Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The Waaagh spell says that war machine crew will leave their machines.

In the new rules, crew cannot leave their machines. I didn't see this in the errata. Would the war machine itself move 2d6 forward then?

No, it means that the crew will leave their war machines.

Specific > General.

In the new rules the "crew" don't even exist. There is simply a war machine with a combined profile, and some models standing beside it that are for all intents and purposes just scenery (and wound markers). It's very specific that the crew are not actually models on the table. The actual war machine itself is it. There's no actual "crew" to move away from the machine and operate independently.

Actually it is specific that the crew are models that can be ignored for a lot of purposes.

The crew still exist and can be compelled to move by Waagh!

nosferatu1001 wrote:Actually it is specific that the crew are models that can be ignored for a lot of purposes.

The crew still exist and can be compelled to move by Waagh!

A hotly debated point. To the OP, suggest clarifying it with your opponent before playing, and awaiting an FAQ.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/304604.page

Page 108 clearly states the crew cannot be affected separately from their war machine.

No waagh, unless the machine comes.

And yet the WAAAGH! rule specifies that the crew CAN be affected. So they are.

Are people not getting specific > general? Until errated the SPECIFIC waaagh! rule, which only affects O&G, overrides the general BRB rule on warmachine and the crew.

You are told the crew will leave their machine and move off. Until and errata that is exactly what happens.

So, the machine's wound markers move off. Will this in any way affect the machine? I do not have the O&G rules with me right now. As far as memory serves, the crew will still be ignored for gaming purposes, and the crewless machine will still fire

Let's see the facts.

1. The Ork book says that the unit moves 2D6" forward, with a note that warmachine crews will abandon their machines.
2. Warmachine crews can't abandon their machines anymore. That mechanic has been discontinued.

The only sensible thing is to make the warmachine move 2D6" forward, and if it contacts an enemy unit, count it as charging even though it's normally not allowed, and treat the abandonment comment as fluff stating that the crews will "abandon" their warmachines and rush forward, rather than do the sensible thing and fire from a distance.

Or do the Orks have move and shoot warmachines from the amendments?

solkan wrote:Let's see the facts.

1. The Ork book says that the unit moves 2D6" forward, with a note that warmachine crews will abandon their machines.
2. Warmachine crews can't abandon their machines anymore. That mechanic has been discontinued.

The only sensible thing is to make the warmachine move 2D6" forward, and if it contacts an enemy unit, count it as charging even though it's normally not allowed, and treat the abandonment comment as fluff stating that the crews will "abandon" their warmachines and rush forward, rather than do the sensible thing and fire from a distance.

Or do the Orks have move and shoot warmachines from the amendments?

War Machines have the Move or Fire rule now... perhaps that helps my argument. The Machine Moves with the Crew, but cannot shoot.

Right I think that is the sensible way to play it.

Just curious, but does the BRB o O&G Rule book include a rule or any language hinting at the ability to re-crew a war machine in this edition? If not, i would not think it unreasonable to conclude the following: If your War Machine Crew are forced to leave the war machine under the effects of the Waaagh Spell, then due to the fact there is no rule written to expressly allow them to re-crew the war machine then the machine is effectively useless.

Thoughts?

The crew are just wound markers, who cares if they walk away!

frawd wrote:Just curious, but does the BRB o O&G Rule book include a rule or any language hinting at the ability to re-crew a war machine in this edition? If not, i would not think it unreasonable to conclude the following: If your War Machine Crew are forced to leave the war machine under the effects of the Waaagh Spell, then due to the fact there is no rule written to expressly allow them to re-crew the war machine then the machine is effectively useless.

Thoughts?

The Empire and Dwarf FAQ have explicitly removed the previous rules that allowed additional crew/interchangeable crew, so re-crewing would also seem to be inappropriate, but the role of crew isn't completely clear (threads passim).

I suppose there are several fudges:

1) Allow the crew to drag their machine when they Waaagh. (This assumes the no abandoning machines rule > O&G army book)
2) Allow the crew to move and return to their specific machine, meaning the machine is useless until they return, but that they can return. If the machine is attacked, it is auto-destroyed. If the crew are all killed, the machine is destroyed. (The crew do have enough profile information to allow this- this is RAW and meets with the principle specific army book > BRB).
3) Destroy the machine when the crew run away. (But this seems odd, as they can't otherwise be targeted).

Probably a house rule of 1 or 2 would be reasonable whilst we await an FAQ. Though I've argued differently elsewhere, in this case I'd go with 2.

Don't get me wrong, my point was an absurd nuance, and if someone decided to be a staunch RAW player, they could cause a lot of consternation with it.

Doc i agree with you that house rules make the most sense to get around it.

I like your first rule, fits with the O&G persona in a way.

Note this was FAQ'ed, Waagh doesn't affect war machines now.

Killjoy00 wrote:Note this was FAQ'ed, Waagh doesn't affect war machines now.

You're gonna scour all the old threads and do the FAQ thing arent you. Honestly i'd have more trust in people... on second thought go right ahead.

Well, I did this one because I started the thread and I did wizards who are level 0 aren't wizards because I thought the prevailing wisdom was wrong.

There were a couple of others I searched for, but lost interest. Especially the one where I was semi-arguing against step up for characters in different I spots

Oh good i was starting to get worried about you'r free time and its potential wasting.

Well, the amount of time I've spent in that damned minimum dispel thread is a much greater cause for worry.

I just didn't want people to pull up an older thread and get a wrong answer.

Valid. I was thinking of doing that to the old Bret thread, but it was a little *too* old. So I posted in this subforum even though there wasn't really a call to be made any more.

Glad to see they finally cleared that up with FAQ .

I appreciate this being cleared up with the FAQ... way to go, GW! They're got more sense than we give them credit for . Well done on the fantasy rules all around thus far!!