Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

A model with higher initiative and ASF gets to reroll its misses. What if this same model is affected by the VC power "Beguile," which states that a beguiled model must reroll all hits? Which of these rules takes precedence? And if you do BOTH for some reason, which effect is resolved first?

Its usually played as follows: you separate 'hits' and the 'misses', then re-roll both piles, so in other words, reroll everything. Because you are bound by the 'never reroll a reroll' rule.

In play, you generally either roll once, don't bother looking, pick up the dice, and roll again; or just say the two cancel out.

Either way is statistically the same, so it really doesn't matter.

It's funny how many people get confused by this, when it's really so simple.

You can never re-roll a re-roll. So there is no conflict whatsover. You just re-roll everything.

Or, you can agree with your opponent to let the first roll stand, just to save time, as mathematically it's the same thing.

As above, but lets break it down to be simple.


lets say the attacks in question are rolled. 15 attacks total.

We have 8 hits and 7 misses.

because the model in question has ASF and a higher or equal inititive, they reroll the 7 misses.

But they are also under the effect of Beguile, which makes them reroll the 8 hits.


So in the end, all the original roll are rerolled regardless of what they actually were.

To save time, you simply roll once and don't bother to reroll anything.

Great, thanks guys. I didn't know about the "don't reroll a reroll" rule, thinking that if one rule took precedence over the other it would force a greater number on either side.

If you could re-roll dice that have already been re-rolled, you could re-roll as much as you wanted, which would mean ASF with higher I = always hits, and having a BSB within 12" = Unbreakable.

I once called into question the problem with re-rolling a die versus a roll, since you obviously roll the same batch of dice a whole lot of times, whereas you only roll one armour save for that wound.
But none of that actually matters, because as stated, it's all the same, mathematically.