound**

No its not fair no matter how many times you asked mr halo3uber

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/240022.page

If he want to use them as "count as berzerkers" thats fine.

Just dont mix the stats together and call it fair.

**Thunderjaw**

I personally would counter with Necrorks.... 6 point models that get a WBB roll and can teleport to any Battlewagon within 18"...

It's only fair ya know?

**dietrich**

That's outright cheating.

They either 'count as' Khorne Berzerkers, or 'count as' Plague Marines, or 'count as' CSM with the Icon of Nurgle (assuming he models someone to be carrying it).

I like Thunderjaw's idea. Necorks. Can I counter with Ork Marines? They're only 6 points, but get a 3+ armor save, BS 4, and for every 10 models in the mob can have a free flamer and multi-melta?

**sourclams**

I would go with Sistorks of Battle; 11 points, T4 with a 3+ armor save, and each one has a flamer or a meltagun.

**Thunderjaw**

I counter you both with Eldorks.... they are really good dancers, art critics and only slightly (unless upgraded x2 times) emo...

**Deffgob**

Halo, stop asking this. The answer isn't going to change. Your friend is outright cheating.
This would be the same as me taking a unit of 30 boyz and giving them deffguns because they're from the same codex and keeping them at 6 pnts/ model because they're boyz that just happen to have weapons from lootaz.
You have 3 choices here:
1. make your friend stop cheating
2. stop playing with him or
3. put up with his bulls--t
But asking over and over here will not solve the problem.

**halo3uber**

Alright, I've decided. I'm gonna follow my other friends' example, cut up a sprue, put it on my fist and FALCOLN PUNCH my buls@#$%y friend. Sprue fist FTW.

**Dracos**

WYSIWYG = I smash your models so they count as destroyed? Do I win?

Edit: Oh yeah, and all my models are metal, GL smashy smashy

**Mark_Autarch**

As far as rules go, he could play as a "plays as" model (just friendly games), in which they look like berzerkers but they are plague marines.

Additionally he could give his army a fluffy background where Nurgle and Khorne (unwittingly) work together and produced nurgle looking berzerkers... or berzerker looking nurglings... whatever, as long as the unit played as something in the codex. (i think with the proper fluffy explanation and unambiguous weapon patterning this would even be a tournament legal model).

The point is this occurence isn't so much a violation of "what you see is what you get" as it is a violation of "making up a unit that doesn't exist."

For the record, nurgle marines do have a close combat weapon, a pistol, and a bolter. So they get +1A for 2 close combat weapons and a boltgun's firing capability. This isn't the same as the berzerker's 2 base attacks, however (they also get an additional +1A from CCWs).
-Mark