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I play 2 armoured together (1 plasma and 1 autocannon) or if I have the slots I stick them each on their own. They are very effective, atleast most of the time. I also play 3 scouts with 2 lascannons and 1 missle launcher as anti-tank. They usually die, but they can kill lots before they go.

Ailaros wrote:Is that worse than having your armored sentinels ignored because they don't pose a big enough threat?

I'm not expecting them to take the field on their own, but one or two armoured sentinels with autocannons (anti-infantry) suporting a squad of melta vets (anti-vehichle) in a chimera sounds like a viable strategy. That's 120 points of effective support if the vets run into trouble. Support is really what I'm looking for here, I just want to know if they are worth the 120 points or if I should be looking at a second Vet/Chimera squad.

People have mentioned taking a Vendetta slot instead, but I already have one of these (also with melta/flamer vets inside).

I just want to know if they are worth the 120 points or if I should be looking at a second Vet/Chimera squad.

Nope, not worth it. Definitely the second Vet/Chimera.

Sad but true.

actually, if you've got HS slots, I'd much rather take a basilisk than only 2 autocannons. If you don't, then we're still talking about hellhound territory, which would be much better for literally hosing down infantry.

Or rough riders.... you know you want to...

I tried rough riders when I collect Tallarn. Heavy bolter fodder.
For my Cadians I basically took 2-3 (depending on points limit) cheaped out basiliks and horde IG. Was the only IG army that I consistently won with.

Okay, I'm considering ignoring all advice from proffensionals just becuase the models are so keewwwl. I'll be sure to blame you if I lose though.

If you're looking for close range anti-infantry support of Melta Vets for ~120 points, you just described a hellhound to a T.

A cheaper alternative might be to go for a single armored sentinel with a heavy flamer. Run it up beside or behind the chimera. It can intercept incoming assault infantry, or if that isn't feasible in the situation, flame them after they assault the chimera, and possibly assault them to make sure they bother no one else for the rest of the game. They can also help protect the veterans from a retaliation charge by charging the threatening unit.

They can tie up marine and orc boyz squads pretty well because S8 powerfists just aren't that scary to the armored sentinel.
2/3 (chance of hitting) * 1/3 (chance of penetrating) * 1/3 (chance of destroying) = 2/27, or ~7% chance per attack that a powerfist will destroy the sentinel.

Actually, aren't orks only Str 3 if they are charged? So that 6's to glance even with a Power Klaw.

Ailaros wrote:Is that worse than having your armored sentinels ignored because they don't pose a big enough threat?

erm, isnt having them ignored by the enemy a good thing?

EDIT: i've caught up and can add to the topic, i love the sentinel models, (But the legs were annoying to assemble) and in the few games i've played with my IG, my lone armored sentinel has performed amazingly, albeit because my Executioner has drawn a lot of fire.

on one occasion, my sentinel immobilized an ork battlewagon with it's lascannon, lost the weapon to return fire, than ran around to the rear and proceded to kick the larger vehicle to death

Emperors Faithful wrote:Actually, aren't orks only Str 3 if they are charged? So that 6's to glance even with a Power Klaw.

In a squad of Boyz, only the Nob can get a Power Klaw - and Nobs are Strength 4, base. Meaning Strength 8/9 Klaws.

Yeah probably best to avoid nobz with PK if you are planning to assault.

If you are planning to assault with sentinels you have to be a real bully boy and pick someone who can't hurt you back

SpankHammer III wrote:
If you are planning to assault with sentinels you have to be a real bully boy and pick someone who can't hurt you back

I'll try to make this a habit.

SpankHammer III wrote:Yeah probably best to avoid nobz with PK if you are planning to assault.

If you are planning to assault with sentinels you have to be a real bully boy and pick someone who can't hurt you back

As I just illustrated, however, a nob has a roughly 21% chance per assault phase to kill a sentinel. It will probably happen if the combat goes long enough, but but it's low enough that it gives you some options.

I'm not going to argue with the math (mine is just not that good and your probably right)

the nob doesn't need to destroy you though, if you get imobilised he's then hitting on your back of 10, admitedly that means you've got them tied for at least 1 more round of CC but given that there are effectively two rounds of CC in each turn your sent's ain't going to last that long. Plus with only one attack per turn sentinels are hardly CC based.

I love them I really do, i've ignored numerous people who have told me to ditch them (partly because I have them but mostly because I like the look) and yeah your right CC is an option, what i'm saying is it should be the last option unless your fighting someone who can't hurt you.

I had a pair tie up a large squad necron warriors for 3 turns (would have been longer but the game ended) thats the kind of assault you want them in.

If the weapons been blown off or the nob is about to assault your Lehman Russ or something you want to keep alive then sure assault the nob with PK.

SpankHammer III wrote:I'm not going to argue with the math (mine is just not that good and your probably right)

the nob doesn't need to destroy you though, if you get imobilised he's then hitting on your back of 10, admitedly that means you've got them tied for at least 1 more round of CC but given that there are effectively two rounds of CC in each turn your sent's ain't going to last that long. Plus with only one attack per turn sentinels are hardly CC based.

I love them I really do, i've ignored numerous people who have told me to ditch them (partly because I have them but mostly because I like the look) and yeah your right CC is an option, what i'm saying is it should be the last option unless your fighting someone who can't hurt you.

I had a pair tie up a large squad necron warriors for 3 turns (would have been longer but the game ended) thats the kind of assault you want them in.

If the weapons been blown off or the nob is about to assault your Lehman Russ or something you want to keep alive then sure assault the nob with PK.

Agreed, sentinels are fire-support walkers at heart, but if needed, they can make a noble sacrifice in order to buy other units some time, and if your lucky he might just take that nob with him!

You're right, there are various results that can happen that will make a sentinel easier to destroy. However, you're not looking for a sentinel to win any combats, you just want them to tie nasty stuff up. Armored sentinel v. Bloodcrushers is pretty much the best you can hope for.

I have three armored sentinels, the older metal composite ones, actually. Got them a few months before the new kits hit

While they came with Lascanons, I did magnetize them and have since been experimenting with ML's on them. This has worked out pretty well. Those 9 shots are a reliable doer of damage to many things. By and by, one of the nice things about the Spearhead expansion is that it makes Sentinels a lot better, as they can now run and shoot. I wish they could do that all the time! Another thing on the ol' wish list is that an armored sentinel could cary a heavy bolter or stubber (for no more points). This would help offset the loss of special rules from the scout sentinel and would be in keeping with the fluff that heavy sentinels have reinforced chassis to mount more firepower.

Yeah, perhaps if you could take a 2x HB armored sentinel with a stubber (which would still be more expensive and can't transport like a chimera), I would consider taking one.

Otherwise, they don't do enough damage for their points unless you get a lucky lascannon hit against a vehicle, or outflank a scout sentinel with a heavy flamer into something.

Wait. Immobilised walkers are hit on the rear armour in CC? This is news to me.

Yup if memory serves, the hitting front armour is due to walkers increased mobility, but if they are imobile goodbye AV12 hello AV10.

I'm unfortunatley 100miles from my BRB at the moment so you might want to double check that.

Twinlinked HB on an armored sent would be cool, like I said earlier the sentinels (especially the amrored) need to have something added.

@Ruckdog - didn't know that about spearhead, haven't really studdied the rules properly. Run and shoot thats what i'm talking about make that fast attack option "fast"

No to hit is still the same, against the Front AV. Immobilised (and stunned) walkers attack with one less than normal (to a min of 1). Grenades against Immobilised vehichles are made against the WS, not the usual 6+.
So they're not too bad in combat in fact.

my bad

well don't know if that qualifies them as not too bad, just better than I thought

No probs, actually the whole Stunned-means-Walker suffer -1 attack is actually pretty interesting. This wouuld have helped. A lot. Damn you Dreadnought!

I use my sentinels in a screen role place them as front line depending what your facin they may die fast but as a screen i use those powerful weapons to pick off any tough enemy beasties so in the right niche they have a purpose

With the ambush spearhead, you actually can negate the advantage of having outflanking sentinels by the aforementioned spearhead on armoured sentinels, letting them get up close and personal near side armour/rear armour.

Assuming your opponent has even heard of Spearhead, is willing to play it, and generally cares about effectiveness in casual games.

I think that armored sentinels would on the whole be a more attractive option (in their current form) if the pricing was amended.

I mean how did they come up with that pricing?

the armored sentinel is 20 pts more than a sct. I think they should be 10 points cheaper than they currently are and heres why, Extra armor is a 10pts upgrade! I know that it also gets 12 front armor but it looses move through cover and scout rules that seems like an even trade to me.

Also the AC should be a free upgrade and all the weapons option 5pt cheaper. On a chimera a multilaser for a hvy bolter is a free trade and in an HWT an AC costs the same as a heavy bolter. That suggests to me that GW values them the same. I don't really have anythig to back up the 5pt reduction on the others except that if they did, coupled with a basic price reduction, you could get a squadron with Plasma cannons for 180 points, now that more tempting.

I think everyone is missing one very pertinent point here, sentinels are readily available and relatively cheap ($price wise).

Not everyone has the money to buy 3 $83 hellhounds or $103 Valks, now people are gunna say this isnt a tactical problem, maby not, but it illustrates a logistical problem whic is that sentinels are just easyer to field, not every commander is going to have access to valk squadrons.

in stead of saying they (or any other unit) is worse at something than another is counter productive, especialy when the 2 units are very different. personaly i think that its not somuch the unit as how you use it.

as for me, Armoured sents work for me, they tie up big squads of cc nastyness and tote heavy weapons to boot, they are quite effective at screening other units, taking out light armour and light-medium infantry, they are also very good at running around the sides of the table and harrasing flanks or supporting infantry advances.

Neither hell hounds, valks or blob squads can do all of these. i think that realy the sentinels are an all-rounder in a codex that is built around speciality.


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EDIT: all prices in $AUD

Lord Commander Phyrus wrote:I think everyone is missing one very pertinent point here, sentinels are readily available and relatively cheap ($price wise).

Not everyone has the money to buy 3 $83 hellhounds or $103 Valks, now people are gunna say this isnt a tactical problem, maby not, but it illustrates a logistical problem whic is that sentinels are just easyer to field, not every commander is going to have access to valk squadrons.

in stead of saying they (or any other unit) is worse at something than another is counter productive, especialy when the 2 units are very different. personaly i think that its not somuch the unit as how you use it.

as for me, Armoured sents work for me, they tie up big squads of cc nastyness and tote heavy weapons to boot, they are quite effective at screening other units, taking out light armour and light-medium infantry, they are also very good at running around the sides of the table and harrasing flanks or supporting infantry advances.

Neither hell hounds, valks or blob squads can do all of these. i think that realy the sentinels are an all-rounder in a codex that is built around speciality.


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EDIT: all prices in $AUD

You know, i've never thought of it like that, when we purchase models, we are Commanders placing a requisition order for more equipment, using what resources and favor we can scrounge just to get their attention, and suddenly games workshop becomes a horrible hybrid of the Administrum and the Machine cult, which explains their secrecy about new releases and the price rises: we lowly field commanders should feel blessed with what they in their infinite wisdom have already provided and shouldn't pry into matters of the Machine God.

Kommissar Kel wrote:A. Sentinels have 2 roles:

1) Toting Plasma Cannons. They are one of the few ways to get Plasma Canons and a Squad of 3 is 35 points more than the cost of a bare executioner(therefore not as good of a choice). But is you are already fielding all 3 heavy support choices.

2) Keep them cheap and use them to bully squads that cannot hurt them. leave them with the multilaser and move in to assault week troop squads of sniper squads. those squads will likely not be able to hurt them in CC and therefore you use your 55 points to tie up however many points of enemy squad for the rest of the game.

Point 2 is extremely valid! Front Armour 12 means that infantry without melta bombs, krak grenades or power fists are going to have a nightmare getting past your sentinels. I've used them a few time with the sole intention of tying up the enmy forces. If you take Chaos terminators as a example... they are standard issue with power weapons, st 4, 30 pts each basic. Up to ten... 300pts, maybe more with a different loadout. If that loadout doesn't include powerfists then Sentinels will tie them in knots for the whole game! Yeah you may sacrifice your sentinels to being locked in combat but they won't die, a few terminators will!