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The text for the Stratagem reads : " Use this Stratagem before making a charge roll with a Blood Angels Jump Pack unit from your army that was set up on the battlefield earlier in this turn. Roll 3d6 to determine the unit's charge distance instead of 2d6"

My assumption is this could not be used on units that were set up on the table before the game begins as that set up happens before Turn 1 - not "earlier in this turn" so could not be combo'd with the stratagem that gives a DC unit set up on the board pre-game movement

Also, again I assume that although they have a 3d6 charge distance, the can still only declare charges on units that are within 12"

Cheers

From my stance, Correct on both counts.

Agreed, right both times.

Another thing to note on this strat is to remember you can only declare a charge on a unit 12" away, but if you roll 18" charge you could use it to move 18" and tag shooty vehicles with your pile in move (forcing them to fall back in their movement phase).

Its a very strong stratagem overall.

 Eihnlazer wrote:
Another thing to note on this strat is to remember you can only declare a charge on a unit 12" away, but if you roll 18" charge you could use it to move 18" and tag shooty vehicles with your pile in move (forcing them to fall back in their movement phase).

Its a very strong stratagem overall.

This is important. The Blangles don't have an exception to the 12" limit like Banshees do.

Thanks all. Good tips.

Why would you setup a DC unit so close to enemy units before the game begins ?? If you dont get first turn they can be shot, charged and killed. If you have first turn you can deepstrike them and then use the 3D6 charge stratagem.

p5freak wrote:
Why would you setup a DC unit so close to enemy units before the game begins ?? If you dont get first turn they can be shot, charged and killed. If you have first turn you can deepstrike them and then use the 3D6 charge stratagem.

Now you're thinking like GW's rules team!

Nobody will EVER do that weird thing. It would be terrible! What are you doing, guys?!

Anyway to your point... you can only use each stratagem once per phase so if you have 2 units of Death Company you might want to set one of them up out of line of sight and try to move+charge... then drop the other with Descent of Angels?

p5freak wrote:
Why would you setup a DC unit so close to enemy units before the game begins ?? If you dont get first turn they can be shot, charged and killed. If you have first turn you can deepstrike them and then use the 3D6 charge stratagem.

The Forlorn Fury stratagem says it is used at the start of the first battle round but before the first turn begins, so it would be after seize the initiative so you would know you were going first before doing the move ( you would still have to deploy them on the table during deployment before you knew who had first turn) - that's why I was clarifying that it would not work with the 3d6 charge stratagem as 12" + d6 before the first turn begins plus another 12" combined with a 3d6" charge would put you pretty much anywhere you wanted. But I agree that the deep strike is the way to go as it protects them from alpha strike

Even if forlorn fury and descent of angels would work, it would cost 4 CP. Thats insane. Other factions can do it for 1-2 CP.

p5freak wrote:
Even if forlorn fury and descent of angels would work, it would cost 4 CP. Thats insane. Other factions can do it for 1-2 CP.

Blood Angels will chew through command points for sure. I guess because a 15 man Death Company will hit like a truck - pay another 3 command points and fight twice - 7 gone by turn 1, but with 120 attacks the target should be dead

ghostvalley wrote:

p5freak wrote:
Even if forlorn fury and descent of angels would work, it would cost 4 CP. Thats insane. Other factions can do it for 1-2 CP.

Blood Angels will chew through command points for sure. I guess because a 15 man Death Company will hit like a truck - pay another 3 command points and fight twice - 7 gone by turn 1, but with 120 attacks the target should be dead

Now look at orks. A weirdboy da jumps 30 boys, they charge, can reroll failed charge rolls (for free) and are in CC with 120 attacks. How many CPs did they spend ? 0.

p5freak wrote:

ghostvalley wrote:

p5freak wrote:
Even if forlorn fury and descent of angels would work, it would cost 4 CP. Thats insane. Other factions can do it for 1-2 CP.

Blood Angels will chew through command points for sure. I guess because a 15 man Death Company will hit like a truck - pay another 3 command points and fight twice - 7 gone by turn 1, but with 120 attacks the target should be dead

Now look at orks. A weirdboy da jumps 30 boys, they charge, can reroll failed charge rolls (for free) and are in CC with 120 attacks. How many CPs did they spend ? 0.

As someone who tried that, it's not very effective. You need to space your guys correctly so you don't end up out of range, and even then it's only a 50% chance. Also the enemy then just falls back and obliterates our super OP 6+ save with shooting.

I'm not saying that the command points are worth it, but Death Company are also wounding most infantry on a 3, or a 2 if you drop a priest near by - and you are not relying on a psychic power. Sprinkle in some powerfists and they will be truly terrifying.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
As someone who tried that, it's not very effective. You need to space your guys correctly so you don't end up out of range, and even then it's only a 50% chance. Also the enemy then just falls back and obliterates our super OP 6+ save with shooting.

Its not that easy to kill 30 orks. 40 bolter shots at BS3+ will kill 11. Killing all of them would require 110 shots. Its unlikely he has some many shots. Even if he kills them all, the rest of your army doesnt suffer damage for one turn. It can work as a distraction, giving your army time to move forward.

Orks...

Orks are the more reliable damage over the course of a long game, yet they don't live the whole game to utilize it.

Bangles do the damage up front in an Alpha/Beta strike and blow their command load, then hang around the rest of the game more durably, but less effective.

Guess who wins the objectives game?

One thing I noticed, is that the 1 CP Strategem that allows a jump pack unit to essentially teleport, tells you to remove them and they are placed anywhere on the board that is more than 9" away from an enemy unit at the end of the movement phase.

However, doesn't that count them as being placed? So you could spend 1 CP to place them, and spend the 2 CP for a 3D6 charge range.

Pretty awesome.

Most jump pack units can be set up in reinforcements.

When units arrive from reinforcements they are setup on the battlefield.

You can use this stratagem for any unit that arrives from reinforcements.

DC can have jump packs.

no need to spend 4 cp, when you can give them jump packs and drop them 9" away then try to roll a 9 or higher on 3d6 to charge.

 NH Gunsmith wrote:
One thing I noticed, is that the 1 CP Strategem that allows a jump pack unit to essentially teleport, tells you to remove them and they are placed anywhere on the board that is more than 9" away from an enemy unit at the end of the movement phase.

However, doesn't that count them as being placed? So you could spend 1 CP to place them, and spend the 2 CP for a 3D6 charge range.

Pretty awesome.

Yea, charge 3d6 when you drop and then next turn spend a point and move them anywhere and then 2 more points to 3d6 charge again....of course having enough command points is the challenge


Automatically Appended Next Post:

blaktoof wrote:


no need to spend 4 cp, when you can give them jump packs and drop them 9" away then try to roll a 9 or higher on 3d6 to charge.

Agreed. More just trying to see what all the potential combos could be

ghostvalley wrote:

 NH Gunsmith wrote:
One thing I noticed, is that the 1 CP Strategem that allows a jump pack unit to essentially teleport, tells you to remove them and they are placed anywhere on the board that is more than 9" away from an enemy unit at the end of the movement phase.

However, doesn't that count them as being placed? So you could spend 1 CP to place them, and spend the 2 CP for a 3D6 charge range.

Pretty awesome.

Yea, charge 3d6 when you drop and then next turn spend a point and move them anywhere and then 2 more points to 3d6 charge again....of course having enough command points is the challenge

I have been running a double Battalion Detachment Blood Angels army. It has been pretty good with the Index here in my group. I only run a single unit of Assault Marines (now Vanguard Vets) as my main assault unit. Excited to see what kind of silliness with these Strategems I can pull with them.