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Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 CptJake wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Wake up this morning to discover that another POTUS has decided to lob a few cruise missiles at the Middle East and blow up a few camels, with the American tax payer being billed for $100 million.

And the end result is the square root of horsegak!

So far the BDA is a bit better than 'a few camels'.

You'll know better than me, but what has it achieved in the grand scheme of things? The strategic balance shifted in Assad's favour months ago. Ultimately, with Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah backing him up, he'll still win in the end, and a few random cruise missile attacks will not change this.

If the goal was to send a message to the Syrians and Best Korea (TM) without getting us into WWIII then message sent. If the goal was to topple the Syrian regime then clearly that won't happen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

See. Damned if we do damned if we don't. Better to get out and let the rest of the world deal with itself.

 Frazzled wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

See. Damned if we do damned if we don't. Better to get out and let the rest of the world deal with itself.

Now you're getting it!

SHOO SHOO GREAT SATAN!

 Frazzled wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 CptJake wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Wake up this morning to discover that another POTUS has decided to lob a few cruise missiles at the Middle East and blow up a few camels, with the American tax payer being billed for $100 million.

And the end result is the square root of horsegak!

So far the BDA is a bit better than 'a few camels'.

You'll know better than me, but what has it achieved in the grand scheme of things? The strategic balance shifted in Assad's favour months ago. Ultimately, with Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah backing him up, he'll still win in the end, and a few random cruise missile attacks will not change this.

If the goal was to send a message to the Syrians and Best Korea (TM) without getting us into WWIII then message sent. If the goal was to topple the Syrian regime then clearly that won't happen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

See. Damned if we do damned if we don't. Better to get out and let the rest of the world deal with itself.

A lot of people seem to be congratulating Trump for sending Assad, Putin, or anybody else for that matter, a shot across the bows.

A shot across the bows suggests a rational policy in place. Alas, this is Trump we're talking about - emotionalism, which is a terrible thing for international policy, seems to be guiding him.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 CptJake wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Wake up this morning to discover that another POTUS has decided to lob a few cruise missiles at the Middle East and blow up a few camels, with the American tax payer being billed for $100 million.

And the end result is the square root of horsegak!

So far the BDA is a bit better than 'a few camels'.

You'll know better than me, but what has it achieved in the grand scheme of things? The strategic balance shifted in Assad's favour months ago. Ultimately, with Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah backing him up, he'll still win in the end, and a few random cruise missile attacks will not change this.

What was achieved? Trump showed Assad if he uses chem, he gets spanked. A contrast to Obama's red lines with no consequences tied to crossing them. He also showed the US and the world he may not actually be a Putin Puppet as many like to believe.

The strike was not random, it hit the airfield the chem strike was launched from. That is the opposite of random, and helped send the message.

Now, having said all that, I'm still of the belief that capping a few dozen kids with sarin is not any different than capping a few dozen kids with barrel bombs, machine-gun bullets, VBIEDs or other methods. This is an especially brutal civil war with multiple sides, most (if not all) of which have deliberately targeted civilians.


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 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

Seriously? Do you think this strike is what prevents the Middle East from being stable? If so, you may want to read a bit more.

 CptJake wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

Seriously? Do you think this strike is what prevents the Middle East from being stable? If so, you may want to read a bit more.

All that interference by America must have no effect at all.

Iraq is a democratic paradise. Isn't it great that so many Americans and other coalition troops died for that?

Bravo, America. Bravo.

Say what you want about Trump (and some of the things that come out of his mouth make me cringe), but this was brilliant timing to do this, even if accidental.

It's interesting that the airstrike came at the end of the day with two stories breaking regarding Russia and princeling Jared Kushner.

C.I.A. Had Evidence of Russian Effort to Help Trump Earlier Than Believed

Kushner Omitted Meeting With Russians on Security Clearance Forms

And for the people jumping on the "Syria proves Trump isn't a puppet," are we going to so quickly forget that Trump has a proven history of reneging on deals and attacking allies, right up to just last week when he was threatening to go after the Freedom Caucus in their primaries? Even if Russia had direct involvement with assisting Trump's campaign, they were likely working with the same assumption that the Republicans had during the primaries; that they could keep control of him.

And I suppose no one has heard of piece trading? I wonder what's more valuable to Putin - Assad's control of Syria or continued cozy relationship with America's leader? And I wonder if Trump will attempt to "apologize" to the Russians by removing sanctions.

Hell, that's assuming the the Russia/US stances aren't playing good cop/bad cop with Assad, especially since the Trump administration informed Russia before the airstrikes occurred.

 Medium of Death wrote:

 CptJake wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

Seriously? Do you think this strike is what prevents the Middle East from being stable? If so, you may want to read a bit more.

All that interference by America must have no effect at all.

Iraq is a democratic paradise. Isn't it great that so many Americans and other coalition troops died for that?

Bravo, America. Bravo.

Oh please, the UK started this mess decades ago. Bravo, UK. Bravo.

IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

 Medium of Death wrote:

 CptJake wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Medium of Death wrote:
Based America helping to destabilise the middle east yet again.

Seriously? Do you think this strike is what prevents the Middle East from being stable? If so, you may want to read a bit more.

All that interference by America must have no effect at all.

Iraq is a democratic paradise. Isn't it great that so many Americans and other coalition troops died for that?

Bravo, America. Bravo.

And that relates to this strike, about which you made your comment, in what way?

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 Medium of Death wrote:
IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

LOL wow you sound like a complete idiot. Thanks for showing up I get a kick out of people like you.

Did you get this upset when Iran and Russia started bombing civilians? Did you get remotely upset seeing people get gassed? Probably not. Did you get upset at all at any time the last 7 years this civil war has been going on that the US didn't start? Yet you lose your mind over the US bombing a military target in hopes of stopping Assad from gassing his own people.

If the US wanted to, it could wipe out all of Assad's airbases, even with the Russians defending them, with modest losses. This shows restraint.

I assume you are ok with Assad gassing his own people, which makes you a pathetic human being.

Saying you can't wait for our country to Balkanize shows me you have no clue about America and how it works. But on the flip side I am sure you are already a loser so fill us in on what that is like so we'll all know what to avoid.

You really need to read some books.

 Medium of Death wrote:
IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

Which is a completly blind way of looking at how the area worked historically, how colonial powers put borders on places that hadn't had borders etc etc.

The actions of the US are just the most recent of a fairly long line of mostly the west dicking about there.

KTG17 wrote:
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 Medium of Death wrote:
IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

LOL wow you sound like a complete idiot. Thanks for showing up I get a kick out of people like you.

Did you get this upset when Iran and Russia started bombing civilians? Did you get remotely upset seeing people get gassed? Probably not. Did you get upset at all at any time the last 7 years this civil war has been going on that the US didn't start? Yet you lose your mind over the US bombing a military target in hopes of stopping Assad from gassing his own people.

If the US wanted to, it could wipe out all of Assad's airbases, even with the Russians defending them, with modest losses. This shows restraint.

I assume you are ok with Assad gassing his own people, which makes you a pathetic human being.

Saying you can't wait for our country to Balkanize shows me you have no clue about America and how it works. But on the flip side I am sure you are already a loser so fill us in on what that is like so we'll all know what to avoid.

You really need to read some books.

He gassed his own people? Like Saddam had WMD's in Iraq and was connected to Al-Qaeda?

The US didn't start the War? Yet it has been constantly meddling in it, funding rebels directly linked with ISIS.

Can't keep your fat fingers out of anything. Yanks, not even once.

I'm sure your country is going to stay together forever.

Please keep in mind that Rule Number One is Be Polite. Thanks!

Blorp mod post.

Manchu wrote:
Please keep in mind that Rule Number One is Be Polite. Thanks!

Sorry, just saw this after I hit submit.

 Medium of Death wrote:
IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

And...reported.

Can't keep your fat fingers out of anything. Yanks, not even once.

Sounds like someone is jealous of someone's fat fingers. People get a room!

 Frazzled wrote:

 Medium of Death wrote:
IT WAS THAT EVIL EMPIRE FROM 60 YEARS AGO. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US. WE DIDN'T TOTALLY FORCE THE UK OFF STAGE AND TAKE ITS ROLE.

Yanks truly are pathetic. Complain about Britain and then act worse as soon as you have power. I can't wait for your country to Balkanize.

And...reported.

Frazzled why are you such a light weight? You always go off on people and yet you're this easily triggered.

 ulgurstasta wrote:
I´m not sure which brings me the most joy, the MAGA-crowds meltdown about daddies betrayal or the liberals squirming about supporting Trump for the regime change they wanted, while at the same time being dismayed that their "Trump is a Russian double-agent" narrative is pretty much dead now

Indeed... the alt-right crow are losing their gak now.

Although, the establishment base and infotaiment crowd are supporting this.

the liberals squirming about supporting Trump for the regime change they wanted, while at the same time being dismayed that their "Trump is a Russian double-agent" narrative is pretty much dead now

This is the best part imo... but, the cynic in me is raising this as some sort of 'Wag the Dog'.

 infinite_array wrote:
It's interesting that the airstrike came at the end of the day with two stories breaking regarding Russia and princeling Jared Kushner.

C.I.A. Had Evidence of Russian Effort to Help Trump Earlier Than Believed

Kushner Omitted Meeting With Russians on Security Clearance Forms

And for the people jumping on the "Syria proves Trump isn't a puppet," are we going to so quickly forget that Trump has a proven history of reneging on deals and attacking allies, right up to just last week when he was threatening to go after the Freedom Caucus in their primaries? Even if Russia had direct involvement with assisting Trump's campaign, they were likely working with the same assumption that the Republicans had during the primaries; that they could keep control of him.

And I suppose no one has heard of piece trading? I wonder what's more valuable to Putin - Assad's control of Syria or continued cozy relationship with America's leader? And I wonder if Trump will attempt to "apologize" to the Russians by removing sanctions.

Hell, that's assuming the the Russia/US stances aren't playing good cop/bad cop with Assad, especially since the Trump administration informed Russia before the airstrikes occurred.

Meh, Trumpers gonna Trump. The fact that Trump is a mercurial, petty man never seems to enter the equation. It will be very interesting to see the Russian response. And how China reacts.

Now that he has authorized military action, I expect Trump will probably want to escalate somewhere. Politically, it covers his other issues and helps reinforce his "strong leader" image.

 Ustrello wrote:

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:
Good thing the Russians hacked the US election so that a sympathetic US President was elected, who would then go on to attack Russia's ally in Syria.

Yeah those darn pesky russians using a fake news system to discredit a candidate and try and put in power one that was more favorable to them

 jasper76 wrote:
US official are apparently reporting that Russians were present on the airbase that our military struck. Hopefully no escalation with the Russians will ensue.

 Ustrello wrote:
Well I mean Trump showed no qualms about killing 200+ civilians in Mosul in the past week or so. So it is to be expected that the consequences be damned

From Trump is Russia's more favorable candidate to Trump doesn't care about provoking a war with Russia in about 30 minutes. That is impressive

 Piston Honda wrote:
Should I be more or less worried compared to the 1000s of bombs dropped under Obama's presidency?

That depends on your level of partisanship

 ulgurstasta wrote:
I´m not sure which brings me the most joy, the MAGA-crowds meltdown about daddies betrayal or the liberals squirming about supporting Trump for the regime change they wanted, while at the same time being dismayed that their "Trump is a Russian double-agent" narrative is pretty much dead now

Oh that will still continue no matter what, as you can see above

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Wake up this morning to discover that another POTUS has decided to lob a few cruise missiles at the Middle East and blow up a few camels, with the American tax payer being billed for $100 million.

And the end result is the square root of horsegak!

I was not aware until I read your post that not only could camels fly, but that they are also suitable vehicles for the delivery of WMDs. What a time to be a alive.

 infinite_array wrote:
It's interesting that the airstrike came at the end of the day with two stories breaking regarding Russia and princeling Jared Kushner.

C.I.A. Had Evidence of Russian Effort to Help Trump Earlier Than Believed

Kushner Omitted Meeting With Russians on Security Clearance Forms

And for the people jumping on the "Syria proves Trump isn't a puppet," are we going to so quickly forget that Trump has a proven history of reneging on deals and attacking allies, right up to just last week when he was threatening to go after the Freedom Caucus in their primaries? Even if Russia had direct involvement with assisting Trump's campaign, they were likely working with the same assumption that the Republicans had during the primaries; that they could keep control of him.

And I suppose no one has heard of piece trading? I wonder what's more valuable to Putin - Assad's control of Syria or continued cozy relationship with America's leader? And I wonder if Trump will attempt to "apologize" to the Russians by removing sanctions.

Hell, that's assuming the the Russia/US stances aren't playing good cop/bad cop with Assad, especially since the Trump administration informed Russia before the airstrikes occurred.

1) Giving notice of military action to significant military players in the region to prevent unintentional escalation is not new, and in fact is very prudent
2) I'm just enjoying this change as we shape facts to fit the "Trump is Russia's candidate" narrative

 whembly wrote:
... but, the cynic in me is raising this as some sort of 'Wag the Dog'.

No need to be cynical, at least one paid strategist/adviser would have told Trump the same thing, so it definitely would be a part of the decision making process.

I'm getting whiplash from all over man...

Narratives are being busted left and right.

...and OH! Gorsuch will be the next SCOTUS and that's like the FIFTH big story of the day!

...jeez!

Nobody already posted this? Then Quoted for Trump:

 whembly wrote:
I'm getting whiplash from all over man...

Narratives are being busted left and right.

Eh, there has been, still is, and always will be one narrative that remains constant:
Trump is gonna Trump.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

 CptJake wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Wake up this morning to discover that another POTUS has decided to lob a few cruise missiles at the Middle East and blow up a few camels, with the American tax payer being billed for $100 million.

And the end result is the square root of horsegak!

So far the BDA is a bit better than 'a few camels'.

You'll know better than me, but what has it achieved in the grand scheme of things? The strategic balance shifted in Assad's favour months ago. Ultimately, with Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah backing him up, he'll still win in the end, and a few random cruise missile attacks will not change this.

You're missing the point of the response completely. Chemical weapons use is unacceptable, period. There should be no exceptions to this standard. The world, as a whole, has turned it's back on the use of chemical weapons as an option except for the thugs and dictators that want to work outside of the world community's dictates. A statement had to be made and should have been made. I, frankly, wish it would have been a more dramatic one, but Mattis' prowess for decision making on this matter is something I will gladly bow to. He's actually one of the very few Trump appointees that I applaud.

Kill 100.000 with conventional weapons -> hah, tough luck, nothing to see here.
Kill 100 with chemical weapons -> TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE.

I'm freaking scared of chemical weapons too, but come on, the hypocrisy level went past Mars a while ago.

Specially when it's still not that clear who did actually launch the chemical attack. Yeah, most fingers point to Assad's regime, but it seems weird at least for him to do such a thing right now. And the USA have quite a history of lies regarding chemical weapons.

Since this was a strike on a sovereign nation, it does seem odd that the US president would unilaterally order a strike, especially when his party controls Congress. Wouldn't getting Congressional authorization first been a smarter play? I have no doubt they will quickly scurry to approve the act, however. Despite GOP lamenting Obama using force in Syria or Hillary Clinton dragging us in because politics.

Also, doesn't striking Assad aid Al Quaeda/ ISIS forces? I thought that is why the previous administration was backing off- the alliances and factions are so treacherous.

 Korinov wrote:
Kill 100.000 with conventional weapons -> hah, tough luck, nothing to see here.
Kill 100 with chemical weapons -> TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE.

I'm freaking scared of chemical weapons too, but come on, the hypocrisy level went past Mars a while ago.

Specially when it's still not that clear who did actually launch the chemical attack. Yeah, most fingers point to Assad's regime, but it seems weird at least for him to do such a thing right now. And the USA have quite a history of lies regarding chemical weapons.

Yes, absolutely. Chemical weapons are a means of warfare that has been banned, essentially, by the world community. It is, by definition therefore, unacceptable.

https://www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/cwcsig

9/12/13 *Syria sent a letter to the United Nations Secretary General which said that Assad signed a legislative decree providing the accession of Syria to the Chemical Weapons Convention. In the letter, Assad said Syria would observe its CWC obligations immediately, as opposed to 30 days from the date of accession, as stipulated in the treaty.