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2017/10/20 16:08:55
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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I'm trying to go through and put together forces of different sizes based on typical game sizes and I was immediately frustrated by the fact that point costs weren't with all the other info on the index cards. Nooooooooooo you had to flip to the back of the index and find the unit/weapon for the point cost then flip back to your army to find the next unit. And with SM chapters it's even worse since some stuff will be in the chapter section and other stuff will be in the generic SM section for even more flipping back and forth.
What a huge PITA
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We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 16:09:35
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Where have you been the past few months?
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2017/10/20 16:13:04
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch
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Try some small post-it notes for bookmarks.
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2017/10/20 16:13:14
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Norn Queen
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Download Battlescribe
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Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be
By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.
"Feelin' goods, good enough". |
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2017/10/20 16:14:35
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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I'm so far behind, it's still 2001.
Seriously, I haven't played a game since 2001 LOL
and that was my 1 and only game of 3rd ed as I was trying to re-learn the rules.
Then I lost all my stuff and had to start collecting all over again somewhere around 5th ed (of which I never did get the rules or a game)
Then I had to focus on my career.
Now I am once again trying to get back in since I found a FLGS (but have yet to visit).
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/20 16:15:37
We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 16:14:39
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Legendary Master of the Chapter
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Oh no! flipping through paper?!
Honestly just put a tab on it or better yet chuck it all into an excel and never worry about it again.
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Unit1126PLL wrote: Scott-S6 wrote:And yet another thread is hijacked for Unit to ask for the same advice, receive the same answers and make the same excuses.
Oh my god I'm becoming martel.
Send help!
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2017/10/20 16:16:05
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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Desubot wrote:Oh no! flipping through paper?!
Honestly just put a tab on it or better yet chuck it all into an excel and never worry about it again.
A little harder to do with epub on a laptop :(
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We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 16:17:44
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
Washington State
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They did that so they can adjust points values over time without changing the main rules for the units and having to reprint books. A simple download page or Chapter Approved book can adjust the codex/index without calling for a reprint.
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2017/10/20 16:23:04
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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I used battlescribe before. It was ok, but there were things that were wrong and other things that couldn't be done so I was never completely confident in it.
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We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 16:23:17
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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They wanted money. Glad I didn't pay as I would have gotten double stung. Bad rules and then codices super close to launch anyways making them redundant.
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2017/10/20 16:24:23
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Fixture of Dakka
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I just have a list of what units I use cost and add that. It's now slightly less of a pain and badly designed.
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tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam |
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2017/10/20 16:24:28
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch
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Can you do digital bookmarks?
Excel file idea still works. Ctrl+F will help a bit. Is there a clickable table of contents you can utilize? My Imperial Armour epub (on phone) lets me open the table of contents and just click on a unit to go right to it.
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2017/10/20 16:34:01
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Heroic Senior Officer
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Desubot wrote:Oh no! flipping through paper?!
Honestly just put a tab on it or better yet chuck it all into an excel and never worry about it again.
To be fair it is pretty annoying when older codexes had most/all of their points costs on the unit entry/datasheet page.
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'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell |
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2017/10/20 16:34:52
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Fixture of Dakka
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MrMoustaffa wrote: Desubot wrote:Oh no! flipping through paper?!
Honestly just put a tab on it or better yet chuck it all into an excel and never worry about it again.
To be fair it is pretty annoying when older codexes had most/all of their points costs on the unit entry/datasheet page.
Not to mention I have to check every piece of wargear for a pointless cost so I don't take a unit for 40 odd points below its cost.
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tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam |
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2017/10/20 16:54:05
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Lord of the Fleet
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I just typed all of the points into a spreadsheet and then setup lookups. I type lascannon or whatever and it just fills in the points for me.
Then when the points get updated I just type the new points into the points page and all of my lists get updated.
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2017/10/20 16:59:30
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Legendary Master of the Chapter
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Scott-S6 wrote:I just typed all of the points into a spreadsheet and then setup lookups. I type lascannon or whatever and it just fills in the points for me.
Then when the points get updated I just type the new points into the points page and all of my lists get updated.
Its what i do. that way i can list build while at work
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Unit1126PLL wrote: Scott-S6 wrote:And yet another thread is hijacked for Unit to ask for the same advice, receive the same answers and make the same excuses.
Oh my god I'm becoming martel.
Send help!
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2017/10/20 17:33:43
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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I plan on getting a pack of 3x5 index cards and putting all information each unit I have on an index card.
Then when I go to maybe finally play a game I just have to sift through the cards and pull out the units I want to use (adding up as I go)
But I wanted to get an idea of what I had in my collection and after a couple units and having to scroll back and forth finding pages and everything, I gave up.
When I pick up the index cards, I'm going to have to print out just the pages I need for my army.
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We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 17:39:55
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator
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Well, I think the release of the indices has been a good idea.
We were always complaining that with the release of a new edition, GW was lacking to release ALL codices as well.
I think they have learned from the past and seem to listen partly to the customer base.
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Former moderator 40kOnline
Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!
Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."
Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss |
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2017/10/20 17:44:11
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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The separation of unit listings and points is definately very cumbersome to work with, but it makes it far easier to rebalance the game continously, as you can easily rebalance an entire codex in a FAQ or a TO can easily publish alternative point costs for a single tournament and so on. It decouples the slow evolution of the rules from the fast-paced evolution of game balance.
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2017/10/20 17:46:23
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Deathwing Terminator with Assault Cannon
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I write it in pen on the unit entry. Codexes are disposable, and Indexes doubly so. May as well maximize their usefulness while they're relevant.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/20 17:46:46
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2017/10/20 17:48:19
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Asmodai wrote:I write it in pen on the unit entry. Codexes are disposable, and Indexes doubly so. May as well maximize their usefulness while they're relevant.
A neat trick is to use a.... drumroll ... pencil.
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2017/10/20 17:51:38
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Heroic Senior Officer
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Scott-S6 wrote:I just typed all of the points into a spreadsheet and then setup lookups. I type lascannon or whatever and it just fills in the points for me.
Then when the points get updated I just type the new points into the points page and all of my lists get updated.
Yeah but that doesn't help when you've just bought the codex and you're wanting to play it that day, or youre throwing together a quick army list at the store because you showed up with 1500 points but some random guy wants to play a 1,000pts instead. Or your laptop/phone dies, or you're bad with computers, or any other number of excuses for why I'd need to use the book
Basically what I'm saying is I don't like having to rely on computers or a Jerry rigged notecard system.
I get why they did it that way, all the points on one/two pages makes it way easier to tweak and doesn't require you to mess with 20 something pages, but it can still be annoying when you're trying to make an army list. I just like the costs being in the unit entry because if I need to slap a list together at the store it's nice just flipping to say a Leman Russ, saying "cool it's 152pts the way I have it" then moving onto the next entry. As it is now you look up your unit and it's wargear, then bookmark the entry page as you flip to the back to look up the base unit cost and then look up how much it costs to arm it with it's wargear, which leads to you bookmarking like 3 pages with your fingers as you flip back and forth between them checking units.
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'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell |
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2017/10/20 17:58:15
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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pismakron wrote: Asmodai wrote:I write it in pen on the unit entry. Codexes are disposable, and Indexes doubly so. May as well maximize their usefulness while they're relevant.
A neat trick is to use a.... drumroll ... pencil.
Unfortunately pencils don't work with the electronic format.
It's hard to get the pencil to show up against the screen, and when it finally does it doesn't scroll with the page :(
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We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 17:59:02
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
Texas
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Sure, it can be annoying. Bookmark the point cost pages for your pdf files to make it easier on yourself. The excel option isn't bad either. I made one for my army lists that include tabs for the equipment and another for special rules - my turns normally take half as long as the people I play against, and having everything on a spreadsheet helps a ton!
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No Pity! No Remorse! No fear! |
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2017/10/20 18:02:19
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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pismakron wrote: Asmodai wrote:I write it in pen on the unit entry. Codexes are disposable, and Indexes doubly so. May as well maximize their usefulness while they're relevant.
A neat trick is to use a.... drumroll ... pencil.
+1
I penciled in points costs on the data sheets.
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2017/10/20 18:13:11
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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It's annoying. It's not HARD, it's just a minor frustration, especially when they had it good before.
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Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! |
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2017/10/20 19:15:55
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel
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We all thought it was like that so they could do monthly updates to points to keep the game balanced. Turns out this was just oir hope and dreams talking.
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2017/10/20 19:17:57
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Regular Dakkanaut
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It makes sense that it would be easier to update points cost, but that's all it's easier for. any changing of stats or wargear options or anything else will still have to be done on the unit cards anyway.
*edit*
but from what I've seen in the past, they won't touch these indexes again anyway. They'll just FAQ things here and there
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/20 19:19:15
We're gonna need another Timmy!
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2017/10/20 19:23:05
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Been Around the Block
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Doesn't really matter, just use battlescribe and GW will be releasing their own army building app soon, I think. Their painting app was of generally good quality so I have decent hope for their army builder too
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2017/10/20 19:37:19
Subject: What were they thinking with the indexes?
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Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh
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Battlescribe is cumbersome, to me, in a number of ways.
First, if you think there's an error then you have to register your info to tell them. So it's not easy to get corrections without giving up privacy.
Second, from what I can tell the print out of an army can get quite long in terms of page count. I tried a 2000 point GK army with info and it was over 10 pages. If I were to take that to an event then I'd need to print 30+ pages just for that day.
I'm sorry but battlescribe is not the answer as far as I'm concerned. It is a nice toy to use at home but not for taking an army out to play.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/20 19:37:37
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