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Really surprised I don't see a Tactics article for Kill Team written anywhere yet. Granted, a lot of us haven't played too many games yet (I've only had 3 games - bad schedules for me right now), but this game seems to have a lot of tactical depth! What are your thoughts so far? Here's the main Tactical focuses I'm seeing right now.

Unit Groupings: Do you keep units close together or far apart? When close together, you make it harder for an opponent to get the best positioning out of a charge, and any Flesh Wounds suffered have a lower chance of leaving a unit stunned, but at the cost of the risk of having multiple units tied down in close combat, or multi-shot weapons taking out a whole group of units. When you're farther apart, you can be isolated from support and flesh wounds will more frequently stun your units, but you're safer from powerful close combat units and multi-shot weapons.
When to spend Command Points: There's a silly number of Tactics available, so you need to have plans for what to use them on, as well as being ready to use clutch ones like a critical reroll (remember; whomever causes the wound gets to make the injury roll).
Move/Advance/Ready/Charge: These are your primary movement options. Fall Back isn't a primary movement option, because it only becomes available once you are engaged in close combat. Which movement option you select is predominantly determined by three factors:

#1 - Who has initiative? When you have the initiative, your movement phase is majorly modified by what your opponent's options are going to be after you move. You have an advantage that you get to force your opponent to react. If your opponent has much less effective shooting than you, then moving so line up shots should result in your opponent diving for either partial or total cover in order to avoid those shots. If your opponent has shooting effectiveness of about the same equivalence, they will take Ready actions to get to shoot first. If your opponent has much more powerful shooting effectiveness, then your movements to get towards close combat should "push" your opponent away like magnets aligned to be opposed to each other.

#2 - Where is the cover? Mostly, the question is about whether it's possible to achieve total cover or not, or whether the distance to the target of a charge is getting increased by the terrain features in the way. Remember, outside rare circumstances, total cover is 100% immunity to shooting.

#3 - What is the objective? Whenever you move, you should have the game's objectives in mind. The game doesn't last that many turns, so scoring those objectives should be your main motivator. If you're worried about how much of your kill team will die by going for the objectives, do a quick total of how many points your opponent will get this turn by your inaction. If the number is low enough, then survival or a particularly lethal strike this turn can give you an advantage later, but if the number is high, or the game is into later turns, then you need to be ready to bite the bullet.

When should you Ready?
Generally speaking, when you have the initiative, "Ready" is the action you should take when you're already ahead. This means that you should have the advantage in terms of victory points and positioning. Your opponent is in a position where they have to do something in order to be in a better position to win the game, and by Readying, you get to punish them for any of those moves. When you don't have the initiative, you can Ready in response to an opponent who doesn't Ready, while you're already in a good position/cover, so that you can reduce your opponent's shooting effectiveness before they shoot at you. If you can move to a spot that you have total cover from an opponent's shooting, then you should probably do that instead. Again, Readying is an action best left for when your model's current position is already "winning" and you want to "win more".

When should you Charge?
While Moving and Readying are 100% reliable, Advancing and Charging are variable. In Charging's case, that variance also locks you into a bunch of later potential problems. When you charge, you are committed to moving as close as possible to one of the targets of your charge, you give your opponent a chance to React to your charge, and you cannot shoot during a turn you charge. As a general rule, if your model is within 8" of your enemy's models (accounting for terrain), then you have a 50% chance at getting into combat with a generic unit. In normal 40k, you might declare charges from far away because there's no risk, but being forced into moving towards your opponent and giving up your shooting means that you really must be careful when going for "hail mary" charges, especially when your move or advance distances will give you a more reliable move distance. If you don't have the initiative, and you can't reroll failed charges or something similar, then I would never declare a charge from further away than 8" unless you are heavily incentivized for going any distance closer to your target (because, remember, you must most the distance rolled. If any distance rolled, from 2 to 11 inches, is better than standing still, and equally as good as moving or advancing, then a hail mary charge can be a good idea, but otherwise, I wouldn't attempt it without being at least within 8" of the target. If you have the initiative, then charging becomes a lot harder. Your opponent gets the option of Retreating 3 inches. On the plus side, this retreat stops them from being able to shoot that turn, so it can be useful against Heavy Weapons that are out of line of sight (so they can't Overwatch you either), but usually this 3 inch retreat bonus means you need to be within 5 inches of your opponent's models at the start of the turn in order to reliably charge them. That's incredibly difficult, and only likely to happen if your opponent made a mistake.

If you can get a model that can reroll failed charges, this all takes some major changes. First, your forced movement distance goes up. For slower units, this could be faster than their regular move, and should be as fast as an average advance roll, which does mitigate the cost somewhat. It reduces the chance that your opponent can successfully Retreat out of range. It lengthens your average charge range to targets within 10 inches instead of 8. It doesn't help much with hail mary's, but those whom have the initiative will be very thankful for the extra distance. Note, any player with the initiative and 1CP can get this bonus!

When should you Advance?
If you're not Readying, and you're not Charging, the last choice is whether to Advance or just Move. Frequently, Moving will be more beneficial than Advancing. Generally, you only want to Advance when you don't have the initiative, since you'll already know your opponent's final position, and can move in such a way that you are either going to get to an uncontested objective, get out of line of sight, or anything similar to that. If you have an auto-hitting weapon like a Flamer, there are almost no downsides to Advancing, so you should do it all the time. If you have any other kind of Assault weapon, the penalty for advancing can be mitigated by bringing yourself into half-weapon range. Such units can also consider advancing to get out of half-weapon range or max range of enemy units. However, in this case, if you don't have the initiative, consider just charging something instead, since you can't be shot at while in close combat.

Should you Retreat, or Overwatch?
If you have the initiative, Retreat is only an option available to you if you Readied (every other action, except passing, means you can't Retreat). If retreating brings you to further than 8 inches away from all potential chargers, then you should probably retreat. Otherwise, you should Overwatch. You should also retreat if your opponent is assaulting you from total cover, since you can't Overwatch at all there. Units with auto-hitting Overwatch weapons should also always Overwatch if the opponent is attacking from within range, otherwise they should Retreat. Remember, the Retreat rule only means you have to end further away, not in which direction.



Okay, that's about everything I can currently think of right now. Anyone care to expand and/or offer corrections?

One note: kt book says if you fail charge you can move up to rolled distance. Can, not must.
Or i missread something?

 Mr.T wrote:
One note: kt book says if you fail charge you can move up to rolled distance. Can, not must.
Or i missread something?

That was how I read it, too. If you fail your charge you may move up to the distance rolled. But you can stay put or move less distance. But if you move it must be toward the enemy. I do not have the book on me so can't double check right now. I'll try to check later if needed.

I'll have to double-check as well. When we were playing through it, I thought it said "move towards the nearest enemy unit as close as possible", or something to that effect. It made declaring a charge carry significantly more risks, since a bad charge roll could leave you high and dry.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Huh, apparently this was moved. Anyhow, I double-checked, and yup, it's a "can", but also that if you move, it also MUST be as much as possible. Great to know! You can either not move at all, or move as much as possible - nothing in between.

It’s a weird rule. It says you can move up to the charge distance, so long as you end up as close as possible to at least one target of your charge.

That seems contradictory. If you’re as close as possible to one of the targets, doesn’t that mean you have to move as far as you can, straight towards it?

I'd take the wording to mean:
You can any amount of your charge roll, as long as you are ending up as close as possible to the enemy within that distance (assuming you fail of course)
I.E. you need 8", roll 5", you decide you actually only want to move 3" so you're over still over half their range, so you have to end up 3" closer to the enemy than when you started.

What I think this is to avoid is to avoid someone using it as a contingency, so if you fail the charge, you can still scurry out of sight because you end up "closer" than when you started. Hard to describe without an image, but using the same example as above. There is actually some LoS blocking terrain off to the side, just over 4" away, that would end you 1" closer to the enemy than when you started, so you use 4" of your 5" roll to hide away.
The way the rule is written, I'd take that to not be allowed, because you haven't ended as close as possible using the 4" move.

Wouldn't close as possible mean that to get close as possible you should use all the movement there's available? So no move or the range rolled.. That's our interpretation anyways.

The exact wording:
"If the model cannot finish its move while following these restrictions, the charge fails and the model is not said to have charged - however, the model can move up to its charge distance, as long as that move takes it as close as possible to at least one of the targets of its charge" (emphasis mine)
It definitely says you don't have to move the full amount. Same wording is used if you succeed a charge and for advancing and normal moving too, it all says "up to".
That's why I take "that move" in the phrase "as long as that move takes it as close as possible" to mean anything up to the max distance you can move. Personally I don't really think there's room for interpretation in that bit of it - which is why then "as close as possible" doesn't have to mean your full move, but does mean not running towards an objective as long as you end up slightly closer to the target.

I hear what you’re saying, but I honestly think that the rule is self-contradictory.

You’re clearly right that it tells you you’re allowed to move up to the full amount. You don’t have to move exactly what you rolled – at least according to that part.

But then it says you have to get as close as possible to a target of your charge, and that’s where it gets odd. Because surely this is achieved by moving the maximum possible amount, directly towards a target.

Your suggestion is that you can say that instead of moving the distance you rolled you can nominate any distance you like and move as close as possible with that amount of movement (so supposedly directly towards the enemy). But the rules don’t explicitly say that. I still think that if I’m told to move a mode as close as possible to something, that’s going to be by moving straight towards it

There are definitely a few rules that leave room for interpretation. Anyone heard anything about an FAQ? Clearly they aren't following the same pattern as for full fat 40k (i.e. week after a book release gets an FAQ), but I'm hoping they do do one at some point.

j33v3s wrote:
There are definitely a few rules that leave room for interpretation. Anyone heard anything about an FAQ? Clearly they aren't following the same pattern as for full fat 40k (i.e. week after a book release gets an FAQ), but I'm hoping they do do one at some point.

IIRC, the had a post on the GW community page or Facebook page asking for FAQ submissions a couple of weeks ago.

The "up to" in this case is leaving room for the situation in which "as close as possible" is still less than the maximum charge range. For example, an enemy model is up on the second level of terrain that is impassable on the ground level (like a cargo container). Your charge roll may be enough to get part way up the wall, but not all the way, so you move up to the wall, as close as possible, even though this is less than your charge roll.

I would agree that the interpretation of "you either move as much as possible, or you don't move at all" would be the correct one by the RAW. The "up to" is clarifying that it is not always possible to move the maximum distance shown on the dice (which might force you to move more distance that actually ends with you not being as close to the target model as you otherwise would have, such as further along the side of the cargo container in the previous example).

That makes sense. So maybe there’s an obstruction of some sort. It uses less move to get to the obstruction than to head off sideways to go around it, so the closest point you can reach uses less than the amount you rolled.

Just had a game, and that literal situation just came up. Dark Eldar Wych charged some guys up in a small bunker (very similar to this: https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/catalog/product/920x950/99120199028_WOMImperialBunkerNEW01.jpg), and didn't successfully charge. The closest the Wych could get was at the base of the Bastion.

I tried to play today with the general tactics I've described here. I lost one model and took a flesh wound on another model (7 model kill team, all Chaos Space Marines, Heavy Bolter, Plasma, Flamer, Power Sword, one CSM with Pistol and CCW), and took out my opponent's 5 Wyches, and 9 Kabalites, with Splinter Cannon, Shredder, and some kind of whip). The one time he got a charge off, I was able to respond with nearby friends with Pistols that gunned down the Wych before she could fight, and by sticking to the battlefield edges. With the exception of the first turn, where I just had great positioning, I rarely took the Ready action, and that really helped me come turns 3 and 4 once he got into my lines proper, as I was in a much better position to receive those charges.

 Yarium wrote:
Just had a game, and that literal situation just came up. Dark Eldar Wych charged some guys up in a small bunker (very similar to this: https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/catalog/product/920x950/99120199028_WOMImperialBunkerNEW01.jpg), and didn't successfully charge. The closest the Wych could get was at the base of the Bastion.

I tried to play today with the general tactics I've described here. I lost one model and took a flesh wound on another model (7 model kill team, all Chaos Space Marines, Heavy Bolter, Plasma, Flamer, Power Sword, one CSM with Pistol and CCW), and took out my opponent's 5 Wyches, and 9 Kabalites, with Splinter Cannon, Shredder, and some kind of whip). The one time he got a charge off, I was able to respond with nearby friends with Pistols that gunned down the Wych before she could fight, and by sticking to the battlefield edges. With the exception of the first turn, where I just had great positioning, I rarely took the Ready action, and that really helped me come turns 3 and 4 once he got into my lines proper, as I was in a much better position to receive those charges.

Maybe I am misreading your report and/or the rules, but how could your supporting guys gun down the Wych with pistols before she could fight? Assuming she made a successful charge she would be within 1" of at least her target model. That model could not fire its pistol this turn since it was charged. Your other friendly models could only shoot her with pistols if they were within 1" since she was within 1" of one of your friendly models. They could only get within 1" that round if she charged them or they charged her, so no pistol shots for them that turn?

You'll need to reread your Pistol rules ;-)

You can fire a Pistol "even if within 1 inch" of enemy models (that's not what helps here), and at targets within 1" of friendly models, so long as they're the closest enemy model. Note, the Pistol rules don't care if you're not locked in combat to shoot like this, just that those enemy models are the closest ones. So, while the Wych charged two of my guys, there were another 2 guys nearby to whom that Wych was the closest enemy model that were not locked in combat, and had not been charged that turn.

In other words, yes, Pistols are still very useful... just differently so.

EDIT: Note, this is the same as in regular 40k too. In both cases, it's rare for it to matter, but this was one of those perfect corner cases.

...In such circumstances.. The even with friendlies part refers to the case when there's two enemies same combat. I'd say RAI is that the whole friends/closest part is meant to say that you can shoot in a multiple combat situation, for example when there is two of both forces in a same brawl.

That's how I read it.

Xirax has it correct.

The normal shooting rules prevent you from shooting anything within 1" of a friendly model Range and Visibility, p28

The pistol rules only overrule this IF the model shooting is within 1" of an enemy AND that enemy is within 1" of other friendly models.

If I may add my grain of salt, even if you could shoot with the guys around the fight (which, as others have said, should not be possible), there is NO WAY you could have shot the Wych before she fights. You can't shoot a pistol in the same turn you charged, or got charged, so there is ALWAYS a round of fighting before the models can draw their pistols.

I know this because a player at my LGS was happy at the idea of charging 3D6 with his Harlequins, shoot a melta at point blank and then fight if the model survived, which is impossible.

Otherwise, great idea with the thread, but wasn't there already a general tactics thread ? https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/761253.page

Yeah the pistol rules are clear. “In such circumstances” tells you you’re allowed to shoot a pistol in the circumstance where you’re in cc (when normally you couldn’t). It goes on to say you can still do this even if other friends are also locked - because normally that would also prevent firing.

Models that aren’t locked aren’t in those circumstances, and so cannot fire into combat.

 Yarium wrote:
You'll need to reread your Pistol rules ;-)

You can fire a Pistol "even if within 1 inch" of enemy models (that's not what helps here), and at targets within 1" of friendly models, so long as they're the closest enemy model. Note, the Pistol rules don't care if you're not locked in combat to shoot like this, just that those enemy models are the closest ones. So, while the Wych charged two of my guys, there were another 2 guys nearby to whom that Wych was the closest enemy model that were not locked in combat, and had not been charged that turn.

In other words, yes, Pistols are still very useful... just differently so.

EDIT: Note, this is the same as in regular 40k too. In both cases, it's rare for it to matter, but this was one of those perfect corner cases.

I went through the rules last night before posting, but I just read them again with a coffee and I don't see a difference. Page 28 says that a model cannot shoot if it made a charge attempt or is within 1" of an enemy model (plus some other conditions). It also says that you cannot target enemy models that are within 1" of friendly models. This establishes the baseline case.

The pistol rules add some exceptions, but I do not think that they allow for what you are saying. The pistol rules allow you shoot "even if there are enemy models within 1" but they also state that a model "cannot fire a Pistol if it was charged in this battle round." So the baseline shooting rules prevent a charger from shooting a pistol in the turn they charged, and the pistol rules do not allow the target of a successful charge to fire that battle round.

The part in question is "In such circumstances the model can shoot its Pistol even if other friendly models are within 1" of the same enemy model." You need to meet the "in such circumstances" condition of being within 1" of an enemy model. The only way to achieve that condition (those circumstances) in the battle round of a successful charge (being within 1" of an enemy model) is to charge or to be successfully charged yourself. In those cases you could not fire your pistol.

You could have charged the Wych with your other models and taken swings in the Fight phase, presumably after the Wych fought since the Wych player had the initiative. If the Wych made all her Invul saves you could certainly plug away with point blank pistol shots during the following turn.

Cheers