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So I'm trying to make an Iron Warriors list using the R&H index plus the Chaos Marine Codex for something Fluffy but still competitive. I've always wanted to build something similar to the Trench war in Storm of Iron with tons of artillery and hundreds of nameless humans to run into the fray while the Chaos Marines hold back and strike where they are needed.

Anyways here's my idea.

Spearhead Detachment: Iron Warriors

HQ

Chaos Lord(Warlord, Cold and Bitter, Fleshmetal, Power Axe)

Troops
20 Cultists with 2 Heavy Stubbers
20 Cultists with 2 Heavy Stubbers
20 Cultists with 2 Heavy Stubbers

Heavy Support
5 Havocs with 4 Heavy Bolters
5 Havocs with 4 Heavy Bolters
5 Havocs with 4 Heavy Bolters
5 Havocs with 4 Heavy Bolters

Battalion Detactment: Renegades and Heretics

HQ

Malefic Lord

Malefic Lord

Troops

20 Mutant Rabble
20 Mutant Rabble
20 Mutant Rabble
20 Mutant Rabble

Elites

Enforcer

Enforcer

Heavy Support

2 Basilisks

2 Basilisks

2 Basilisks
-------
I'm about 50 points shy and other than adding more models to my squads, I'm for a loss.

I've also toyed with the idea of dropping the Enforcers and the Mutants for a Command squad with Vox and 4 20 man squads of Militia with Autoguns and Vox, but that still leaves me 50 points shy.

What do you guys think? any improvements?

Make your chaos lord a terminator with melta and power fist to be Forrix. He outranked Honsou!

I personally am not a fan of Mutant rabble, they can become a huge liability, because as I can see you have to take a tax in Enforcers to stop them from running as soon as they get shot at.
If you want to take them, use them in fewer but bigger units, so you can save on a Enforcer. Generally msu is great for R&H but in regards to mutant rabble, go big or go home. Also they are the Assult-Atrition troop choice in my opinion , why not take more cultists and profit off of better shooting and acsess to stubbers? Chapter approved made them cost 4 pts now so what is stopping you there?

Malefic lords are now overpriced at 80 pts. since chapter approved, take a rogue psyker coven and hide them somewhere in that blob. I also think you could use some marauders, sniper marauders with stalker cost 34pts at a min squad while adding in the potential of mortal wounds and the ability to target auras, they also don't need a morale babysitter, since in it for the money is there.

Quite frankly why not use a warpsmith, he is cheaper, fit's the theme better, can repair and or curse vehicles. Yes he isn't as tough but he will spam quite alot of shooting himself.

4 x 20 militas with vox are only good if you run 2 command squads with a command vox. Remember a command vox does not count as a vox, meaning they will only roll 2d6 compared to disciples with vox, which however can't expend morale to other troops.
Considering that you run a static gunline, banners and additional men for command squads would do quite well. One squad wiht the -1 morale one with the ability for attacking back that turn and you have an annoying to remove blob for your guns with high morale.

Why not upgrade the heavy bolters to autocannons for Havocs?

I love this idea so much! I've missed Basilisks since 4th and this is inspiring me heavily.

I wouldn't change too much other than maybe some variety in your back field. Specialize your havocs. Maybe drop a few basilisks and take a knight too! (not sure the points cost there so idk)

I'd even consider some rhinos and/or chimeras depending on what they're allowed to transport ie: keywords.

I too was inspired by this book and as a result usually bring at least 1 squad of berzerkers to lead the charge.

Anything else is just fluffy goodness because Storm of Iron is such a great book.

Cheers!

Hey guys!

After looking at the list and reading your critiques, as well as re-reading the Legion Tactic, I’ve made some significant changes to the list. It’s still somewhat Storm of Iron-y but I’ll post the new list tonight after work.

The reason I didn’t take a Warpsmith initially was because the Basilisks aren’t Legion Vehicles, but I’m taking Warpsmiths in my new list, just with Fewer Bassies and some CSM vehicles. The main reason for HB Havocs over AC Havocs was just points. I don’t have enough in the first list to make Everyone AC so I figured HB for anti Infantry would be on the Money with Basilisks for Anti big stuff.

I was looking at Sniper Maruarders but I just didn’t feel that they were strong enough in a mixed list. I’d definitely take them if I was doing straight R&H though

Thanks for the advice so far everyone!

take a warlord titan and name it DIES IRAE lol

Not gonna lie, the idea crossed my mind with a Knight lol

I have re-read the trenchbattle scene and came to the conclusion, that if you go for that feel, why not cut one mutant rabble, and use some of the additional points to expand the squadsize upwards to 30. ( it did inspire me aswell for my army at first, however i decided to go for a PDF with a cult of destruction support and a Heretek)

Or, what i would reccomend you, take the heavy support detachment, take the 6 basiliks (because one can never have to few of those in my opinion), and a psyker coven or go budget and take a warlord and make him a ordonace officer. Cut the mutants in your R&H detachment, expand the cultist blobs in your iron warriors detachment, maybee consider a demagogue, however i think the iron warriors legion trait does improve moral now? (don't have the codex atm). They then profit from the tactics and legion traits, unlike the mutants. This also removes the enforcers, saves you on points, and frees up the elite slots in the R&H detachment. Now if you want some big Mutants build yourself some Ogryns. Ogryn berserkers are insane now, especially if you consider that the buffs stick around infinite. (They also are a great alpha or beta strike unit but make of that what you want.)

As for a walker, titan or knight, honestly i can reccomend you to look at the decimator. It looks like an oversized Terminator with Powerfist/ Claw, and with the butcher cannon it becomes the perfect morale troll. It also has the advantage of beeing able to be repaired, respectively it can also repair itself, basically a full deamonengine. Oh and it does not have a damage table, meaning if it gets wounded it will not become less effective.
It has a movement of 12 is surprisngly tough and looks , atleast in my opinion fantastic, in an Iron Warrior force.

A Decimator takes one elite slot.
Decimator Siege claw, inbuilt hellflamer, butcher autocannon (Hades Autocannon but with -2 to moral checks if it wounded)
All that for 182 pts.

Here’s the new list. It’s a bit of a departure from the original idea, but what do you guys think

CSM Brigade

HQ
1 Lord, Fleshmetal, Power Axe, Combi-bolter, Nurgle
1 Warpsmith, Combi-Bolter, Nurgle
1 Warpsmith, Combi-Bolter, Nurgle

Troop
40 cultists, 4 Heavy Stubbers, Slaanesh
10 cultists
10 cultists
10 cultists
10 cultists
10 cultists

Elite
Helbrute, Missile Launcher, Reaper Autocannon
Helbrute, Missile Launcher, Reaper Autocannon
Helbrute, Missile Launcher, Reaper Autocannon

Fast Attack

3 bikes, 2 Flamers, 1 Combi-flamer, Nurgle
3 bikes, 2 Flamers, 1 Combi-flamer, Nurgle
3 Bikes, 2 Flamers, 1 Combi-flamer, Nurgle

Heavy Support

5 Havocs, Heavy Bolters, Slaanesh
5 Havocs, Heavy Bolters, Slaanesh
5 Havocs, Heavy Bolters, Slaanesh

Renegades and Heretics Spearhead

HQ

Pysker Coven

Heavy Support

Basilisk
Basilisk
Basilisk


The idea was to maximize command points for tide of traders and the Slaanesh stratagem

The 40 cultist blob would be in front of the Helbrutes and behind the Helbrutes would be the two warp Smith and the chaos Lord

I’m also thinking I could drop the bikers for just three Spawn way I could go auto cannons on the Havocs and more basilisks

That seems like a decent list, but quite far away and more along the line of a cult of destruction list.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
How about something along the line of this:
Battalion
HQ
Chaos lord (warlord, cold and bitter, fleshmetal, power axe)
warpsmith (flamer, melta ,poweraxe)

Troops
40 cultists
40 cultists
40 cultists

Heavy Support
5 havocs
5 havocs
5 havocs

Spearhead detachment
HQ
Renegade Warlord

Heavy support
2 Basilisk
2 Basilisk
2 basilisk
"Bob" Defiler, Reaper autocannon inferno rocket launcher. 178

You would get 221 free points this way the warlord (chaos lord) buffs your cultists, by making them imune to morale, the warpsmith is a tank hunter, however that guy certainly feels lonely. Enter Bob, the siege defiler, and best buddy of your new warpsmith.
so this leaves you, that is if my math is correct, with 43 points.
you can use them either for:
- upgrading the weapons of the Havocs (heavy bolters are already mathed in)
- Stalker marauders
- Heretek marauders
- equip all your cultists with full Heavy stubbers.
All of this is ofcourse is hypothethical.

You have a total of 7 CP so you can bring in each cultist blob one more time, at that size and immune to morale (also there is something to be said about a 40 man cultist blob of doom spawning right next to you on your flank) you got a blob of pure annoyment for your enemy.
The 120 cultists of course are the cover for 6 basiliks, so any enemy tank meets a grizzly end, no matter where and when. Bob ofcourse is a distrction carnifex, and with his warpsmith budy easily quite tanky.
The havocs take out what annoys the most, a decent allround gun for anti elites is reccomended tho and autocannons would fill that spot quite nicely. There is never something wrong with 12 autocannons, especially in this edition.

Thanks to all of you guys so far. 13 CPs is a little excessive, so I'm gonna combine the ideas above from Not online and and see what you guys think

Chaos Space Marine Battalion

HQ
Lord(Fleshmetal, Cold and Bitter, Power Axe, Combi-Bolter)
Warpsmith (Combi-Bolter)

Troops:
40 Cultists with Autoguns and Heavy Stubbers
40 Cultists with Autoguns and Heavy Stubbers
40 Cultists with Autoguns and Heavy Stubbers

Elites
Decimator with Siege Claw and Butcher Cannon

Heavy Support
5 Havocs with Autocannons
5 Havocs with Autocannons
5 Havocs with Autocannons

Renegades Spearhead
HQ
Rogue Psykers

heavy Support
2 Basilisk
2 Basilisk
2 Basilisk

with this, I am at 1977 and I can drop the Decimator for a stock Defiler(just would need to call the second detachment Chaos Instead) to bring me to 1999.

I'm kinda torn on which one though. What do you guys think?

I love such lists with a clear theme behind it and this list not only has that but also the ability to deal with nearly any enemy. Well atleast for fungames, i am not a particular good competitive player.

Did it occure to you, that if you run your rogue psykers somewhere near the enemy with creepeing terror, (It stacks btw) and cmbine that with a salvo out of the butcher cannon, that you can guarantee a -2 +-5d3 morale?
I mean in some cases you can outright delete the morale out of the spreadsheet of a enemy unit and if you are in a bad spot, just smite, smite everything. Or warpflux, the melta smite version. A combination of the 2 should do decent.

As for command points, quite frankly this is the only thing keeping a pure R&H list in a, atleast somewhat, playable state. Going for anything less than a Brigade in R&H is just wrong, except you want tanks in your csm main army.
That beeing said, R&H at the moment is in a tough spot. Only one option in your troop department is actually somewhat priced fairly, Mutant rabble automatically requires enforcers, and Milita is overprized by around 25% at 4 points. Especially when we consider that normal Imperial guard can run for 4points units which are superior in BS WS Armor and can take orders. Add to that the Nerfhammer on top of the malefic lord and our HQ coices got demolished.
Elites now are great, but you lack the body to support them. One thing we do have an advantage over the AM is in the cheap mortar support squads, they are bigger in size and cheaper, funnily enough the only correct prized milita unit in game at this point.

I didn’t even think about that! That’s definitely a point towards taking the Decimator over Deffy

If you feel like it you could allways add a command squad with the banner to reduce morale even more. Not sure if that is worth it but considering that disciples are decent it might be worth testing. The decimator is really a surprise for most people i play against, mostly because it was so bad before.
I really like the look of the banner admidst this sea of cultists, has something inspiring.