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What is the arc of fire on the Venom's two weapons?

I contend that the bottom one is fixed, and the top one is about 180 degrees as it is manned.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
What is the arc of fire on the Venom's two weapons?

I contend that the bottom one is fixed, and the top one is about 180 degrees as it is manned.

Bottom is hull mounted IIRC which is a 45 Degree, Top one I'd say is pintle which is 360 IIRC. I never modeled the guy on mine, as I disliked how it looked

The top cannon would be awfully hard to turn face rear, wouldn't it?

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
The top cannon would be awfully hard to turn face rear, wouldn't it?

Dark eldars are like gymnasts, they're very flexible.

I just count them both as 45 degrees arc of fire, to be honest.

Yeah, I'd say you have a hull mount on the bottom and 180 on the top...unless you figure the gunner is scrambling over the canopy glass to fire behind them

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
Yeah, I'd say you have a hull mount on the bottom and 180 on the top...unless you figure the gunner is scrambling over the canopy glass to fire behind them

It does spin freely around though, unless you glued it in place. I never did, mainly for the fact that lil gun would have snapped off. Also I really don't like the way models look on vehicles so I typically leave them off. Even if it is glued in place it looks like a pintle mounted weapon. I call your attention to the Storm bolter on a Rhino, if someone were gunning it which there is a model for you all would say 180 deg, however if you just slap it on top without the gunner 360? That's a bias judgement based on Race?

No, just an observation based on looking at the two models and knowledge of how most tanks work.

On your typical modern tank that whole assembly on the rhino will rotate like a turret. Of course, this doesn't mean the rhino does this, but it makes more sense to me than a gunner climbing up on top of the canopy glass on the venom.

As far as not modeling the gunner himself, I totally get that as long as you play it like he was there. Otherwise, I could say "well, I don't like power cables attached to my guns so I'll model the death ray on my doom scythe without the cables. Since it's on a ball mount I should be able to turn it 360 degrees now and hit what's behind me." i think there are a few more obstructions to keep it from actually doing that, but you hopefully get my point.

In the end, if the people you play are cool with it, more power to you.

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
No, just an observation based on looking at the two models and knowledge of how most tanks work.

On your typical modern tank that whole assembly on the rhino will rotate like a turret. Of course, this doesn't mean the rhino does this, but it makes more sense to me than a gunner climbing up on top of the canopy glass on the venom.

As far as not modeling the gunner himself, I totally get that as long as you play it like he was there. Otherwise, I could say "well, I don't like power cables attached to my guns so I'll model the death ray on my doom scythe without the cables. Since it's on a ball mount I should be able to turn it 360 degrees now and hit what's behind me." i think there are a few more obstructions to keep it from actually doing that, but you hopefully get my point.

In the end, if the people you play are cool with it, more power to you.

They're the same type of gun. One with triggers on a pintle mount. There are no cables or wires on the Rhino stormbolter. If you're pretending there are because it's more modern. Than by that same concept the DE have them built into it you just cannot tell beings its so alien.

What does cables have to do with the rhino? I'm talking about the circular hatch that the gunner would stand up in. That's what would normally spin.

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
What does cables have to do with the rhino? I'm talking about the circular hatch that the gunner would stand up in. That's what would normally spin.

Heh read cables out of context.

Actually it would spin on the pintle, it actually does and can unless you glue it down. Gives you 360 Deg arc.

If 10 guys (actual capacity I can’t remember) are hanging on the sides and wings of that thing, I honestly can’t see why one guy can’t scramble on top of the canopy that Im pretty sure isn’t glass but some fancy space elf glass. Im also sure that elder are probably very light.

But for sure the bottom gun is hull mounted, the top at least I would give it 360

 Desubot wrote:
If 10 guys (actual capacity I can’t remember) are hanging on the sides and wings of that thing, I honestly can’t see why one guy can’t scramble on top of the canopy that Im pretty sure isn’t glass but some fancy space elf glass. Im also sure that elder are probably very light.

But for sure the bottom gun is hull mounted, the top at least I would give it 360

The logic is funny, but the end point is the same. Bottom is definitely Hull mounted, without a doubt.

However if a storm bolter on a pintle can fire 360 deg, a heavy stubber on a pintle can fire 360 deg, the DE gun on a pintle can fire 360 deg

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
If 10 guys (actual capacity I can’t remember) are hanging on the sides and wings of that thing, I honestly can’t see why one guy can’t scramble on top of the canopy that Im pretty sure isn’t glass but some fancy space elf glass. Im also sure that elder are probably very light.

But for sure the bottom gun is hull mounted, the top at least I would give it 360

The logic is funny, but the end point is the same. Bottom is definitely Hull mounted, without a doubt.

However if a storm bolter on a pintle can fire 360 deg, a heavy stubber on a pintle can fire 360 deg, the DE gun on a pintle can fire 360 deg

Their arc is how much they can rotate, pintle doesn't automatically mean 360 deg.
The only way it could shoot behind is if the gunner climbed over the fron canopy (blinding the driver, i might add).
180 deg is resonable, 360 deg isn't.

As long as you admit you are getting to that conclusion through fuzzy logic

A quick example of what I'm talking about on the rhino (skip to 2:25 or so)


The pintle spins, but it's mounted on a turret ring that also spins. The pintle alone really only gives you about 90 degrees of aimed fire using iron sights. Unless you are Stretch Armstrong or Gumby, you can't really get a fixed pintle to fire behind you. That's why it's mounted on a turret ring that also spins along with the gunner himself.

The venom doesn't have that, and it also doesn't have enough room for the gunner to move around the pintle to get it aimed behind him. I'd give it 180 degrees assuming they had some sort helmet linked aiming system, or were simply using the equivalent to tracer fire to get rounds on target without having to actually look down a set of sights.

If you and I were to play, I might give you a little friendly ribbing over the incredible flexibility of the gunners, but as long as I knew ahead of time what you were playing the arc as, I wouldn't break your balls over it too hard

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
As long as you admit you are getting to that conclusion through fuzzy logic

A quick example of what I'm talking about on the rhino (skip to 2:25 or so)

Spoiler:

The pintle spins, but it's mounted on a turret ring that also spins. The pintle alone really only gives you about 90 degrees of aimed fire using iron sights. Unless you are Stretch Armstrong or Gumby, you can't really get a fixed pintle to fire behind you. That's why it's mounted on a turret ring that also spins along with the gunner himself.

The venom doesn't have that, and it also doesn't have enough room for the gunner to move around the pintle to get it aimed behind him. I'd give it 180 degrees assuming they had some sort helmet linked aiming system, or were simply using the equivalent to tracer fire to get rounds on target without having to actually look down a set of sights.

If you and I were to play, I might give you a little friendly ribbing over the incredible flexibility of the gunners, but as long as I knew ahead of time what you were playing the arc as, I wouldn't break your balls over it too hard

I say 360 Deg, however I only played it as like 320 deg
I've been in Humvee Gunner swings alot in my life I know full well how they work. I also know the kickback and burning of gun's and shells fired from them.
Just arguing from a rules stance though, does the Venom weapon look as if it can spin 360 deg?
Some people say the gunner gets in the way, however the gunner is actually not part of the vehicle right? Cant draw LoS to him, hit or miss there.
No idea why a Venom would be having to shoot behind it in the first place, they're fast and mobile

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:


I say 360 Deg, however I only played it as like 320 deg
I've been in Humvee Gunner swings alot in my life I know full well how they work. I also know the kickback and burning of gun's and shells fired from them.
Just arguing from a rules stance though, does the Venom weapon look as if it can spin 360 deg?
Some people say the gunner gets in the way, however the gunner is actually not part of the vehicle right? Cant draw LoS to him, hit or miss there.
No idea why a Venom would be having to shoot behind it in the first place, they're fast and mobile

Was just making sure we were on the same page there.

Anyway, with a gunner on the gun, I'd say no it does not look like it can spin 360 (reasonably).

He is not part of the vehicle when drawing line of sight to it. There are no exceptions for him otherwise though. You are given permission to ignore him only in one specific instance.

They gotta cut down my OP Night Scythe that's on his 6 with good tone

Alright than shall we say it has 270 Deg (reasonably) ? Assuming the gunner is in the way.

that's 3/4 of a circle, leaving plenty of room to not hit the gunner.

If it was my gaming group, for the sake of compromise, absolutely...I'd still rib you about it from time to time

 Maelstrom808 wrote:
If it was my gaming group, for the sake of compromise, absolutely...I'd still rib you about it from time to time

Ribbings are good, just trying to optimize here. As it doesn't matter if the gunner can fire it, as long as it "looks" like it can swivel that far ^^

I typically play a Flying Circus Daemon army, or Space Wolves, been getting ribbed for a while now. I can take it >.<

Same question: Raider/Ravager prow mounted gun.

It is also a manned gun not on a complete turret.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
Same question: Raider/Ravager prow mounted gun.

It is also a manned gun not on a complete turret.

Agreed, not to mention theres alot more "stuff" that gets in the way. Simple look at though I would say 180 Degree arc assuming the handle of the gun doesnt get stuck pivoting that far.