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So, flamer, and equivalent, wargear says that it hits automatically. Well and good.

But how does this interact with things that cause to hit modifers?

For example, if there were a heavy flamer (that is, a flamer that is also a heavy weapon) - do you suffer a -1 modifier to hit if you move? Or do you always hit automatically? Which rule takes precedence?

Same for overwatch - the rules say that overwatch always hits on 6s, regardless of other modifiers. Does this hold true for flamers auto-hits as well? Because flamers getting D6 auto hits v. D6 hits-on-6s in overwatch makes a pretty huge difference.

A weapon that 'automatically hits' always hits. It doesn't matter what the to hit number is. (If that was the case the would have said the flamer has a base to hit of '1+' or something).

Follow this simple step-by-step guide.
1. Determine to hit number under 'BS'
2. Apply any modifiers
3. If overwatch replace any 'to hit' number with a '6'
4. Weapons that 'automatically hit' have hit - all other weapons need to roll dice.

My understanding is that flamers auto hit in Overwatch too. The heavy flamer is only penalized by the fact that you can't advance and still shoot it like you could a flamer or combi flamer. This is what makes flamers, especially heavy flamers, pretty awesome.

Well hitting automatically isn't really a modifier is it? You could be at minus 6 to hit with a flamer and when it comes time to roll for hits, you hit automatically, no rolls are made.

The the overwatch thing came up when i charged my mates LR redeemer last night.... ouch

really liking flamers in this ed

Overwatch range is limited by weapon range, so outside of 8" the Flamer can't Overwatch. Which presents an interesting choice: try to charge 9" to avoid it, or charge inside of the range and take the hits?

 Kap'n Krump wrote:
So, flamer, and equivalent, wargear says that it hits automatically. Well and good.

But how does this interact with things that cause to hit modifers?

For example, if there were a heavy flamer (that is, a flamer that is also a heavy weapon) - do you suffer a -1 modifier to hit if you move? Or do you always hit automatically? Which rule takes precedence?

Same for overwatch - the rules say that overwatch always hits on 6s, regardless of other modifiers. Does this hold true for flamers auto-hits as well? Because flamers getting D6 auto hits v. D6 hits-on-6s in overwatch makes a pretty huge difference.

There is no die to modify so there is no modification done.

That being said my group has house ruled that a +1 to hit adds 1 to the number of hits and the -1 to hit reduces the number of hits. So if you advance with a flamer you pay somewhat of a price, but don't totally lose out, but at the same time if you buff the hit you gain a little.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Overwatch range is limited by weapon range, so outside of 8" the Flamer can't Overwatch. Which presents an interesting choice: try to charge 9" to avoid it, or charge inside of the range and take the hits?

Outside 8" is a 8" charge you only need to be within 1" for a successful charge. So you could stand 8.1" away and if you roll an 8 your in. Which isn't too hard 41% chance of making the charge, most units that want to charge will have a re-roll anyways.

You must be in base to base contact with the first model charging in.

 soulrefrain wrote:
You must be in base to base contact with the first model charging in.

This is incorrect. The first model must only get within 1"

EDIT: rules quote "The first model you move must finish within 1" of an enemy model from one of the target units."

 soulrefrain wrote:
You must be in base to base contact with the first model charging in.

Nope, must end charge move within 1" of enemy.