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Hey guys, new to 40k, and have a question for people with experience playing the game.

For imperial guard line squads (the ones that come with a platoon), what is a good heavy weapons choice? I want these squads to be dedicated to anti-infantry (so no lascannons) but I'm having trouble deciding between heavy bolters, autocannons, and missile launchers.

Heavy bolters mow down infantry but only have a 36" range, and can't penetrate AV 12.

Autocannons have a 48" range and reliably penetrate AV 12 but can't put wounds on infantry nearly as good as heavy bolters or missile launchers can.

Missile launchers have a 48" range and do anti-infantry almost as good as heavy bolters do, with the upside of being able to penetrate AV 12, but they aren't as good as autocannons for cracking light armor because they end up missing a lot. Plus they cost 5 points extra,

Having trouble deciding

Autocannons always worked great for me, even when compared to a heavy bolter against infantry.

Autocannon will average 1 hit to the heavy bolter's 1.5, so not a big difference there. Autocannon wounds on 2's, Heavy bolter will usually wound on 3's, so autocannon is pretty much "guaranteed" a wound everytime it fires. Add in the 12" of extra range, it's ability to deal with light armor as well, and the fact that it's the same price as a heavy bolter, and I always found it to be more than enough for my line squads. If you see tons of hordes though the heavy bolter may be worth it, but I'd be skeptical it would beat out an autocannon.

As for the Missile launcher, I don't feel that it's all that better at anti infantry than the other two. If anything, I'd say it's the worst choice, but that's only because people where I play know to space their models. In a more laid back environment where people don't remember to spread out as much, I could see the frag missiles doing ok. Still, it gets beat at anti armor by the lascannon, beat by the autocannon at light armor, and beat at anti infantry by the AC and the heavy bolter, so I always though it was a crummy choice. IF it got flak missles though, my opinion would probably change, but for now, I won't take them hardly at all.

@MrMoustaffa

Math Hammer for the guns per turn of shooting:

GEQ = T3 5+
MEQ = T4 3+
Orks = T4 6+
MC = T6 3+

Heavy Bolter:
GEQ = 1.25 usaved wounds
MEQ = .33 unsaved wounds
Orks = 1 unsaved wounds
MC = .16 unsaved wounds
AV 10 = .5 pen/glancing hits
AV 12 = -
36" range

Role: Anti-Infantry dakka cannon

Autocannon:
GEQ = .83 unsaved wounds (not even 1 a turn statistically, a whopping 42% less effective then the HB)
MEQ = .27 unsaved wounds (marginally [6%] inferior to the heavy bolter)
Orks = .83 unsaved wounds (booooo)
MC = .22 unsaved wounds (only marginally [6%] more effective than the HB)
AV 10 = .66 pen/glancing hits (not bad)
AV 12 = .33 pen/glancing hits <--- the real reason to take ACs, the most efficient and cheapest light armor popper in the guard arsenal (beats out lascannons in cost effectiveness)
48" range (sweet)

Role: I don't really know... It sucks against infantry compared to HB, only good vs Light armor.

Missile Launcher: (assuming 2 hits on a frag missile, due to spacing/scatter)
GEQ = .88 unsaved wounds (frag) (its meh... still better than autocannon)
MEQ = .33 unsaved wounds (frag) (same as heavy bolter)
Orks = 1 unsaved wound (frag) (same as heavy bolter)
MC = .41 unsaved wounds (krak) (the real place the ML shines, twice as effective as both the HB and the AC)
AV 10 = .416 pen/glancing hits (sort of sucks, but when it hits something goes boom)
AV 12 = .25 pen/glancing (almost as effective as AC)
48" range (sweet)
5 points more (boooo)

Remember, in some circumstances frag missiles will be hitting more than 2 infantry models if they are clumped up and they get WAY more effective if that happens. Krak missiles can instakill T4 multiwound models like tyranid warriors, coupled with ap 3 make this weapon obviously superior to both the HB and AC to killing monsterous creatures. Not as good at anti-infantry as HB (depending on spacing), not as good at armor popping as AC, but it can do both decently with 48" range. Can also move and snap shot at flyers with no penalty like autocannons.

Role: Anti-everything boom gun... paying 5 points to be able to do everything semi-effectively
--------------------
Still can't decide

Heavy bolters suck, don't take them. They're the best at anti-infantry, but useless for anything else. They'd be ok if they were free, but not when you have to pay AC points for them.

Autocannons are awesome, take them. For the same price as a heavy bolter you get +2 STR and +12" range, which means you can actually fill the anti-transport role when there aren't good infantry targets around. This versatility more than makes up for the slightly lower performance against infantry.

Missile launchers are too expensive, don't take them. ACs are more cost effective, and LCs are better when you need something dead. They're good in marine armies where they're they occupy the "cheap and versatile" slot, but for IG they occupy that awkward middle ground where they're too expensive to spam, but not effective enough to be your "elite" weapon.

 Peregrine wrote:
Heavy bolters suck, don't take them. They're the best at anti-infantry, but useless for anything else. They'd be ok if they were free, but not when you have to pay AC points for them.

Autocannons are awesome, take them. For the same price as a heavy bolter you get +2 STR and +12" range, which means you can actually fill the anti-transport role when there aren't good infantry targets around. This versatility more than makes up for the slightly lower performance against infantry.

Missile launchers are too expensive, don't take them. ACs are more cost effective, and LCs are better when you need something dead. They're good in marine armies where they're they occupy the "cheap and versatile" slot, but for IG they occupy that awkward middle ground where they're too expensive to spam, but not effective enough to be your "elite" weapon.

I don't know... Looking at the math, if anything ACs look like the awkward middle ground. Not as effective against infantry as the HB or the ML, and the ML has the ability to instakill T4 models, with ap3 for wounding MCs. The only place where ACs are clearly superior to everything else is light armor popping, and the ML does that almost as well.

5 points more for the ML hurts though... still torn

Peregrine wrote:Heavy bolters suck, don't take them. They're the best at anti-infantry, but useless for anything else.

They're better against AV10, and against fliers.

Anyways, you can do things shorthand with a calculation...

S*H*1/A

Where S is the strength of the weapon, H is its number of shots and A is its AP.

Generally, the higher the score, the more useful it is.

 Ailaros wrote:
They're better against AV10, and against fliers.

I don't know where you're getting that from. Ignoring BS:

The HB gets an average 1 glance or better against AV 10, the AC gets 1.33.

The HB gets 0.5 glance or better against AV 11, the AC gets 1.

Against anything above AV 11 the HB can't even roll dice.


And since all flyers are AV 10, AV 11 or AV 12 the AC is also better against flyers. Whether the target is a flyer or not has absolutely nothing to do with it, since neither weapon has the skyfire rule.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

trollimus_maximus wrote:
5 points more for the ML hurts though... still torn

And this is exactly the problem. The AC is better against light vehicles (still important in 6th) and once you include cost you're comparing three ACs to only two MLs against everything else and that infantry advantage disappears.