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First of all, this is not a flame thread. This is a pretty soft generation, so I figured I had to say that to keep the mods from banning me for hurting someone's feelings (and on my first day here!)

My problem is that since I started playing 40k, I've seen the Orks as a complete joke. I don't want to fight against them but they're everywhere. I just can't understand the premise of simple minded fantasy creatures in space. Tyranids I love, but orks? Bleh...

Can you guys convince me that orks are awesome? Or do you agree with me?

Ah, Orks. I, personally, love the gits. In a grimdark universe, they're the only guys having fun. Give them something to give a good crumpin' with, and you've got a happy Ork.

There's also their vehicles. There's something... delightful, I suppose, in 'ork-ifying' vehicles, placing on random bits and armor plates, painting them red, cause deys goes fasta, ya know. They make their guns fire because they think the gun will fire.

I don't think I can convince you of liking Orks, and you don't have to like them. That's the great thing about 40k - there's a bevy of armies to admire and hate.

They live to fight, and they are just silly people. I don't see what not to love about that?!?!

The thing that made me collect Orks is how they appear comical crude barbarians, but imagine how an imperial citizen or guardsman would view an Ork. They are massive, brutish monsters, capable of truly awful things. And there are so many of them.

Personally I prefer the serious Orks, but I can see why people also enjoy the funny side as well. I imagine it is why characters like the Joker are popular. They do terrible things, and to them it is just a joke, it is all a game, making the things they do so much more horrifying.

The reason as to why orks are there, and why they reproduce like that, and their lack of fear, makes me kinda like orks. However, I don't quite care for them, to herp derp for my taste.

I

DeathMetal4tw wrote:First of all, this is not a flame thread. This is a pretty soft generation, so I figured I had to say that to keep the mods from banning me for hurting someone's feelings (and on my first day here!)

My problem is that since I started playing 40k, I've seen the Orks as a complete joke. I don't want to fight against them but they're everywhere. I just can't understand the premise of simple minded fantasy creatures in space. Tyranids I love, but orks? Bleh...

Can you guys convince me that orks are awesome? Or do you agree with me?

Out of interest how long have you played 40k? And how old are you?

The Orks are the only ones who truly love living in the 40k universe. They are actually superior morally to many real life and fictional characters seeing as the Orks are genetically inclined to be belligerent towards everyone. They can't help themselves; they were created by the Old Ones to be the way they are. The Orks are not arrogant like the Eldar, they are not Xenophoic or intentionally genocidal like the Imperium or Eldar, they're not self-righteous like Imperium, Eldar or Tau. If you want to really get to like the Orks check these out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfcdumi9bss&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0FEo2WSLBM&feature=related

DeathMetal4tw wrote:First of all, this is not a flame thread. This is a pretty soft generation, so I figured I had to say that to keep the mods from banning me for hurting someone's feelings (and on my first day here!)

My problem is that since I started playing 40k, I've seen the Orks as a complete joke. I don't want to fight against them but they're everywhere. I just can't understand the premise of simple minded fantasy creatures in space. Tyranids I love, but orks? Bleh...

Can you guys convince me that orks are awesome? Or do you agree with me?

40k has gradually "matured" over the years, becoming more gritty and "pseudo-realistic". Look at IA books, full of campaign information and military terminology, quite unlike early fluff. It's true Orks sorta don't "fit" this style anymore and if they were added to the game now, nearly everyone would hate them.

But the thing is, Orks are just so damn kool and funny that it's impossible not to like them. Much of the 40k lingo comes from Orks.

Remember, Orks aren't really as simple-minded as they seem. They have technological knowledge in their DNA.

The beauty of ork is that you can't avoid them, they're everywhere!!!

There's a lot of diversity available in their codex so very different list builds can be fielded by them.

But I'm a fluff junkie and stuff like Armageddon and Rynn's world is what keeps me in the hobby. Bring on the epic re-fights!!

Does it help to think of them as a genetically engineered warrior caste, built by an ancient, long dead civilisation who, having lost their masters, have devolved into a state of brutal minded anarchy; indulging utterly in their pre-programmed lust for carnage and war-unending? Because they are, you know.

DeathMetal4tw wrote:My problem is that since I started playing 40k, I've seen the Orks as a complete joke.

Then stop doing so.


Think of Orks this way:

Imagine, if you will, technobarbarians. A barbaric, yet technologically gifted race, who cares for nothing but war. Their bodies are BUILT for war. Their minds are built for war. Their CULTURE is built for war. War is their vacation, war is their leisure, war is their job, war is their food, war is their friggin' AIR to breathe. Sure there's other things like going fast and loud explosions, but those are associated with war anyway so that's not against their culture.

Now, these technobarbarians are of a unique biology. They are a ludicrously durable animal/fungus hybrid, who reproduce through spores (allowing them to easily maintain high numbers and removing the conscious thought from reproduction, thus having them even MORE focused on war) and are fully capable of photosynthesis, which also makes them more self-sufficient (they have less requirement to eat or breathe than we do, despite requiring more energy in their bodies). They can have their heads chopped off and then put back on and live to tell the tale. They even have some membres whose mechanical or medical aptitude is written into their genes-- not knowledge of how to build a tank per se, but knowledge of all of the necessary mechanical, electrical, chemical, and physics concepts which are required to figure it out. So no matter what, even if they're all defeated and have to regrow their population from spores, they'll still be just as dangerous because a certain percentage of their population will have these talents and eventually develop guns and tanks for the rest.

They also have a peculiar means of aging-- they don't truly age because of TIME per se, but rather, because of adrenaline rushes. The longer, more intense, more frequent the rushes that the Ork has, the bigger, stronger, and darker skinned the Ork becomes. Eventually becoming a black skinned (with green tints) giant of a monster. As they become bigger, they also become more confident, smarter, faster, stronger. The biggest ones have tactical and strategic minds on par with the most cunning Imperial tacticians and strategists, and lead these masses of massive invaders from victory to victory

Now imagine being a guardsman staring this enemy down. and his half million buddies that are invading your planet. And all of this knowing that even if you kill them all and live somehow, you'll deal with them again in a few years because of how they reproduce. And if you lose, you're lucky to be dead, because if you aren't you'll just be enslaved, your family enslaved, your children enslaved by these brutal barbarians and forced to produce ammunition and parts for their war machine, slowly withering away and dying from abuse, neglect, and overwork.


Orks are only funny to an outsider. To someone WITHIN the universe? They're completely and utterly HORRIFYING.

4 words:

The Beast of Armageddon.

/thread

If you see them as a complete joke, you're looking at them the wrong way. They kinda are a joke and you're supposed to laugh at them, not think they're pointless in creation.

Just read the Ork codex from front to back. The fluff is highly amusing. The race as a whole talks with spit everywhere and using gutter language. Their vehicles are made of scrap. They have a gun that they use to make snotlings run through an unstable tunnel in part of the Warp to jump into the enemy's armour or tank and cause carnage. They are a riot, literally

But hey, if you can't see the funny side of them, at least enojy destroying them on the tabletop

@OP
I find it odd that you choose to post on a forum with a name derived from the orks when there are other forums.

They are great fun in an overly dark universe. I love painting them, though I don't field them often.

Now, they used to be very grimdark back in the days before 40k got watered down. Much of the fluff was made better, but sometimes at the expense of a few 'gems'. Most of the 'old-timers' know what I mean here.

Uhm, what?

They are FAR more grimdark than they used to be.

Melissia wrote:Uhm, what?

They are FAR more grimdark than they used to be.

Didn't they, in the old fluff, carry off human children to be used as slaves and sport? The stuff I've read recently seems much less 'scary' and more semi-comical or at the very least subdued. I don't have the old stuff, but the new codex seems much less grim than what I remember.

Uhlan wrote:

Melissia wrote:Uhm, what?

They are FAR more grimdark than they used to be.

Didn't they, in the old fluff, carry off human children to be used as slaves and sport?

That's still the case.

The stuff I've read recently seems much less 'scary' and more semi-comical or at the very least subdued. I don't have the old stuff, but the new codex seems much less grim than what I remember.

The older codices were far more comedic than the most recent one. All the wacky, nonsensical abilities, rules, units, and equipment which Orks are known for were toned down in the most recent codex.

Maybe I'm confusing old 40k fluff with old fantasy fluff... I finally decided to play them with the release of the last codex. It seemed to me to be much 'lighter' than what I remember.

Everyone has pretty much covered most of the reasons why I like Orks; but I also love the fact that they'll destroy their enemy's vehicle, orkify it, and use it against them on the battlefield.

That, and I'm quite fond of Stompas and Gargants.

Melissia wrote:

DeathMetal4tw wrote:My problem is that since I started playing 40k, I've seen the Orks as a complete joke.

Then stop doing so.


Think of Orks this way:

Imagine, if you will, technobarbarians. A barbaric, yet technologically gifted race, who cares for nothing but war. Their bodies are BUILT for war. Their minds are built for war. Their CULTURE is built for war. War is their vacation, war is their leisure, war is their job, war is their food, war is their friggin' AIR to breathe. Sure there's other things like going fast and loud explosions, but those are associated with war anyway so that's not against their culture.

Now, these technobarbarians are of a unique biology. They are a ludicrously durable animal/fungus hybrid, who reproduce through spores (allowing them to easily maintain high numbers and removing the conscious thought from reproduction, thus having them even MORE focused on war) and are fully capable of photosynthesis, which also makes them more self-sufficient (they have less requirement to eat or breathe than we do, despite requiring more energy in their bodies). They can have their heads chopped off and then put back on and live to tell the tale. They even have some membres whose mechanical or medical aptitude is written into their genes-- not knowledge of how to build a tank per se, but knowledge of all of the necessary mechanical, electrical, chemical, and physics concepts which are required to figure it out. So no matter what, even if they're all defeated and have to regrow their population from spores, they'll still be just as dangerous because a certain percentage of their population will have these talents and eventually develop guns and tanks for the rest.

They also have a peculiar means of aging-- they don't truly age because of TIME per se, but rather, because of adrenaline rushes. The longer, more intense, more frequent the rushes that the Ork has, the bigger, stronger, and darker skinned the Ork becomes. Eventually becoming a black skinned (with green tints) giant of a monster. As they become bigger, they also become more confident, smarter, faster, stronger. The biggest ones have tactical and strategic minds on par with the most cunning Imperial tacticians and strategists, and lead these masses of massive invaders from victory to victory

Now imagine being a guardsman staring this enemy down. and his half million buddies that are invading your planet. And all of this knowing that even if you kill them all and live somehow, you'll deal with them again in a few years because of how they reproduce. And if you lose, you're lucky to be dead, because if you aren't you'll just be enslaved, your family enslaved, your children enslaved by these brutal barbarians and forced to produce ammunition and parts for their war machine, slowly withering away and dying from abuse, neglect, and overwork.


Orks are only funny to an outsider. To someone WITHIN the universe? They're completely and utterly HORRIFYING.

Awesome post there.

I remember reading about an imperial Probe that launched on Terra around 34M and sends a burst at a set intervall. The probe is still intact, but so far outside the known universe nowadays that it's data only arrives about every one hunded years. The adeptus mechanicus awaits this data bursts with horror, as for over 7000 years every single reading has contained prove of orkish infestation in nearby systems. Thus, at least the higher ups of the imperium know that the war against the orks is never going to end.
(Disclaimer: numbers might be off)

I see them much like the Tyranids. The fight because thats all they want to do, not because they have to, or are held by duty or anything else. They fight, fight some more, and then continue fighting. Its what they do.

However, I appreciate their comedic aspect. They help break up the Grimdarkness.

Melissia, excellent post captured most of what orks are in the 40k universe

now I'd like to translate this to the tabletop and the type of player you will usually face.

You have a player, fielding an army of fairly low points cost units... but said units are fairly easy to kill usually, and often have a chance to blow themselves up in the process.

Take 3/7 of the ork HQ

old zogwart and wierdboy have a chance to blow themselves up. for old zogwart there is a re-roll so you have to roll a 1 then another 1 (which does happen), or a 1 in 6 chance with a wierdboy. you also have a 1 in 6 chance to be forced to deep strike... which in theory is good but you can't assault after a deep strike so you are just kind of there near your opponent forced to get shot at knowing you might have to deep strike again or blow up nest turn. you even might work your way into an assault just to get yanked out of said assault.

your other hq choice is big mek who with a SAG has a 1 in 36 chance to blow himself and any unit in D6 inches away. and it is removed from play ... no saves

also two of out heavy support. looted wagons and zzap guns

a zzap gun roll 2 D6 for str, but if you roll over 10 it is a str 10 hit and you lose a member of the crew to the shot... still BS 3 (out top ballistic skill and only on a few things mind you, most are BS2) or with the boom gun on a looted wagon str 8 ap 3 ordinance.. sounds good except every turn there is a 1 in 6 chance your open top weapon that has to stay still to fire moves as far as possible forward.. if it puts you in abase to base with a squad of terminators... such is life and bye bye gun... invariably it loses you at least 1 shot and may lose your tank in the process.

so who WOULD field an ork army with the chance to blow themselves up... with a predominant ballistic skill of 2 and armor made from cheese cloth for a 6 + save (some units don't even have a save)... well... somebody who wants to have fun, who knows they have a good chance of hurting themselves or the opponent but "who care lets throw some dice" an ork player is usually going to take a game less seriously and usually in my experience going to laugh just as hard if not harder than you when his/her stuff fails miserably (and laugh just as loud when it actually works possibly including tales of times it failed miserably)

this weekend I got a win against DE playing my orks… but one moment the second turn I shot with 20 orks with shootas on a group of 5 or 6 witches… 40 dice… 5 hits, all 5 were ones and 2’s … no injuries we both were just like… well that’s orks they do choose their gun based on how loud it is, not how accurate

basically most ork players I have met are like the orks, like to play, like to take chances and most importantly... they have fun doing it

But then again, you can make an Ork army without any self-destructive aspects to it.

where's the fun in that

i mean there is of coarse options for a non self destructive element... but lets look at one of my favorite elites to field, lootas 48" range, str 7 ap4 with D3 shots

fielding 5 due to terrible leadership you could get 15 shots (yay) 10 shots (ok) or 5 shots (crap)

with ballistic skill 2 there is luck factor in hitting with mroe than one shot with 5 shots.

most people i know (myself included as i play as orks) actually enjoy the random element of the game.

we also have nice fluff units like tnak hunters who always have to try to move in range any tank on the board... fun unit that is sometimes awsome and usually useless still fun to play

or mad dok our hq with his one scalpel short of a med pack rule where he has to try to get in and assault the closest thing to him at all times (i like ambushing him in with snickrot, makes for fun times)

Wow, you totally missed the point of an ork army(in rules, not fluff), and even got the rules for both SAG and weirdboyz wrong(they can - and should - be warp heads, just like zogwort). Also using one of the worst things in the codex (zzap guns) as a measure is quite biased. And your example of shooting is lacking - rolling that bad is just as likely as not wounding any shot on a venerable dreadnought with two TL auto-cannons.

If you play your army right, even a winning opponent will have the exact picture Melissa painted, thinking to himself "Wow, I really managed to stop them." or "Luckily the game is over now, and they can't kill more of my guys."

I'm aware they can be warhead but that is an upgrade, i still field em for fun and even with warp heaad i've had them blow up

i did mistype on the SAG you're right, fixed now it is 1 in 36 not 1 in 6, i must have not hit the 3 hard enough (post on my palm pre, my 3/t sometimes don't work very well) but spell check usually catches the missing t's

as for zzap guns i LOVE my zzap guns. they might kill some gretchin but still fun, sure it sucks to get low str but it can be a cheap str 10 3 shots(assuming full squad of 3 guns) and BS3, and if no vehicles in range it is ap2 so negates even terminator armor and forces inv saves

Well, folks, I think that we chased the OP out of his own thread. WAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!