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Hey there people, long time lurker and now i'm taking the plunge since i need some feedback on my list.:

It is basically a Screamerstar combined with 2 Princes and Fateweaver, giving me 4 fast units that can threaten most things.

HQ: Kairos Fateweaver (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, Oracle of Eternity, The Two Heads of Fate
Wargear: Staff of Tomorrow

HQ: Herald of Tzeentch (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, IC, Psyker lvl 3 (xx)
Wargear: Exalted Reward (xx), Disk of Tzeentch (xx)

HQ: Herald of Tzeentch (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, IC, Psyker lvl 3 (xx)
Wargear: Exalted Reward (xx), Disk of Tzeentch (xx)

HQ: Herald of Tzeentch (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, IC, Psyker lvl 3 (xx)
Wargear: Exalted Locus of Conjuration (xx), Disk of Tzeentch (xx)

Troops: Pink Horrors x 10 (xxxp)
USR: Blue Horror, Brotherhood of Sorcerers, Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, Magic Made Manifest
Wargear: -

Troops: Pink Horrors x 10 (xxxp)
USR: Blue Horror, Brotherhood of Sorcerers, Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, Magic Made Manifest
Wargear: -

Fast: Screamers of Tzeentch x 7 (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch, Instability, Deep Strike, Lamprey's Bite, Slashing Attack
Wargear: -

Heavy:Chaos Daemon Prince (xxxp)
USR: Daemon of Tzeentch (xx)
Wargear: 2 x Greater Rewards (xx), Lesser Reward (xx) Wings (xx)

HQ: Chaos Daemon Prince [CSM] (xxxp)
USR: Fearless, Daemon of Tzeentch (xx)
Wargear: Armor (xx), Veterans of the long war (xx), Wings (xx), Black Mace (xx)

Troops: Chaos Cultist Squad x 10 (xxxp)
USR: Champion of Chaos
Wargear: Improvised Armor, Auto pistol, CCW, Flamer (xx)

Fast: Helldrake (xxxp)
USR: Daemon, Daemonforged, IWND, Meteoric Descent
Wargear: Daemonic possession, Bale flamer (xx)

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It will mainly be against Necrons, Gravgun SM bikers, 5 Landraider Angels and maybe Broadside/Riptide gunline Tau, that i'll be fielding this list.

Now I know that I am low on troops, that's why i've got the second Exhalted on the Herald.

I've dropped the Psychic powers and armor on the Tzeentch prince but given him 2 greater gifts for survivability along with a +2 S staff to make him a "Vector striker", helping against flyers, which this list has some trouble with (Necron Scythewing, being the main concern)

The rest is pretty self explanatory.

Possible thoughts are:

- Bastion, Chaos Lord, Icarus with Cultists instead of the Mace prince, freeing up points for more troops and screamers/Psychic powers on the Tzeentch prince.

- Slannesh Grinders with either Phlegm or Flamer.

- Drop the drake and get more upgrades on the princes (finding this hard, since the baledrake is such a good unit, and the added pressure of having that flying around might take the pressure of the none-armored prince)

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Now the my question is, do you guys see anything I can do to make the list synergize better, is there any glaring weaknesses against the mentioned armies that I might have missed?

Any help or comments will be much appriciated

Kras.

EDIT: Removed Pointcosts

Just a quick thing at first, you don't need to name the special rules that they have, as someone who needs to know what the units do probably won't have the best advice (not always however).

Your list reminds me of when I was a fresh faced Daemons player, trying to make the best tzeentch list possible. But then the sad truth dawned on me, that tzeentch is just too squishy to be competitive by himself.

What you need to do is swap out one of the heralds with a nurgle one and a pink horror squad with a Plaugebearers one. I'd also take one of the Heralds of his disk and put him with the horrors with the exalted locus. Make him mastery lvl 3 and take the primaris tzeentch power and the rest divination. Try and get precognition if not jsut take precedence. This means his squad can put out 7d6 s6 shots re rolling misses (maybe wounds). screamers make a good precision strike unit, but be careful, as if someone focuses on them they'll fall like a sack of bricks

I'd also take off a herald and try and replace him with a soul grinder of nurgle with phlegm bombardment. He's 180 pts like that so try and find some other points to shave off. Nurgle means that he get s 2+ save when he's 50% obscured. You also need him for his skyfire, as you have very little Anti air, and even his harvester cannon isn't great, so something to think about. (heldrakes are ok but a couple of nightcythes with eat him up)

Love the DPS, cultists just cheap objective holders and heldrake (horray).

Hope this helps!

Hey there Giraffe, thanks for the time to answer my post, and for the advice

About the special rules, that is just my Excel sheet setup that brings it along for problem shooting point costs.

Not really as fresh faced when it comes down to it, having 60+ games with the new codex

About the survivability, the horrors will most likely go to ground in area terrain, giving them at least a 3+ cover save with a re-roll of 1's, so survivability on these won't be a problem me thinks.

The Tzeentch Heralds are key to my list:

The 3 tzeentch Heralds will be able to give the screamers a 2+ re-rollable invu save, dropping a Herald of Tzeentch will remove 1/3 of my chances of getting forwarning (4++), which is key to the unit. A nurgle Herald won't give me anything, it is too slow and can't keep up with the ultra fast units the list contains, I simply can't find the synergi between the Nurgle Plague bearers+Herald and the rest of the list:/

The shooting of the Screamer council can be upto 12d6 S6 shots at BS4, if i don't use Forewarning, Prescience (maybe Precognition on one of the heralds to get re-roll to wound), but aiming at 9d6 S6 shots from the unit, which isn't bad on a highly mobile platform. (Which can, with generate around 10 or 11 hits on a flier on average)

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I appreciate the time you took to give me feedback on the list, and i thank you for it, but I feel that the suggestions, in general, wouldn't strengthen the army.

first off, sorry if the fresh faced comment came off in a condescending tone, I didn't mean it like that at all, just trying to make a joke that I didn't read out loud properly (I actually was thinking in the voice of an old irish man as I typed it) : p

And while I understand the idea of the horrrors going to ground, I just think that it would be better to use plaguebearers, as they would get a 2+ cover save without having to go to ground. Sorry for not mentioning it but I meant to say to give the HON the greater locus so the Plaguebearers get FNP.

One question though is the 2++ save on the screamers, as I think that you've done it stacking the 4++ of forewarning on the 5++ of daemon, but I'm pretty sure forewarning would just replace it instead.

Another is who is going to be looking after the fateweaver, as he is very squishy for a MC and can be insta killed by strength 10 weapons.

My thing with all the lone heralds was that they WILL get picked off with a pretty weak 5++ save, toughness 3 and two wounds. That's why I thought that they should be hidden in other squads. Heralds of nurgle could cast biomancy spells on your tzeentch units to help buff them.

My thing with this list is that since it's a daemons list there are a lot of things that can go wrong, just out of the nature of the codex. I find that Nurgle is the safest, whereas tzeentch is the most erratic. Putting so much pressure on screamers just seems like something that would work in the enemy's favour, so long as they are smart enough to prioritise targets. Nurgle would makes a great bunker, securing your own side of the board much more reliably than pink horrors. It's the fact that they are such great opposites which makes Tzeentch and nurgle so good together. They complete each other

Just a quick tip on the daemons DP though, as he's not psychic I'd make him khorne or slaanesh 'cause just re rolling ones is a bit useless on a unit that only gets a 5+ save.

No worries at all, it is hard to make jokes when just using text.. The Irish man voice will from now on be my mental voice for your posts

The 2++ is achieved by combining forwarning (4++) with the Grimorie of True Names [GoTN] (adds 2+ to any invu save) = 2++, the re-roll is because of being Daemons of Tzeentch, which allows you to re-roll 1's on saving throws. (equals 1 in 36 wounds will get through, on 2 wound models (screamers) this equals 72 wounds before killing 1 model, with smart positioning of the screamers, you'll have to do even more wounds) This negates the need for Biomancy powers, which are hard to get, and on units (Nurgle heralds are max lvl 2 psykers) that are very very slow. So there is no synergi at all here, basically you are tying your own shoelaces together to get a buff from Endurance, which isn't even that good = a 5++ followed by a 5+ FNP compared to a 2++ followed by a 2++..

All the Tzeentch Heralds will run with the Screamers, the Screamers are there to tank wounds, and to tie things like tau gunlines up in multiassaults for my DP's to get there and overload with wounds and I8 for the overrun.

Fateweaver allows you to re-roll 1 dice pr. player turn, this dice will be the roll for the GoTN allowing me to have a 8/9th chance, instead of a 2/3 chance, of getting it going. He is a 300 point re-roll, anything he does on top of that is a bonus. He makes the screamerstar more dependable (Hit and run would be nice, but that is only for Eldar Seercouncils sadly)

About the bunker with the Plaguebearers, if Horrors go to ground in 4+ area terrain, then i'm looking at a 2+ cover save with a re-roll of 1's, making them 6 times harder to shift than Plaguebearers, on cover saves alone. Yes they do have a higher Toughness and get FNP, but the price i pay for T and FNP on a unit that does nothing all game and hopes not to get caught in assault is simply too steep a price.

I see the point in Nurgle Grinders, the problem is that waveserpents and broadsides with their amount of S7 ignores cover will glance the Grinder to death. I could see their use against the 5 x Landraider BA list, since their lascannons won't ignore cover and the Grinder is semi good at opening (4+ to glance is semi good) AV14, but i fear they are to slow to follow the rest of the army around.

Very clever using the grimore with forewarning and kiaros, will have to keep that in mind for the future.

Ok, I'll admit that you have got a battle plan down quite well and that it is a lot more solid than I thought before, but I think that you have to keep in mind that your assault formation has some pretty hard counters (wraiths with whipcoils, tesla weapons, high volume fire, tarpit units) which would be magnified by there only being three or four real units to try and take the fight to the opponent's 1850pts worth of troops

But if the horrors are assaulted they are screwed, and although they pack a punch pretty much all of your points are focused on the assault with the DPs and and screamers, so they're going to get left behind and be easy prey for something like a land raider crusader with some assault marines. It seems like they would end up getting left behind by the rest of the army and get overrun but enemy assault units easily.

About the horrors being left behind, that is true, but i plan on Deep striking them in, and with potentially 9 rolls on divination i have a good chance of getting Scriers Gaze, allowing me to keep my Troops out longer..

SO this list is a combination of the flying circus list and the screamer star list...it'll wreck face.

Just remember to keep your troops alive, which I'm sure you know.

There's not much to be said on this. There's already a lot of lists on dakkadakka like this one, you might get a few comments about wargear like what rewards to take, but other than that, not much to be said.

Hi there Changerofways, Thanks for replying on my topic and thank you for the nice comment.

I was hoping i might have missed something obvious, to some, but i take the lack of input as a sign that the list is indeed good, which i suppose i should be happy for.

I have changed the 2 greater gift prince into having only 1 greater gift and giving him Armor instead. That increases his survivability immensly against small arms fire, and i still get a chance of getting either +1W/IWND or 4+ FNP..

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Again, thank you both for taking the time to reply

plaguebearers would only get a 2+ cover without going to ground in a ruin... For a 2+ cover in area, they'd still need to go to ground...