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I´ve read several threads about this topic but still think its strange.

The "two CCW-rule" gives you +1A in CC. BUT if a model already have a CCW and a pistol in its entry before any upgrades are applied, IS THIS already counted in to its profile? Most people seems to interpret the rules as you get +1A even if this is the case.

BUT when you sometimes apply this I think some units gets totally worthless and other super OP.
FOR EXAMPLE: standard CSMs cost 75p for 5models. If you upgrade four of them with aditional CCW the unit will cost 83p and all five modles will have 2 attacks each. One original and one for having two CCW.
Five Chosen CSM costs 90p and already have two CCW from the begining and also have two original attacks. This sums up to a total of three attacks.
Chosen marines and standard marines are equal in every other way. Exept Chosen also have a higher leadership and can have for example 4 plasma guns.

Why would anyone then buy standard marines? 2Attack 8Ld models with 5boltguns and with the option to swap one for max 1 plasma gun for total 83p OR 3 attack 9Ld models with 5boltguns with the option to swap the guns for up to max 4plasma guns! for total 90p.
Plasma gun option cost is also the same for the two units.

The points difference if 7P!!!

Then the most logical would be that the chosen have their CCW and pistol already counted in to there profile. After all the Chosen is not that much stronger or more ferocious than the rest of the CSM so that they deserve one more original attack. If the bonus is allready acounted for in the profile then the points differense would only be beacause of the extended heavy weapon options, which I see more plausible.

BUT then again if you look at the Chaos cultists they have CCW and pistol as their original gear. Still they only have one attack. By my previous logic that would mean they loose their one attack if uppgraded for one point each with autogun. Hench loosing their ability to fight in CC. Which I dont see at all plausible.

//Chaos Player

You are overthinking things. It is not included in the profile. Chosen get 3 attacks. Chaos cultists with CCW and pistol get 2.

One of the big differences is Chosen are not troops unless you take Abbadon.

chosen = aspiring champions, to all intents and purposes, so 2 base, 3 for 2CCW.

Thanks for the inputs.

rigeld2 wrote:
One of the big differences is Chosen are not troops unless you take Abbadon.

Good point. One advantage of the Standard Marines is ofcouse the advantage of being a scoring unit.

Botcharge wrote:
IThe "two CCW-rule" gives you +1A in CC. BUT if a model already have a CCW and a pistol in its entry before any upgrades are applied, IS THIS already counted in to its profile? Most people seems to interpret the rules as you get +1A even if this is the case.

Bonus attacks are never included in the profile. When they are included it will specify.

Chosen are overpowered? That's a new perspective.

Only rules that are in the stats by default that i know of are toughness values for biker units. The rest are unmodified...though i think the Deffdredd still confuses the feth out of me on how many it has lol