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I have gamed since 1986 and did my first (star realms) comp 2 years ago, the second time someone was cheating, so I didn't bother again.
In the same store I did my first STAW game, I knew it was going to be a waste of time and money but stupid me I done it anyway.
The organiser was playing me in the second game and I was about to win so he said lets get a third game in.
He immediately packed up and declared himself winner of the game and that was it...but later made himself look better by saying it was a draw.
Bummer

.. Sounds like you've had bad luck really.

99% of my competitions experiences have been good.

Same here. I've played in large events and small store run events and have had fun each time. Don't rule them out because of a few bad apples. Usually it's a great way to meat new people.

I find tournaments to be cesspits of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers. That's why I stopped going to them.

I have had good and bad experiences at tournaments.

You never really know what you are going to get unless you know some of the other people attending. That only happens by participating in tournaments.

Don't draw conclusions based on a single bad experience. Take the time to get to know the other players and see what you have in common.

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
I find tournaments to be cesspits of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers. That's why I stopped going to them.

I've found the exact opposite. Tournaments are filled with regular guys with enough passion for the hobby that they have a fully painted army and are willing to travel out there way just to get some good games of toy soldiers. Nothing beats tournament gaming in my opinion and I much prefer it to PUG elsewhere.

I was a pretty hardcore tournament player for about ten years. I'd say that 90% of my games were pretty awesome and the people I played pretty awesome.

10% of those people were the stereotypes you read in comics and on forums.

The older I got, the less patience I had for that 10%. The very last tournament that I attended there was a table honest to god flipped and dude stormed out.

That was when I said I was done with tournaments, because while it is only 10% of the players that were undesirable, it only takes having to spend a couple hours across from one once to make me not want to do it again.

I switched to narrative gaming and campaign play and haven't looked back because I've never once had to deal with the 10% in campaigns.

Does that mean they don't exist in campaigns? Absolutely not... but I find them much rarer.

Your mileage may vary.

 Bottle wrote:

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
I find tournaments to be cesspits of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers. That's why I stopped going to them.

I've found the exact opposite. Tournaments are filled with regular guys with enough passion for the hobby that they have a fully painted army and are willing to travel out there way just to get some good games of toy soldiers. Nothing beats tournament gaming in my opinion and I much prefer it to PUG elsewhere.

Pick up games = also a cesspit of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers.

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:

 Bottle wrote:

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
I find tournaments to be cesspits of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers. That's why I stopped going to them.

I've found the exact opposite. Tournaments are filled with regular guys with enough passion for the hobby that they have a fully painted army and are willing to travel out there way just to get some good games of toy soldiers. Nothing beats tournament gaming in my opinion and I much prefer it to PUG elsewhere.

Pick up games = also a cesspit of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers.

Ouch, sucks to be you. You need to do something about your luck, there.

I've been gaming since the early 90s and I can count the number of bad opponents on both hands.

Sounds like some people either have very bad luck, or perhaps:

Peoples' tolerance of other people is also varied.

I may find someone to be totally on fun to play against. You may find them completely fine because what annoys you doesn't annoy me and vice versa.

The Great British Hobbit League has some great Tournaments, friendly players, great organisers, great after tournament activities (booking out entire restaurants and spending the night partying in pubs and clubs). A GBHL always ends with a 50+ person pub crawl.

In fact I'd propose them as a gold standard for gaming tournaments.

I don't participate in tournaments largely because I typically don't want to play three or more games in a day. I don't play slow, but I also don't want any time constraint either. Combine the two, and I don't want to spend 8 hours plus gaming.

I am okay with the occasional 4-6 hour game. Which are usually real nail biters and the reason the game is so long. Typically I only want to spend 2-3 gaming hours either giving me the rest of the day for something else or getting to bed at a reasonable time. I am certain this is more a function of age more than anything else though.

I didn't have any real issues with the one tournament (Dreadball) I entered. I was really new to the game and while I had my own team, it wasn't as well painted as the TO spare so I used theirs. I didn't do well enough to really worry about the competitive players since I was seeded toward the bottom with the other brand new players. However, the championship game did have some shenanigans between those players did did sour me to the idea some.

I would much rather play in a games day or BOW Boot Camp environment. Particularly with a game such as 40K as I have a hard time taking the idea of tournament play serious giving the state of its rules and balance.

I am far more interested more narrative gaming where both players work at making an interesting game. It is still fairly competitive, but not cutthroat, where it comes down to the last few dice rolls. This might mean uneven points, one side having favorable table position, etc. whatever it takes to create an interesting game.

I find the mark of a great player is not the one that can crush their opponent tabling them. Rather one that knows the game well enough and read their opponent's skill to the point they can create a scenario/mission that comes down to the last couple dice rolls.

My first tournament was a 3rd ediiton 40k tournament at a little store. My friend was going and roped me into it.

Turned up and it was all the store regulars, plus the two of us. Games were played in little 3x3 tables usually for people having lunch. A single house or ruin was placed in the center for terrain.

During the first game, my opponent kept citing store rules while playing, like, getting Crew Stunned or Shaken on my Land Raider lots of times - store rule was low rolls are upgraded after one is suffered, so he ended up killing the Land Raider with Shaken and Stunned rolls.

After that game I politely packed up, asked my friend for his car keys, put my stuff there, and went and did other things for a couple of hours.

That soured me on tournaments for over a decade. My brother wanted me to join himself and his son in an Infinity tournament, so I went. I had the most enjoyable 3 games. Great opponents, great atmosphere. I now look forward to being able to do these sorts of events. Playing new people is a lot of fun, though it's obviously dependant on who you play against.

I'll chime in here and say that all of my Warhammer 40,000 tournament experiences have been really poor.

I've played in several and even just spectated several and aside from the eye candy, I don't have many good things to say about them.

I've been cheated against, witnessed cheating against others. Overheard arguments about such trivial things that the game experience was completely ruined. I've seen teams and friends come to blows and livelihoods devastated because of the tournament scene.

I find it all very distasteful and attribute the dwindling of our great hobby to it.

I have never had a narrative game that I didn't enjoy.

First and only experience with a tournament exactly fit the stereotypes. I didn't have to go up against any ragebeasts, but half the players seemed bored to even be there. One guy basically spent a game with his chin in his hand like he was exhausted, and barely even responded to my attempts at a conversation.

Meanwhile half my home games take 3x the appropriate time, as we are having such uproarious fun. On of my best games was a 2,000pt 40k game that took 5 hours on a sunday.

I've had a few bad experiences, but mostly I've enjoyed my tournament experiences.

Bad experiences included:

A Black Templars player whining when he realized his stomping of my Sallies was only going to lead to a draw and begging me to let him move a vehicle after his turn was over.

A Tau player insisting that there was a FAQ that radically altered his fallback rules worked, refused to play any other way, and the TO shrugged and walked away.

Going to another store's local tournament, where the store regulars tanked the scores of the visitors.

But those were only 3 tournaments out of over a dozen.

I've had more tough gaming episodes in pick up games and casual minded play than at organized events myself. In fact, most of my most memorable and enjoyable games have come from gaming and socializing at organized play events. My absolute worst tim ever was at organized play as well, but that doesn't invalidate all the past positives or make we never want to play in them anymore.

I think it's fair to say organized play brings out the best and worst in gaming. Learn to enjoy the best parts and work past the worst amicably and it's a great part of the hobby.

 Bookwrack wrote:

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:

 Bottle wrote:

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
I find tournaments to be cesspits of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers. That's why I stopped going to them.

I've found the exact opposite. Tournaments are filled with regular guys with enough passion for the hobby that they have a fully painted army and are willing to travel out there way just to get some good games of toy soldiers. Nothing beats tournament gaming in my opinion and I much prefer it to PUG elsewhere.

Pick up games = also a cesspit of people with something to prove via the medium of toy soldiers.

Ouch, sucks to be you. You need to do something about your luck, there.

Not really, got a great bunch of players around - none of which are pick up play or tournament based. Our club saw plenty of that stuff and steered away from it intentionally.

Quite a few bad stories involve the TO or store owner. Really in a tournament that have any prize structure, the organiser and/or referee shouldn't be playing. There's enough room for conflicting interests if their family/friends are playing, but you can't seriously play against the TO if they're not straight as a die.

I've had a couple bad experiences, but there's a lot to be said for a good event with a good TO.

Tournament play is no different from random club/gaming store play. You get:

1.) Guy with assault army that can't measure movement correctly,
2.) Guy who doesn't know his own codex rules but knows yours 'perfectly' and argues with you while you try to do things correctly,
3.) Guy who wants to re-position models after he's halfway through his shooting phase, and
4.) Guy who picks up your models without asking.

Only Guy #4 is truly evil. Keep your grubby hands off my models.

I don't play Warhammer tournaments. GW games are not balanced enough for it. Both Warhammers seem to have been designed with a fun time with friends having epic stories unfold in mind. Which is fun, I have a great time playing Warhamner, but not against anyone who worries about getting a good list or treats it like a test of skill (not saying the isn't any, just not a high enough proportion); ditto if I try that. People insist that GW hand them rules to compete with though.

Tournaments are great if the game being played is designed with competition in mind and is balanced enough that everyone can bring the best they can and no-one is unbeatable (because of only their list). Everyone plays to win, every game is a challenge. I enjoy KoW and Infinity tournament a lot, but never playing Warhammer like that again.

Yeah, 40k and (either) Warhammer games are best between two good buddies who are having a great time WHILE playing a miniatures game. Not at a tourney, where it's a good chance the other guy doesn't give a damn about the driving imagination or fluff behind your army makeup/conversions- they just want to get the basic info they need to respond to for the best chance at a win, most of the time amongst the blandest terrain ever.

Which is all fine and good for some, but definitely abhorrent to me. I want awesome looking armies, among terrain that was placed with the direct goal of making a really awesome table to play across, hopefully in a game that will be remembered for a while, rather than Game #345.

Tournaments (usually) are so boring in the name of expediency.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, 40k and (either) Warhammer games are best between two good buddies who are having a great time WHILE playing a miniatures game. Not at a tourney, where it's a good chance the other guy doesn't give a damn about the driving imagination or fluff behind your army makeup/conversions- they just want to get the basic info they need to respond to for the best chance at a win, most of the time amongst the blandest terrain ever.

Which is all fine and good for some, but definitely abhorrent to me. I want awesome looking armies, among terrain that was placed with the direct goal of making a really awesome table to play across, hopefully in a game that will be remembered for a while, rather than Game #345.

Tournaments (usually) are so boring in the name of expediency.

This. Also = pick up games.

 Jimsolo wrote:
I've had a couple bad experiences, but there's a lot to be said for a good event with a good TO.

This has been my experience in 30k, 40k, and when I played Star Wars CCG.

Don't let a knob head ruin your day.

Before I quit 40K due to other commitments, I used to partake in tournaments. I freely admit I was a bit of a powergamer, but I always ensured I played to the rules, and stayed well clear of rule abuses, even if I could have used them to literally win the game from the get go.

However, many people I fought against didn't think like that. Many times after games I hoped I wouldn't play them again as even tho I played to win, I ensured it was a fair fought game, not full of shenanigans. Sometimes, they were saying things so blatantly wrong I was sure they were trolling...

"Highlights" that I remember include:
- one player insisting the melta rule is for all ranges
- another not rolling his "gets hot!" Saves on his plasma guns
- far too many abuses of the minimum/Max distance between models in a squad rule
- lots of modelling for advantage abuses
- a few illegal wargear choices for characters (admittedly this was more genuine mistakes than deliberate, as sometimes the wording GW uses is AWFUL.)
- one guy claiming terminator armour doesn't grant a 5+ save against certain guns. Ones he had funnily enough.
- Blatant wargear hopping on characters.

While these were the ones I remember, at least they were minor. Several friends gave horror stories of TO gaming the regulars to play against New/non-regular players, and even downright collusion between players. I didn't experience that, but if I did, I probably would have stopped tournament play sooner than I did.

I have very low tolerance for other wargamers as my gaming tastes are very particular. I am wierd that way.

Therefore, Comps and Pick-ups just do not work for me in general.

However, I am sometimes envious of those who love them and can get behind them.

I think I've only had one bad tournament experience, with an opponent that I'm sure was stretching the rules (an objective seemed to move further than it should have done, meaning it was reached a turn earlier. I got demolished anyway, so it didn't make much difference but left a sour taste).

I guess it's down to your scene, but the tournaments I've encountered mirror my local games club to an extent - slightly older guys who just want to wedge 3 or 4 games into a days event and play some new opponents, and no-one was that bothered about winning. They still took it seriously though, but the focus was clearly on getting games in.

Edit: I should add that I've only been to Bolt Action and Malifaux tournements.

I gave up on tournaments a long time ago. I don't play often enough to be more than a speedbump to tournament players for the most part. Also, I've had enough times I've later gone back to discover my opponent was, at best, misreading their army rules - if not actively taking advantage of the fact I wasn't familiar with their codex.