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So far there has (understandably) been a lot of discussion about how the new 6th edition rules have affected individual units and/or certain army builds from the point of view of comparing previous tactics/abilities/survivability/damage output with their new incarnations.

Some units are now more viable and some less - so far so ordinary (this happens every edition)

However, a key component in list building is considering how you will achieve your mission objectives and this is where I can see people adapting their lists.

We have objectives in 5/6 missions and kill points in only 1/6 so MSU will become far more prevalent
1/3 deployments will be on short board edges which will encourage faster units (especially from reserves)
The linebreaker secondary objective will also encourage faster units
The 'Scouring' mission has 6 objectives and fast attack units (including vehicles) count as scoring - encouraging faster units
Vehicles are not denial units so bikes/cavalry/jump troops will become important for late game objective denial
Transports will be vital early game for getting troops within range of objectives but then become little more than mobile cover (or static cover as a wreck )
Heavy support gains an extra role as scoring objective-campers in the 'Big Guns Never Tire' mission

Given all the above, I can see lots of armies taking max fast attack choices and possibly running a second detachment at 2000pts plus to gain access to more (especially if your flyers are also found in this part of the FOC), lots of troops in cheap transports (Rhinos are back with a vengeance) and more 'defensive' heavy support choices (such as artillery and infantry) that can hug cover or get in/behind fortifications.

Elite choices will become less common and more precisely targetted at killing specific enemy units as there will not be the points available for taking them in large numbers and 'aggressive' heavy support choices such as fast tanks or CC monsters will also take a hit as changes to vehicle rules and cover will mean they will die quicker.


That's my predicted changes to the 6th ed meta, what about yours?

I've only played 2 games so far (Crusade and The Relic) - in both games my standard 1500 list performed well.

I normally take 2-3 sqauds of warriors and a sqaud of immortal (all 10 man units).

In Crusade that is enoguh to move up and keep a unit guardign the home objective. In The Relic it is more than enough to just swamp the only objective and set up monstroud crossfire for any enemy unit who tried to get there.

There is on mission where you get a Victory point for every full unit you kill - i can see MSU being an liability for that as each small unit is easier to kill and thus give up points.


i also think that, with the change to power weapons, you are going to see a lot more "standard" terminator units - with a 2+ now saving against most power weaposn you dont have to fork out for the TH/SS ones and can field the shooty versions who will be just as effective in both shootign and CC. As far as i can see, for most armies anyway, the only effective way to kill termainators now is lots of Ap2 shooting - which not everyoen has a lot of access to. Looks like my Heavy Destroyers have just become a "must take".

I wrote a post earlier on this topic.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/458974.page

Here are the some highlights
* Troop choices are extremely important.
* Fast moving troops are best (bikes as troops)
* Having to be on foot to score means foot armies will be more common -- thus increasing the virtual power of armies like DE
* Not being able to assault from vehicles if a big problem, making razorspam less desirable.
* Bringing an AV 10 vehicle on the board at the start of the game is giving up a free VP.
* If you bring heavy/fast attack choices, make them tough (large squads, or big AV vehicles) or your giving up VPs in 1/3 the missions.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Chimera_Calvin wrote:Elite choices will become less common and more precisely targetted at killing specific enemy units as there will not be the points available for taking them in large numbers and 'aggressive' heavy support choices such as fast tanks or CC monsters will also take a hit as changes to vehicle rules and cover will mean they will die quicker.

I disagree here.

Lets say you deep strike in 10 TAC terminators, 2 of them with CMLs and 1 librarian in termie armor. You have suddenly dropped a huge force multiplier right in the enemy lines. This can give you linebreaker, and also is something your opponent then has to deal with, or eat stormbolter/missile shots in the rear.

Given the new wound allocation results, things like this will be a significant threat -- and they are elites.

I appreciate what you mean (and its certainly not a unit I would relish appearing near me ) although at 600 pts its a hefty chunk out of your army that is not being spent on other things.

Given that 2+ armour is the new hotness I fully expect AP2 to become prevalent with weapons like eldar starcannons, DE disintegrators, plasma, IG demolishers, SM/CSM vindicators etc all becoming popular choices.

Given the susceptibility of a big 2+ save deathstars to these kinds of weapons (and the changes to avoid wound allocation shenanigans which kept such deathstars alive) will people not be more inclined to move away from these kind of units as the meta equals itself out?

Just a thought...

We have objectives in 5/6 missions and kill points in only 1/6 so MSU will become far more prevalent

This will counter acted by the new rules for occupying a mission objective. The unit can no longer stay in the transport to claim the object.

Chimera_Calvin wrote:Given the susceptibility of a big 2+ save deathstars to these kinds of weapons (and the changes to avoid wound allocation shenanigans which kept such deathstars alive) will people not be more inclined to move away from these kind of units as the meta equals itself out?.

I agree completely.

Right now everyone is talking about how awesome 2+ saves are. As such, TAC squads are going to start bringing PGs, IG vets will bring PGs, and pretty soon we won't see as many 2+ saves.

I mentioned TAC terminators as I've been using a deep striking squad of them lately and found them to have pretty good effect actually. One can use TH/SS termies for 400pts to do a similar effect.


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wuestenfux wrote:

We have objectives in 5/6 missions and kill points in only 1/6 so MSU will become far more prevalent

This will counter acted by the new rules for occupying a mission objective. The unit can no longer stay in the transport to claim the object.

MSU does not always mean in transports.
I wrote up the following Eldar army as a first draft. The idea is to use lots of jetbikes for troops in squads of 4 to take advantage of the 25% regrouping ability (ie, they can always regroup). I would expect this to perform well in these mission types. The only change I may do is alter the scourges to reavers to make them a bit more durable.

HQ
Eldrad
Lelith Hesperax

Elites
4 Trueborn w/2 splinter cannons

Troops
20 warriors w/2 splinter cannons
20 warriors w/2 splinter cannons (including sybarite w/agonizer)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)
4 guardian bikes (including warlock w/destructor)

Fast Attack
5 scourges w/2 DL

wuestenfux wrote:

We have objectives in 5/6 missions and kill points in only 1/6 so MSU will become far more prevalent

This will counter acted by the new rules for occupying a mission objective. The unit can no longer stay in the transport to claim the object.

agreed but those transports will still be needed to get the footsloggers on the objectives. Very few armies have bikes/jetbikes/cavalry/jump troops etc as troops (Eldar, DA Ravenwing, SM Bikers, BA are the only ones I can think of) so they will still have their place.

Perhaps I was wrong to use 'MSU' as a phrase - I think we are more likely to see 10-man mech squads than 5-man (for the extra durability after they dismount).

Maybe 6th will be the era of the 'MMU' (multiple medium units)?

In fact, Tactical Termies, a full squad with 2 cyclones, led by Librarian with TDA and stormshield is decent unit. Deep striking is less risky in the new edition. So get ready for it and deep strike where it hurts the enemy most.

Chimera_Calvin wrote:agreed but those transports will still be needed to get the footsloggers on the objectives. Very few armies have bikes/jetbikes/cavalry/jump troops etc as troops (Eldar, DA Ravenwing, SM Bikers, BA are the only ones I can think of) so they will still have their place.

Maybe 6th will be the era of the 'MMU' (multiple medium units)?

I like MMU. I agree, my SW army will be using multiple blocks of 10 grey hunters each with the token wolf guard terminator to piss off PW opponents.

This is the list of armies I know with fast moving troops (being defined as outflanking, deep striking, or just fast). The goal is to get a troops to points otherwise hard to reach.
* Eldar Jetbikes
* C:SM bikes
* Drop pods for all marine types
* DA ravenwing
* DA terminators deep striking onto the board
* BA jump troops
* DE hellions
* GK strike squads deep striking
* IG outflanking blobs
* IG dropping out of vendettas
* Necrons with veil or coming from flyers
* Orks with wierdboy teleporting
* Nids using spore pods to deep strike
I expect that we will see these kinds of armies more often, and less of the razorspam.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

wuestenfux wrote:In fact, Tactical Termies, a full squad with 2 cyclones, led by Librarian with TDA and stormshield is decent unit. Deep striking is less risky in the new edition. So get ready for it and deep strike where it hurts the enemy most.

Whats nice about this is you can also drop 22 storm bolter shots into a side/rear of a unit on the turn you come in, allowing you to 'snipe' vulnerable targets.