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Made in au
Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought






Finally graduated from lurker to...wolf kibble apparently...
I'm not overly worried about the whole Independent Character argument, the wording states formation not unit and in the case of the failed saving throw 'Heralds' in particular so I just roll for 2+ Look out Sir with something that has a ++ and hope for the best, my question goes specifically to the cyber-wolves taken by the Iron Priest. Due to their status as both wargear and models in their own right would they be covered by the Herald's special rule?
-1 Ballistic skill covers the unit.
It Will Not Die is irrelevant because the cyber-wolves only have a single wound.
Ignoring a single failed saving throw is the big question.

Example
1. Rune Priest gives the Cyber Puppies a ++ save
2. Enemy opens fire on the unit and hits cyber pup as closest model
3. Cyber pup saves 4-5 wounding shots.
4. Does the pup's status as Iron Priest wargear/option/upgrade grant it status as a Herald and ignorance of that failed throw?

I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut






The Heralds formation special rule Brotherhood of Priests says, "...all models in the formation gain the following special rules:" and listed among those rules is the ability to ignore the first failed save each turn. The cyber wolves taken as an upgrade to the Iron Priest in the formation are "models in the formation" and so would benefit from all the special rules listed (although like you said, IWND is of little use).

IMHO, they get to ignore the first failed save.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/10 14:43:54


 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

 NightHowler wrote:
The Heralds formation special rule Brotherhood of Priests says, "...all models in the formation gain the following special rules:" and listed among those rules is the ability to ignore the first failed save each turn.

Actually it says "...all models in the Formation lose the Independent Character special rule, but gain the following special rules and benefits...". While not especially clear, it leads me to believe that they must have the Independent Character rule to lose in order gain the special rules and benefits listed.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut






I can see where you're coming from, but saying that you lose the independent character rule only speaks to intent. The RAW do not say that all models must have the independent character rule to benefit - it only says that all models in the formation lose the IC rule and also that they gain the "following" rules.

So any cyber wolves who might have the independent character rule for any reason would lose it, but we are not told that the IC rule is a prerequisite to benefit from the formation.
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

Again, you're changing the wording of the rule. It doesn't say 'and'. It says the following:

"...all models in the Formation lose the Independent Character special rule, but gain the following special rules and benefits...".

That wording links the gaining of the special rules and benefits to the loss of the Independent Character special rule.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in au
Ancient Space Wolves Venerable Dreadnought






So...take it up with the Tournament Organizer and hope the ruling swings my way?

I don't break the rules but I'll bend them as far as they'll go. 
   
 
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