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I'm finding it harder and harder to win games against IG and the newer marine codices. Like the Wehrmacht after Kursk, I'm still capable of surprising the enemy, but I also depend a lot more on luck--like the other day when my opponent's two Storm Ravens failed to dodge deff rolla attacks.

Interesting choice of comparison... but I don't think so. Nobs are still baller.

I think they are one of the better books out there. The only rule with orks I find is that you HAVE to do one of 2 things. Go all armor or no armor at all. But other then that your good to go.

I really like the book since there isnt anything that is really "weak" EVERYTHING has a useful place in the book. Even the very few options that people dont take very often are still pretty good.

Yeah, I always find that my boyz work fine. I guess it just depends on how lucky you are in games or how good your opponent is.
How experienced generally are your opponents?

So what magic use have you been able to get out of your Looted Wagons and Flash Gitz, Pride?

Orks are a rock army, like Vulkan Raiders or Seerdar.

Maybe your opponents are getting better? Or just getting used to your playstyle, maybe its time to switch it up.

MagicJuggler wrote:So what magic use have you been able to get out of your Looted Wagons and Flash Gitz, Pride?

Orks are a rock army, like Vulkan Raiders or Seerdar.

Looted Wagons can be awesome if used right. Gitz? Well.......
So Looted Wagons are cool.

I think the issue facing the Ork codex is not that our units are not still awesome and cutting edge (they are) but that our tactics are well known. You can't run Nob biker with any chance of success because your opponent knows what you're going to do, and how to beat it. Because of how many Ork players there are out there, they've become one of the best known 'opposition' dexes.

Honestly, I've fallen into the trap of running out the same tired strategems. When I take boyz, I take them 1 of maybe 4 ways- but they could be built in other directions. A squad of 30 could provide cover to lootas, and throw out 9 Str 5 shots as well, with no need of a nob. I can't imagine a list where this would be effective right off hand, but I think we Orks need to step up the kunning part of our strategies.

Stelek wrote an article where he championed running all grots- to me this sounded like insanity, and it still seems like something I would not do. But the principles he talked about, of building Orks as a blend of threats with no clear focus, seems like something I haven't done before. Which means my opponents haven't learned to counter it. Change it up, mix and match your forces and try new things. When they learn your current tricks, find something else.

If we fight the same way we've always fought, with brutal kunning, we will lose. We're no longer the biggest boyz in the yard. Now we have to fight dirty, with Kunning brutality. Turn from Mork (or possibly Gork) to Gork (or possibly Mork).

The ork codex is alright, but you have to understand that they thrive in lower point games and in medium to low-end skill levels (more casual play). High end players and high end lists can make them work, but it's much easier to run into codexes and lists that have problems the orks don't have a good answer for and that can exploit the ork weaknesses.

This happens to every new codex that comes out. They have some new toys that no one knows how to deal with, and they win a lot of games. Then people get wise, and the win:loss ratio returns to normal.

Orks are still very good the problem is, as stated before, people have learned how to deal with them. Keep in mind the new marine dexes and IG are imho the most powerful and efficient codexes out there.

Me I like to run bikersand koptas, enmasse with snikrot and 10 kommandos with 2 burnas. The thought of a 10 man ork squad with 2 flamers or 2 power weps being able to assault anything within 12" of the board edge makes them scrunch toward the middle more.
Now I have the upper hand, they're closer to me and each other, discouraging blast weapons and giving me a chance to multi assault.

That's my 2 cents anyway.

They've been around long enough that people know their tricks. It's still an excellent codex though. However, I haven't played them much lately since I've gotten bored of my Orks - it fills me with shame and sadness to say that.

MagicJuggler wrote:So what magic use have you been able to get out of your Looted Wagons and Flash Gitz, Pride?

Orks are a rock army, like Vulkan Raiders or Seerdar.

Like I said before. Orks are best when taken to the extreme. A single looted wagon with boomgun(which is really the only reason to take a looted wageon)A single one is trash. But take 3 and well you have a powerful shooting force for dirt cheap. I have ran many times 3 looted wagons along with trukk boys and other goodies. They work out great. Yes there silly rule is lame but really it only happens about once a game per tank IF even that. I have gone many games were it never came up. Use them just like a russ and they are beastly. The key is you have to take 3.


Flash gits as well. They cost an arm and a leg. but 4+ armor with fnp. Give them the upgrade that makes there gun assault 2. They will drop really anything. Plus with a good roll can be great anti termi unit.

I took my three wagons and 3x10 lootas against 9 oblits, double termicide, and two land raiders last night (1750) and I can tell you that I was thrilled to get a draw in Dow/KP. AV14 and 2+ give my greenskins a hard time.

Funny that you say that, because I've heard guard players complain that their codex feels weaker too(lol). Its just that people have learned their tricks as well. Change up you usual tactics for once, and you should do better.

Orks are still punchy, but there's been six codices released since it came out, placing it firmly in the middle of the cycle. There is pretty constant codex creep, if only because lower priced models mean more models sold. Couple that with later books have some very solid anti-ork weapons included as no brianers (Heavy flamers on chimeras, SW countercharge, BA FNP/FC), and the fact that as stated people figured out how to play with as well as against them... well, Orks are like a football team running the wildcat. It's not bad, it's just not going to surprise anybody anymore.

Let's also not forget: Orks were easily the best Codex between when it came out and 5th edition, and I'd argue even until the release of Codex:IG. It was only going to get weaker as time goes on.

Gorskar.da.Lost wrote:

MagicJuggler wrote:So what magic use have you been able to get out of your Looted Wagons and Flash Gitz, Pride?

Orks are a rock army, like Vulkan Raiders or Seerdar.

Looted Wagons can be awesome if used right. Gitz? Well.......
So Looted Wagons are cool.

Battlewagons can be at least ten times more awesome in any situation for only 45pts more. It also works on every turn. And it has battle in its name.


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Oh and the best peice of advice I have i gear your orks towards shooting.

Take care of pennies and pounds take care of themselves.

Thoughdon't take flash gitz as lootas are brilliant.

I agree with Skarboy. Orks are naturally very good at the low end of the point scale but as they move up in size the army begins to lose its major advantages as other dexes can take things like the Land Raider, LR-X, and massed Flamer vets in Chimeras which are practically designed to counter most ork units/combos.

Eyclonus wrote:I agree with Skarboy. Orks are naturally very good at the low end of the point scale but as they move up in size the army begins to lose its major advantages as other dexes can take things like the Land Raider, LR-X, and massed Flamer vets in Chimeras which are practically designed to counter most ork units/combos.

Totally agree. Point for point in increments of 500 I can actually see a friends win/draw/loss ratio change dramatically.

They do still possess one of the strongest codex's. Switch it up and always go dramatic.