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Posted By Toreador on 01/26/2007 5:21 PM
Vallejo is slowly losing me. From the chunky pigments to the squeeze tips flying off when least expected, they still are sub par. I have quite a few of the lighter colors that are chalky and worthless now.

Sounds like an ID 10 T error to me.

I haven't had any problems with the Vallejo paints yet, not even the metallics.  I'm not the best painter, though, so it may be fine for my skill level. 

I did have a nozzle come off once, but that was because I'd taken it off and didn't put it back in all the way. 

I also haven't had much problems with covering with the Vallejo paints, not like I did with some of the GW paints.  My above disclaimer applies (ie, not that good a painter), though.

Posted By Mannahnin on 01/27/2007 8:13 AM
I still mostly use GW. Good all-around, and the current pots are better than the old screw-tops. I still have active bottles of the OLD soft flip-top variety. Gods those were good. I don't know why they don't still use them and that formulation.

I still have about 6 or 7 active old flip-top bottles as well.  What annoyed me is that when GW went to the new bottles they made them smaller;  they actually hold less; a full 5 ml less.  The old bottles were 17.5 ml, the new are 12.5.  Of course, the price went up.

But, enough ranting, though.  I do like GW's paints.  I'll be interested to see what these new base/undercoats will be like.  I never had to worry about greens, blues, purples, browns, or metallics with GW paints.  Red and yellows or course are different (but that can be said of all paint brands I think).  So I'll be interested in seeing how useful these new paints are.

-Jmz

I've pretty much completely switched to Vallejo (both game and model color) and Reaper.I find the reaper colors to be more 'natural', while the vallejo 'pops' more (p's description of them being 'luxurious' is pretty good). I've had no problems dry-brushing with them, but then again, I'm not trying to win a golden demon or pay my rent with them.

I still like GW metallics and inks, but I've been drifting away from those as well.
I'm debating trying out P3, but I find I'm pretty happy with what I've got.

The fenris looks blueish.
I dunno, I think I may try another brand. I'm all GW ATM but I'g getting realy tired of it drying out in the bottle when it's been opened maybe once...
I like GW's metallics though...

Posted By Mannahnin on 01/27/2007 8:13 AM
 I don't know why they don't still use them and that formulation.

I beleive it was something to do with Coat D'Arms (the company that made that paint) not being able to mass-produce in large enough quantities.

Most of that range is still available through Coat D'Arms, though...

It looks like Coat D'Arms expanded their range too.  Unfortunately they only list 1 US distributor in California:  Brookhurst Hobbies, and they are no longer going to carry the Coat D'Arms brand.  Its a shame too because the pots are only $2.50 each, and for 18ml, that's darned good compared to GW's 12 ml for $3.

-Jmz

Vallejo provides 17ml per bottle and runs the same price (or cheaper) as GW's while having better bottles that don't suck and dry your paint up within a week of opening, and denser pigmentation. In fact it's their heavy pigmentation that makes it necessary to *thoroughly* mix up the paint. Regardless of the brand of paint one uses you should be using a palette and thinning the paint down to a milk-like consistency, which I find Vallejo excellent at.

Yes Dice Monkey, because I am the one that causes the top to pop off of a lightly squeezed paint pot. Also I cause grainy, chalky pigmentation in my paints. Valejo tends to have a consistency problem on their pigmentation. It can be a rather course grind in some of the paints that is hard to notice until you apply them to the model. Yes, I do thin them on a pallet before application, and no it isn't always noticed.

so yeah, user error on my part for buying them...

chill chill
I've posted a few times how I've had the same thing happen with my game colour paints (squeeze, and have the top fly off)
I prefer my GW paints for the most part, but I have the Game colour mega paint set as well, and will get these new GW paints (as well, if anyone in town carried them, I'd buy the P3 paints).
but, I very much dislike the Vallejo inks.
to each his own though.

I'm interested to see these new paints, I'll probably get some of the blue and grey ones for the IG guard I've been repainting...

Isn't foundation what you put on before you put make up on

I am all for paints that have a good consistency a good price and DON'T go dry or claggy after opening them.

I've yet to be pulled away from Testor's acrylics. GW has some metals I like, but that's about it.

Posted By H.B.M.C. on 01/26/2007 3:25 PM
I assume all these paints come with a standard 10-20% price rise across the entire range of paints?

And whilst Iyanden Darksun sounds cool, it doesn't tell us what colour it is.

BYE

Duuhh...it's the colour of progress!

Seriously though, more options is usually a good thing, but there are things I'd like to have seen before new paints. If the price increases it'll show that GW have learned nothing and Kirby was merely urinating in the wind with all that "forgot the basic skills" stuff.

I use GW and Vallejo. I'm not sure I'd say one is better than the other. In fact, I've begun using them pretty interchangeably.

GW paints do dry out... That can be a pain, but at the same time, I don't mind the paint being thick and pasty. I'm going to put it on a palette and water it down anyway. I'd rather it was too thick than too thin, cause there's no going back from too thin.

Vallejo also has its issues. The main one is how the paint dries in the cap or on the nozzle and clogs the tip. I've never had a nozzle pop off, but I have had one refuse to dispense paint, then suddenly BLORP and a huge puddle flies out. Some colors are also a bit stubborn about mixing, and either come out too thin, or as chunky paste.

None of this makes the paint unusable, it just takes a bit longer to get its consistency right... But I never expect paint to just be the right consistency right away. Even if it is, after 20 seconds on a palette it's not anymore. Keeping it where you want it takes maintenance one way or another.

Also, Vallejo metallics are worthless, while GWs are fine.

GW's paint pots are nice for painting large areas... For example, if I'm basecoating, it's nice to just dunk a big brush in there, water it down in the lid area, and slap it on.

Vallejo's bottles are nice because you can mix more reliably. When you can get relatively consistent drops, it's simple to just count out a ratio, and know it's going to be more or less identical every time you do it. With GW, you have to mix by eye, and if you're trying to match a color that's already dried, or has highlights or washes, or whatever, it's a losing proposition.

I for one am very excited to see how these paints behave.

I've always used Citadel colour and think they have some great qualities. I've only ever had a few pots dry out on me and thats mainly the old screww cap pot because i didn't seal it properly. I've never had any of the flip top style dry out, and I've never had a problem closing them either.

Having said that I'am very keen to try Vallejo also because they have a great range of colours. However I've also heard a lot of negative things about them also. I'd have to try them myself of course before I oculd make an opinion.

Ultimately there is no ideal "wonder" paint, it's al about how you work with the product and finding the best ones for you personally. Whether that be using brands 'neat' or mixing it with other companies paints. Choice is a good thing and I'm glad that after Kirbys many "we'll get back to the hobby" comments that the company has finally done so and has released this new range of paints (and not just new colours but a completely new product).

Vallejo paints take a little bit more work but the result is a smoother richer paintjob. Which is why I recommend them to painters who like to paint to a high standard, and GW paints to guys who just want to get their minis on the table as fast as possible. This isn't to say that you cannot achieve good results with GW paints. It is just my personel experience, and I am not the only one to share this sentiment, that you can get more out of Vallejo if you put in the effort. I still use both, along with reaper pro and recently some p3, because I like to use brands before judging them and I'm always seeking good paints.

These have caught my interest, if for no other reason than it's a basecoat specific formula.

Depends on the price for me. Sounds like a good idea - but I would have preferred it if they had fixed the problem by making their existing range cover properly rather than by bringing out a whole new range of paints!

Still, if its a completely different formulation (including clay or whatnot), and providing it actually does the job and doesn't dry up in 2 seconds flat, then I might be interested. At least in the yellow one. It strikes me that the rest of the colours are ones where I have no problem getting decent coverage with existing paints, so reformulating them seems a redundant step. I mean, who really has problems getting coverage with a dark brown colour, or a terracotta?

If (as is likely, given GW's history in this area) the prices will be higher than their existing pots, then I'm not initially enchanted.

I spoke to a staff member in a local GW (who i know personally as a decent sort and someone who genrally knows his stuff) and he assured me that these will be the same price as standard GW paint pots.

Lets hope he's right.

I'd be interested in the set when its released. Saves mixing up darker base coats and its a bonus if they have a new formula for stronger coverage.

I agree that some colours coat nicely as it is, but even with relatively gutsy colours like scorched brown i still make 2 coats to get even coverage.

Hrm, the lids on those pots look like they might be screw on to me, so they will likely not dry out quite as badly

Posted By Deathwing_Adam on 01/29/2007 7:47 AM
Hrm, the lids on those pots look like they might be screw on to me, so they will likely not dry out quite as badly

Uh, the heinously bad citadel paint pots *were* screw on. In fact, they were the same exact lids as now, just sans the flip top that allowed every single bottle I had dry out within a month or two as well as several that dried up within one week of opening them. On the other hand, I still have original flip tops of Citadel Colour (when they were made by Cote d'Arms) that are nearly 20 years old and still usable.