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Just finished Salvation's Reach, the latest in the Gaunt's Ghosts saga. Pretty damn good - imaginative setting, interesting Imperial Navy stuff, two characters go out in a blaze of glory, a hint of a double/tripel/quadruple-cross going on, the welcome appearence of Space Marines who act and speak believably - ie with lofty disdain for normal humans.

It's clear that the Tanith First has declined considerably in quality over time, with each new intake diluting the fighting spirit of the original Tanith still more. There are several instances where men are reluctant to engage the enemy, understandable but unthinkable in the early days. Rawne seems to be fading out as a character, there is a significant rotten element in the regiment where there only used to be the odd character like Cuu or Feygor and their cronies. The regimental character has changed and so has its role - now standard line infantry rather than elite scouts. They've been around for something like 12-15 years and it's just been one meatgrinder battle after another. It's difficult to imagine how any man could endure that without becoming a total headcase or completely numb and emotionally dead. Gaunt himself has been fighting for decades, leading from the front, killing hundreds of men face-to-face and seeing every horrific sight imaginable as well as being tortured. flayed and blinded. It's not credible that his character has remained unchanged and is still capable of caring for his men, his son or his lover.

I feel that the series hit the heights with Only In Death and has run its course. What do you think?

Like some storylines, IG aren't meant to live forever. However, BL has gotten a lot of mileage out of the heresy. So my guess is that Guant will live on as long as sales are up...

From a purely story perspective, it's probably time to have him go out in a serious blaze of glory.

That's called character - or in this case - regiment development. If makes it feel a bit more real. If they were still like they were in First and Only, then it would feel as if time stood still. They've been through a feth of a lot, they've seen good friends die horrible, pointless deaths in the name of unending war, taken in remnants of other regiments, made new friends, seen them die horrible, pointless deaths...

Abnett has actually developed the characters and regiment as a whole. As he should have.

 -Loki- wrote:
That's called character - or in this case - regiment development. If makes it feel a bit more real. If they were still like they were in First and Only, then it would feel as if time stood still. They've been through a feth of a lot, they've seen good friends die horrible, pointless deaths in the name of unending war, taken in remnants of other regiments, made new friends, seen them die horrible, pointless deaths...

Abnett has actually developed the characters and regiment as a whole. As he should have.

Well the regiment has changed character but my point is that Gaunt really hasn't changed one bit since he was first introduced, which isn't really credible. I do like it though that Abnett will kill off major characters and bring on and develop new ones over the course of the series. The surviving Tanith are fading out - Rawne, Larkin etc. You'd think Rawne would be pretty pissed off being stuck at Major for fifteen years or so.

 Rooster wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
That's called character - or in this case - regiment development. If makes it feel a bit more real. If they were still like they were in First and Only, then it would feel as if time stood still. They've been through a feth of a lot, they've seen good friends die horrible, pointless deaths in the name of unending war, taken in remnants of other regiments, made new friends, seen them die horrible, pointless deaths...

Abnett has actually developed the characters and regiment as a whole. As he should have.

Well the regiment has changed character but my point is that Gaunt really hasn't changed one bit since he was first introduced, which isn't really credible. I do like it though that Abnett will kill off major characters and bring on and develop new ones over the course of the series. The surviving Tanith are fading out - Rawne, Larkin etc. You'd think Rawne would be pretty pissed off being stuck at Major for fifteen years or so.

This post is going to contain some pretty big spoilers for anyone who hasn't read the series.

I think we're reading different books. Because Gaunt defnitely has changed over the course of the books. He's had several major plot points change him dramatically (losing at Hagia, Vervunhive and Gereon to name the major points). In the first books, while hardline, Gaunt has a bit more of a casual streak to him. Vervunhive showed his extreme favouritism towards to Tanith, which was overcome only grudgingly, and he still favours them more. Hagia turned Gaunt into a drunken malcontent, not much better than Rawne and Feygor. Quick to anger, harsh and even violent towards Ghosts he was close to (like even pointing a gun at Milo). The fact he took a gun to Dorden afterwards showed how more hardline he became, not wanting to fail again. Gereon... wow, how much he changed on Gereon. His views on Chaos changed, his relationship with previously disliked characters changed. His viewpoint of the crusade itself changed. He's still the hardline commisar he should be, but he's definitely gone through some seriously big developments as a character.

Larkin has changed quite a lot - particularly after Bragg and Corbecs deaths and Gereon. Rawne has also changed a lot more than any other characters. Even Caffran who started as a rather minor character ended up being one of the most heartfelt deaths due to good character development. The books are still bolter (or lasgun) porn, so the action and setting always take precedence over the characters. But Abnett has done a great job having key characters go through major developments in the background of all of the action.

Funny my main issue with the Ghosts is the lack of deaths. WAY too many 'flesh wounds' and minor characters who stick around forever. And then we have Rawne who should have been court marshalled and shot a few books back...

One thing I liked about this book was the influx of new recruits and characters, Abnet did a great job making them come to life in a short time.

I think it's getting clearer that Abnett has no plan and will run with this as long as it sells. Which is fine by me, Gaunts Ghosts remain my first pick of reading material when I have a long flight and the familiar formulas aren't much a problem when i read one every year or so.

Gaunt hasn't changed? He's not the idealist he was in the early novels for one. I think he's gotten as worn out as the rest of the cast actually, and that's been a major theme with the latest novels. On that point I'd say that that's an appropriate direction to take the series seeing as its coming to a close. Its called "The Victory", but whether it'll be a hollow one for the Ghosts and/or the crusade as a whole or not is still to be seen. I mean who knows how it'll end. It may result in the Ghosts finally getting to retire (though their idea of that planet's changed from a new Tanith to just a place to settle down on I guess), or it could wind up with a blaze of glory like's been mentioned, but I suspect the later would bother a few fans.

The series has been about making the setting a bit less grimdark/silly, so the way its developed has been influenced by this. Read similar novels like Old Man's War or The Forever War and the characters are feeling the same way. Other novels set in the 40k unviserse about aging guard regiments handle the topic in a similar, if not as well written manner (Flesh and Iron, Fifteen Hours, Imperial glory). We're close to the end with the series, so don't complain that its taking its time getting there. =P

The short story "The Iron Star" shows Gaunt quite different from the one we've met in "First and Only". It might be a hallucinogenic fever dream, but it really showcases how he's been affected by the nonstop conflict.

The interesting trend I've noticed with this series, is that it's the new influx of recruits every now and then which keep the regiment functional. We're seeing the steady decline of the mental health of the original Tanith; most of them are seriously damaged, borderline self-destructive and while they're extremely proficient soldiers, they've been just a bit too messed up over the years.

The Vervunhivers helped rebuild the regiment, but so many of them have died as well, they're not terribly distinct from the tanith in terms of general mental damage; most of them started off as ideologues, dedicated to Gaunt and the cause of the wider crusade, now the ones that are left are just going through the motions, and it's largely the Belladons who are the ones acting as a kind of moral rock of reasonably functional human beings.

That, and Zweil, he amuses me greatly.

I think it's a fair assessment that the series is winding down; the regiment is seriously under-strength, the actual tanith are few in number and they're attrition or moral alongside manpower will result in them likely being more of a liability than an asset, and either self destruct in a blaze of glory, or be drawn off the lines completely.

Truth be told, the theme of the most recent book felt that if Gaunt couldn't justify his own regiment's continued contribution, they likely would have never been put back into action, and kept as a rearguard. Even now, they're embarking on a special operations deployment, as they're too weak for conventional deployments like what we saw earlier in the series. After this, win or lose, they're likely out of the fight.