Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Detachment - 630
HQ - 145
Baharroth - 110
Warlock - 35

Fast Attack - 485
10x Swooping Hawks + Hawk’s Talon – 133
10x Swooping Hawks + Hawk’s Talon – 133
7x Shining Spears + Star Lance - 219

Battalion - 1370

HQ - 240
Eldrad – 150
Spirit Seer – 45
Spirit Seer - 45

Troops – 228
5x Rangers – 60
9x Storm Guardians - 63
10x Guardian Defenders + BL - 105

Elites – 144
6x Fire Dragons – 144

Heavy Support – 558
Fire Prism – 160
10x Dark Reapers + Shuriken Cannon – 258
Wraithlord + 2 BL – 143

Flyer – 200
Hemlock - 200


Lighter on CP and Troops than I would like, but I think I'd enjoy playing this list. Not sure how to run the two factions. I plan to be flexible with Reaper and Spear placement, potentially keeping both in reserve for Webway deployment. Creating a blob in the middle of the field with my minimal Troops/HQ/Wraithlord with the plan to have the Reapers in that proximity for countercharge protection. Use Protect and Guide on the Reapers first turn, with Protect and Quicken most likely going on the Spears but play that by ear, with Hemlock trying to get Jinx on their target. Conceal on the Warlock going to the Reapers. Wraithlord is a "rule of cool" and countercharge with the HQ for the blob of Troops/Reapers/HQ in the middle of the field. Swoops with Baharroth shredding hordes using his re-roll 1s. Not a fan of Wave Serpents so I'm hoping to avoid them.

Main questions I have:

Something instead of the Fire Dragons? I felt light on Anti-Tank which is why the are in there. Wraithguard? Crimson Hunter?

Which faction to use? Could swap Eldrad and Baharroth making the detachment Ulthwe for the 6+++. I'd imagine I will hear Alaitoc for the rest of the force, but I'm a fan of Spears and getting them in CC is a big goal.

Wraithlord - Run it barebones and save the 40 from two more Brightlance shots?

Eldrad - I scrounged up the extra 50 points but is it worth it? 3 powers afford me Guide to go with Doom/Protect, as well as increased likelihood to cast them but pigeonholes me into Ulthwe. I could scrounge up points for an Autarch for the Reaper blob if I downgrade him to a standard Farseer, thereby boosting the 3 BL shots on the Wraithlord/Guardian unit.

Shining Spears - I was running them as min units of 3, but I like bigger units in general. Better served with more Star Lances/Exarchs?

Any other major holes?

invertigo22 wrote:
Lighter on CP and Troops than I would like, but I think I'd enjoy playing this list. Not sure how to run the two factions. I plan to be flexible with Reaper and Spear placement, potentially keeping both in reserve for Webway deployment. Creating a blob in the middle of the field with my minimal Troops/HQ/Wraithlord with the plan to have the Reapers in that proximity for countercharge protection. Use Protect and Guide on the Reapers first turn, with Protect and Quicken most likely going on the Spears but play that by ear, with Hemlock trying to get Jinx on their target. Conceal on the Warlock going to the Reapers. Wraithlord is a "rule of cool" and countercharge with the HQ for the blob of Troops/Reapers/HQ in the middle of the field. Swoops with Baharroth shredding hordes using his re-roll 1s. Not a fan of Wave Serpents so I'm hoping to avoid them.

Main questions I have:

Something instead of the Fire Dragons? I felt light on Anti-Tank which is why the are in there. Wraithguard? Crimson Hunter?

You could make the FireDs your 2nd choice of the Webway strike, after the S-Spears.

invertigo22 wrote:
Which faction to use? Could swap Eldrad and Baharroth making the detachment Ulthwe for the 6+++. I'd imagine I will hear Alaitoc for the rest of the force, but I'm a fan of Spears and getting them in CC is a big goal.

S-Spears should be Siam-Hann, and then the other detachment for what you like, Alaitoc, of course, a great choice.

invertigo22 wrote:
Wraithlord - Run it barebones and save the 40 from two more Brightlance shots?

Add the sword? 'Tis a measly amount of points for adding so much to his h2h potential.

invertigo22 wrote:
Eldrad - I scrounged up the extra 50 points but is it worth it? 3 powers afford me Guide to go with Doom/Protect, as well as increased likelihood to cast them but pigeonholes me into Ulthwe. I could scrounge up points for an Autarch for the Reaper blob if I downgrade him to a standard Farseer, thereby boosting the 3 BL shots on the Wraithlord/Guardian unit.

I think this is the better call, 2 HQs for the near price of Eldy.

invertigo22 wrote:
Shining Spears - I was running them as min units of 3, but I like bigger units in general. Better served with more Star Lances/Exarchs?

Three of them can likely die to overwatch from a F.BloatDrone, so yeah, 7+ dudes. Don't overlook Empower and Enhance for them, meaning the two spiritseers taken out and replaced with 3 warlocks. I think having 2 warlocks with Protect/Jinx is good, having enabling both sides of the coin to be cast in favor of the S-Spears.

you can make the Wild Rider Host the Outrider Detachment

Take a Warlock or Autarch and make a spearhead detachment with your 3 heavies. If you need CPs that gives you 1 more...make it Ulthwe and now you have the warlord trait available to roll for CPs every players turn.

The focus of the Battalion with hidy rangers, charging stormies and shooty defenders is all over the place so you really need to think what benefits your style of play and the other pieces that you fit into it that can benefit....it really is your call.

Not bad.
I know you said you would avoid wave serpents if you could but I think the army really wants one.

I would personally take one instead of the wraithlord and start the dark reapers deployed in it and then move the fire dragons into it and go hunting tanks.
Triple shuriken cannon with vectored engines will set you back 144. So it’s almost a like for like swap. Saves you 2 cp for the dark reapers plus means your fire dragons will actually do something instead of walking and getting shot the whole game.

Ulthwe seems like a good choice. You don’t necessarily have too many of the choices for the -2 to hit with alaitoc trait. Ulthwe with shining spears with protect are tough to deal with.

Thanks for the replies. Glad to see the list is well received.

I need to read up on detachments. I should have the books in a few days to get a bit of understanding about the exact requirements. I wasn't sure if I could make multiple detachments like that, but another CP wouldn't go amiss.

@Wyldcard - I think you are right about the Wave Serpent. Just makes a lot of sense to have it in there and it really benefits both the Reapers and Fire Dragons; would also get the Fire Dragons inside their useful range more efficiently. I suppose part of it is that I love the model! I'm thinking of options to replace the Fire Dragons entirely, which would solve the problem altogether, but I think my other beef with losing the Wraithlord is the lack of countercharge (minimally effective though it may be) and the loss of the BL. Thoughts on a BL or Starcannon Wave Serpent? Think that would help a bit.

@admironheart - The reason for the all over troops is just a mix of ways to shield the HQ and Heavies in the middle. The Storms aren't really meant to charge, more just be ablative wounds. Same with Rangers. I'd prefer all guards with BL but I'd have to get 80 more points somewhere. Maybe all Storm Guardians for max wounds? Would 221 points of Dire Avengers be more survivable potentially with the 4++ invul on the exarch and better armor saves?

@Brothererekose - I'd love the sword on the Wraithlord for modeling purpose. You suggest it barebones with the sword or adding it to the BL one? I agree with the larger unit of Spears and I like the idea of the Autarch over Eldrad, I'm curious if the reroll 1 aura is enough to warrant his inclusion in the list though. I suppose if I trade out the Wraithlord for a Serpent, I've got the 6 FD and could have a decent CC unit with all my HQ ready to jump in when they are needed.

Follow up:

Trade out Fire Dragons for 2x battery of D-Cannons? Goes well with the concept of a large bubble in the middle with Reaper + Battery + Wraithlord + HQ + Troops and I really like the models and concept. Two less shots on average but longer range and more survivable!

Troop situation: Recommendations? Max bodies with Storm Guardians/Guard Defenders for most wounds? 3-4 units of Dire Avengers for slightly hardier units and decent range? Could scrounge up 20 points for 4 MSU.

Wave serpent with bright lance is a solid choice. Really depends how you want to use it. I run 2 in my current list, with bright lance and one with triple cannon. Bright lance holds dark reapers then either sits with them for fire and fade tricks or loads up guardians as a late game objective/threatening unit. Triple cannons runs vectored engines and carries a unit of wraithguard as deep into the enemy lines as it can. With vectored engine and alaitoc it is difficult to deal with effectively but is a huge threat with the guard loaded in.

So really depends what you want to do with the serpent. If you are keeping the fire dragons and will mount them up then triple cannon is preferred to encourage you to drop the fire dragons where needed as fast as possible without sacrificing anything. If it is going to sit back with the reapers then bright lance is the way to go.

Star cannon is a bit awkward for me. You want to be moving with it but then cos the cannons are heavy you are -1 to hit. Str 6 isn’t as good as in 7th ed either.