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Alright, so I have around 90 normal guardsmen, 2 autocannons, 2 lascannons, 2 HBs, and 3 command squads outfitted with fairly (sniper isn't) CC outfitting. Furthermore, I have 1 Basilisk, 2 LRBTs (HB sponsons and lascannon), 1 LR punisher (HB sponsons and, for some strange reason, a lascannon), and a vanquisher w/ Pask and a lascannon. Don't complain about the punisher and/or vanquisher; they're dried, so there is nothing I can do.

Concerning the not tanks more, what ideas could y'all give me about what to do with them? Power blob? Heavy weapons platoon? Change 'em to vets and stick 'em in chimeras?

Thanks.

90 regular guardsmen gives you most of what you need for a proper infantry list (or all at low points). You can do mech or something if you like the style better, but I'd at least try out a foot-heavy list.

In your case, I'd take the 2 LRBT's and either the basilisk or the.... actually, both other tanks are crap. Take them for the AV14 if you want more AV14 out on the field.

For the rest, it depends on how you want to play it. If you want to keep your tanks back, then keep your infantry back as a static gunline. Of course, you will lose a lot of games this way. Otherwise, if you want to have infantry advancing behind an armored curtain, you just need to figure out if you want to be shootier or choppier. Shootier will focus on blobs with melta or plasma with a high officer:men ratio (to use PCSs as special weapons boats), and with some SWS thrown in. Choppier blobs will want to put more into PISs with power weapons, and possibly some other choppy elements like priests.

That and, depending on how you like it, you may want to include some more mobile elements, like al'rahem or other outflankers/deepstrikers.

Ailaros wrote:For the rest, it depends on how you want to play it. If you want to keep your tanks back, then keep your infantry back as a static gunline. Of course, you will lose a lot of games this way. Otherwise, if you want to have infantry advancing behind an armored curtain, you just need to figure out if you want to be shootier or choppier. Shootier will focus on blobs with melta or plasma with a high officer:men ratio (to use PCSs as special weapons boats), and with some SWS thrown in. Choppier blobs will want to put more into PISs with power weapons, and possibly some other choppy elements like priests.

Would you then suggest the blob behind armor? And, if so, is it acceptable that I have sponsons on most of my tanks? (And is choppier/shootier better?)

I seriously recommend the gunline tactic. I always play like that, only changing my tactic in campaigns os something like that. But the rest of the time I use Static Gunline tactic, and it works out perfect. Just focus on long range, and keep the basilisk in.

IMHO shootier is better. fluffwise, it doesn't seem logical to me if you use Guard as a close combat army. But that depends on you, and your play style.

With the gunline tactic, how does one distribute heavy weapons (and what kinds does one distribute)?

The problem with static gunlines is that it only works against noobs, or in high-points tournaments where time is a concern and alpha strike armies get a free leg-up. Against veteran opponents who actually know how to use mobility (or are otherwise good at list building), your alpha strike potential will be largely wasted, which means you will have to rely on your beta-strike power, which you won't have (because you spent all the points on long-ranged guns).

As far as mobile guard are concerned, I've run with a mix of shooty and choppy. Honestly, over time I've found myself including fewer shooty elements as once close combat starts, the guns of shooty units dont' get to shoot (whether they're actually locked in the close combat or not). Of course, this has been exacerbated by me desiring to get into close combat with my choppier elements, but you're going to find yourself in close combat against most opponents anyways.

As such, I've been phasing out shooty units (I originally had 3 HTWs and 3 SWSs, and now I'm down to just 1 or 0 SWSs, depending on the list, with my PCSs doing most of the heavy lifting as far as shooting is concerned. Power blobs with a priest are capable of handling so much, that shooting tends to be relegated against things that power blobs will struggle against (like wraithlord).

Of course, this has been just my experience over time. If you can figure out how to make a shooty blob strategy work, I'd like to see it.

prussia59 wrote:With the gunline tactic, how does one distribute heavy weapons (and what kinds does one distribute)?

As many as you can, all over the place. Missile launchers and autocannons are decent in the PIS, as you can buy one model a vox, combine 2-3 squads up, buy a Commisar and suddenly you have a stubborn, 30-man squad with 3 heavy weapons and Ld9 with a re-roll on orders. Lascannons on dedicted HWTs, and meltaguns on dedicated SWSs.

The fact is that, with a gunline army, you are sacrificing your own mobility yes, but you should be able to put so many heavy weapons on the table that your opponents mobility is as strictly limited as your own; as nowhere he moves to will be safe. Not to mention that this is a rather fluffy way to play IG...

For help on what tanks to take, check out my Leman Russ thread.

L. Wrex

Ailaros wrote:The problem with static gunlines is that it only works against noobs,

that's not always the case.I've beaten many worthy gamers with a gunline army. Including tyranids. You have tomake sure that you have SOMETHING to counter in close combat.

deploy as far as you can to the front of yout deployment zone. When the enemy gets close, move to the back, this can buy you another turn shooting at th enemy. some units will fail their leaderships and, in this case when you move back, being close to the board edge, they will risk running of the field. Banners will make a deal.

Howabout artillery? Could one conceivably not take tanks but rely on manpower to advance and get stuck in while artillery get to use their massive ranges to pound the enemy and soften them up?

meh

while youmove up you're infantry to the enemy, You risk hitting your own men after a while.
Trust me, one can not resist the urge to fire a realy big artillery piece at an unoccupied enemy unit, even as there is a friendly unit 3 inch away from the blast. That kind of things can throw your hope of winning away.

that's how I think of it. But Ailaros will certainly say otherwise. as he always does.

Scrazza wrote:deploy as far as you can to the front of yout deployment zone. When the enemy gets close, move to the back, this can buy you another turn shooting at th enemy.

...shooting those infantry heavy weapons while retreating much?

prussia59 wrote:Howabout artillery?

Artillery+infantry lists are fine. It relies on the idea that you're probably only going to get a couple turns of shooting with artillery anyways, so you getting stuck in isnt' as big of a deal. Plus, artillery can engage certain specific blob-counters before the blobs make it in range.

Scrazza wrote:Trust me, one can not resist the urge to fire a realy big artillery piece at an unoccupied enemy unit, even as there is a friendly unit 3 inch away from the blast. That kind of things can throw your hope of winning away.

Damn straight, blood conquers all!

That's the beauty of infantry lists. If you do danger close artillery fire and cream some of your own guys, you know that you're always going to be doing more damage to your opponent than you're doing to yourself.

I mean, why would you bring 30-man blobs if you weren't expecting to take a couple of casualties?

man, I like the idea of an infantry based Guard army, i play it myself.

Ailaros, about the heavy weaons. You shouldn't put them in infantry squads. You just take a heavy weapons squad. You need to keep the cost of you Normal guards as low as you can, so you can use those points for heavy weapons teams. 3 of the firing at once is better than just 1.

You have to try to deploy your HWT at the bacck of your deployment zone, preferably on a hill or something(with the exeption of mortars) but still with some cover. With a longer range, this will make up to it.

Well, fluff wise, I really like the idea I'd an artillery plus infantry army. So, I'm thinking two or three power blobs, with some close combat guys like priests and maybe some ogryns, and an artillery firebase. Opinions?

Furthermore, what do I do to prevent my artillery from being blown to bits by deep striking or outflanking units?

prussia59 wrote:Well, fluff wise, I really like the idea I'd an artillery plus infantry army. So, I'm thinking two or three power blobs, with some close combat guys like priests and maybe some ogryns, and an artillery firebase. Opinions?

Read Ailaros' blog; it's in his signature. This is practically a carbon-copy of the way he runs his IG.

L. Wrex

EDIT: This is also not as much a thread about any army list in particular, so shouldn't this go in Tactics?