Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

It took smashing him with a moon to kill Chewbacca.

 Psienesis wrote:
It took smashing him with a moon to kill Chewbacca.

Hairy bastards puts SM's to shame.

 Psienesis wrote:

 Shlazaor wrote:


1. Xenos are aliens.

2. Someone is having trouble separating himself from his miniature game...

Word.

I think a point that a lot of people are missing is that, despite the terrors of the Xeno and the Warp-born, the greatest threats that Humanity has faced (in M41, M30, or even further back in its history) have all been wrought by human hands. Neither the Warp nor the Xeno are half as capable of inflicting evils upon Humanity as Humanity itself is.

In my DH games, while wiping out Xeno or Heretic enclaves may be the required job of the Inquisition and its servants, I make sure to illustrate the human cost of consigning people to death who just wanted to live differently than society/the law demanded.

So... no. "Guilt-free sadism" is not why I like Xenos. Not at all.

Truth.

I find it QUITE hard to empathize with mankind as portrayed in wh40k, actually. Other that being bilaterally symmetrical, carbon based creatures of the Homo Sapiens Sapiens genus, the humans in 40k are as alien to me as any other "xenos" race in the game. The Imperium's core values are essentially not too different to those of a Kalashnikov-toting AlQaeda militant. And let's not get started with Chaos...

Don't get me wrong, there's a bit to love in every army. Orks are fun and carefree, Eldar are tragic and noble, Necrons are powerful, wise and analytical, Tau are idealistic and hopeful... And of course there's plenty to like in the armies of the Imperium, too: Courageous, determined and willing to selflessly sacrifice themselves for the survival of the species. But at the same time, every army has a crucial flaw written in, a dark side that sometimes even manages to outweight any positive atributes they may have. Orks are dumb, brutal and destructive (even self-destructive!), Eldar are isolationist xenophobes, not to mention guilty of the birth of Slaanesh, Necrons are dead to all effects, a stagnant society which ultimately turns to evil, while the Tau are arrogant imperialists that may have sacrificed their freedom in order to prosper... At some point, all armies fail to become the consequence-free teenage power fantasy they promise to be. Not even the Imperium. As Psiensis put it, mankind, in this setting, pretty much surpasses every other faction in evil and downright brutality towards its own species.

In all, probably "Guilt-free sadism" wasn't out of the picture when the 40k setting took form, but being such a dystopian, hopeless and nihilistic setting, it's hard to think of it as anything but indiscriminate, free-for-all sadism.

^
My thoughts exactly!

@Agent_Tremolo

Nothing wrong with Humans being Humans. One of the biggest fallacies IMO is the belief that advanced civilizations are inherently peaceful and open-minded. This is absolutely incorrect. The Spanish were in many ways more advanced than the native South Americans...look how that ended. No matter what, Humans will always fear the unknown. It's built into us, whether by evolution or our own arrogant belief in our superiority (not completely unfounded though), whether it's IRL or in 40k. Say what you will about the Imperium, but something similar would most likely rise in our collective futures IRL as we advance into space.

 Shlazaor wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
It took smashing him with a moon to kill Chewbacca.

Hairy bastards puts SM's to shame.

... and Harrison Ford (slightly NSFW):

I had something intelligent to say about this topic.

It's gone now.

I too had something intelligent to say, but then I saw Psienesis and Agent_Tremolo posts and I decided not to bother at all.

The Imperium's core values are essentially not too different to those of a Kalashnikov-toting AlQaeda militant. And let's not get started with Chaos...

and what of chaos.....

First two rules of Chaos Club.... you don't talk about Chaos Club.