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Am I missing something? What do we have against flyers? No weapons or own flyers either, except the Storm Raven. With it's multirole it isn't good in any of them.

Considering it's a pre-6th ed. codex, is that surprising?

They may take Storm talons though IIRC.

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
Considering it's a pre-6th ed. codex, is that surprising?

They could always errata/faq it.

They may take Storm talons though IIRC.

That is a Forge World unit? I may have checked it but BA were absent in the rules.

They can't take Storm Talons, only vanilla and BT can. For anti-air BA can use Storm ravens, Aegis defense line, mass of non-skyfire shots or allies.

Stormraven with MM can hit nearly every flier on the map in melta range when it comes on. TL MM has a 37% chance to explode any AV12 flier in melta range without even factoring in the assault cannon/lascannon or missiles. Its the most reliable unit in the game to deal with fliers. So yeah, besides that, you seem to lack good air defense.

How is the storm raven bad at killing fliers? A TL MM, TL AC and 4 str:8 ap:1 missiles?
Seems like it's designed perfectly for it.

They are in the same boat as most 5th and earlier armies, and in a better spot than Dark Angels, Chaos, Eldar and Daemons just due to the stormraven alone.

I got the model and will give it a try. I just don't think it will be enough and it is quite expensive.

Unfortunately we'll see 7th edition before GW gets to update all old codexes.

 lazarian wrote:
They are in the same boat as most 5th and earlier armies, and in a better spot than Dark Angels, Chaos, Eldar and Daemons just due to the stormraven alone.

Erm...Crimson hunters butcher fliers.

So does the stormraven plus it hauls two units. I still contend without upgrades it's a better flyer.

 lazarian wrote:
So does the stormraven plus it hauls two units. I still contend without upgrades it's a better flyer.

Not sure of the CH's price point but the StormRaven is a hefty price tag. I'll stick with Vendettas as being the best flyer hunter pt for pt imo.

crimson hunter is bad. 4 S8 AP2 shots for 160 points on an AV10 hull with no defensive equipment. Any interceptor pretty much shuts it down. Plus it has to come on after fliers to be effective since it will get shot down by any flier no problem at all.

Vendetta is obviously great, but PotMS, missiles, and AV12 rear put the stormraven above it.
3x lascannons vs AV12 5+ = .75 pens, 25% chance to kill.
1x MM vs AV12 5+ = .48 pens, 24% chance to kill
3x Bloodstrike missiles vs AV12 5+ = .44 pens, 22% chance to kill
1x AC vs AV12 5+ = .39 pens 7% chance to kill

So just going off kill shots, the vendetta has a 25% chance to kill a flier
The stormraven has a 53% chance to kill a flier.

Even when factoring cost in, the stormraven is still more effective at killing fliers. Now, you do have limited missiles and the GK stormraven does not have bloodstrike missiles, but even still a stormraven is better at killing fliers with no missiles involved. Then you have the ability to use POTMS to pretty much negate the downside of jinking for your MM whereas a vendetta has less than half of its firepower.

Naw wrote:
Am I missing something? What do we have against flyers? No weapons or own flyers either, except the Storm Raven. With it's multirole it isn't good in any of them.

At least you have the stormraven... Space Wolves have no flyers or anti-flyer weapons without taking allies or fortifications.

Armies will slowly catch up as codexes are redone for the new edition. If they get a new codex. Yay for GW's 'Lets take 5 years to release half of the rules for our game, before releasing a new edition and starting all over again!' release system.

I really dont see why they didn't give Wolves the storm talon, i guess its so they can release a Wolf specifec flier for 40 wuid when they get re-done in a few years.

Actually, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the Wolves don't get a flier, as it's not really fluffy. They use Thunderhawks out of practicality, but much prefer to have their feet firmly on the ground where they belong...

As such, I would expect that GW will focus on ground vehicles for them (or, given some of GW's recent releases, a gargantuan Fenrisian Wolf that has dreadnoughts riding on it) and just scatter flakk missiles liberally through the army. Probably with a Rune Priest power that grounds fliers, or at least makes flight difficult.

 lazarian wrote:
So does the stormraven plus it hauls two units. I still contend without upgrades it's a better flyer.

S8 AP2 Lance weapons that reroll to pen, are fired at BS4, and are twinlinked.

There is no flier in the game that is going to survive even one round of shooting from them.

Crimson Hunter are not TL.

2x Brightlance+1x Pulse laser on AV12 5+
(4*2/3/3+4*1/2/3*2/3)*2/3=.88 pens, 29% chance to kill

So slightly better than the vendetta but worse than the stormraven by a lot. Also AV10, no TL to assist when jinking making the vehicle nearly worthless if it is ever shot at (you will be jinking). If the quad gun is still alive, you are going to jink and die by the time you get a good volley off. No, the crimson hunter is worthless.

 zephoid wrote:
worthless.

Ah...there's that word that lets us all know that you're blowing hot air.

For Blood Angels, you also have the option of taking a Librarian with Prescience, and giving that to a suitable unit (lascannon Devastators for instance should generate a hit or two a turn out of it). It's a hell of an expensive way to do it, but one that proves very useful against other vehicles too.