Howdy y'all!
Just got back from a local ITC tournament, where I was using my trusty Missile Parade list with a few tweaks. It was a blast and I ended up taking second after playing THREE SPACE MARINE PLAYERS IN A ROW! Each with a stronger and more focused list than the last. This new codex is no joke, and it only gets worse from here, guys.
To review, here's the list, with my quick overview
here:
Onto the games!
Game 1 vs Ultramarines
Great guy, a little newer but learning the ropes fast. His list was:
My first encounter with the new space marine codex, featuring 2x invictors! A quick review of their rules revealed them to be more annoying than I had remembered. They get an extra
AP on their weapons turn 1, making their flamer quite potent even in cover. They hit for 3 damage in
CC, gibbing suits quite effectively. UM have a redeployment strat that basically makes deploying them super aggressively nit dangerous (though they do have to retreat to their DZ rather than anywhere on the field). And maybe most annoyingly they are only power level 6, meaning you cant use them for the ITC Marked for Death Secondary.
The map had a 4" tall wall in a huge ring around the center (with 2 large gates) with several taller ruins,
LOS blocking buildings, and 2x enclosed buildings around the edges. The ring blocked
LOS to suits and infantry but did not hide vehicles well.
Mission was Cut the Heart (1 objective in each DZ, one in center, bonus for controlling center AND opponents objective). Deployment was short board edges. I chose Butchers Bill, Recon, and (probably unwisely) King of the Hill for secondaries.
I won the roll off and deployed first, using the stealth suits and drones to block off a 16" line along the bottom of my DZ, then deploying close behind them on the front edge of my DZ, lined up to see through the gates on the center ring. This effectively pushed his invictor deployment area back at least 18" away from where my main army was deployed. He deployed them to the north or my DZ at the closest point, still in possible-but-not-easy first turn assault range. He had scouts camping his objective and the center, stalker squad at the top, and the rest of his infantry and the tank along the DZ line ready to advance through the ring wall into the central area.
He failed to seize (and opts not to redeploy) and I mont'ka on first turn, move everything up into the center area. I have shots on the small intercessors through the gates. I throw most of my shots at the invictors though and take them both down with the big crisis team (i got 5x markers on both with drones+marksman+networked, then wounding on 3's+rerolling is good). Broadsides take out a forward scout squad whiff badly to not kill either small intercessor squad they targeted. Recon, butchers bill, kill/hold, stealth team and drones on center to get KOH.
His turn he double taps with the tank but nothing could get into the ring wall yet, he lines up. Both wounded intercessors were able to assault my stealth team and drones through the wall with good rolls though, and he kills the drones denying me KOH and getting him kill and taking the center, he gets kill/hold and hold more while I get kill more.
Turn 2 I see his advance ready to pounce into the center, in tactical doctrine, and decide to be bold. I move the big unit and all 3 drone units deep into the center. They, the broadsides, and the coldstar (outflanking the wall behind a ruin) are able to kill the tank, the hell blasters, and more scouts. The deepstriking
CIB commander clears all but 1 scout off his home objective (with drone in front of him but in a ruin giving him basically immunity).
Then I assault his intercessors with the big crisis unit and both drone squads! I deliberately dont kill anything and tri-point them. Now he wont be able to shoot+assault the crisis, only assault!
His turn he crosses into the center area en mass but his buffed up aggressors and stalkers have nothing to shoot at! He assaults with the aggressors but fails charges with his characters (who trailed too far behind) and only kills a few drones. I concentrate my attacks and kill a 2 man intercessor squad.
Turn 3 I fall back, use my kauyon and CnC node on the broadsides, light everything up, and all but wipe him out. He pretty much calls it but plays it out to scrape together points (he's a great sport).
Result: win, 29-12
Game 2 vs Imperial Fists
This guy is veteran, has won several locals, but is very stylistic. Hes been waiting to play his beautiful Imperial Fists for a while, now he has the chance!
Captain (turned chapter master)
Jump pack smash captain (
ss/relic powerfist)
Jump pack smash chaplain (relic crozius)
Jump pack lieutenant (teeth relic)
Jump pack librarian
2x invictors
4x5 scouts
4x5 assault rifle intercessors
1x5 infiltrator
6x devastator centurions (most heavy bolter/hurricane bolter)
2x5 devastates (3x lascannon+1x
ML+cherub)
This army revolves around the devastator centurions in the vigils detachment. They just put out a ridiculous amount of shots, with mortal wounds vs vehicles and extra hits while ignoring cover. He also knows his stuff and plays wells generally, he had tabled his previous opponent.
This is a ruins-heavy board with about 9" lane open in the center. This time we get tables quarters and a "deploy one at a time" objective mission. I forget what it was because it didnt matter. He gave me a quarter with a big multistory building near the edge of my deployment, just a perfect castle point which he only realized as we began deploying. He was quite chagrined when he realized, he's a veteran player who tabled the opponent before AND after me. I do recon, butchers bill, and engineers. I should have done gangbusters, that centurion unit is perfect to max it out.
I deploy out of
LOS behind it after blocking the open area near the building from invictors with the scouts. He deploys scouts and invictors on both sides, looking to pincer. He would have been a lot closer on the near flank if not for the stealth suits. He hides the devastators and centurions near the chapter master and deepstrike the jump characters.
I win first due to the +1 from fewer drops!
Turn 1 I montka up the ruin and waste both invictors and some infantry. He moves his dudes from behind walls and opens up, taking out a bunch of drones but no suits.
Turn 2 I kauyon and just destroy everything. Most infantry gone, devstators gone, centurions down to 2 guys, deepstrike commander in his DZ pinging holding intercessors and scoring me recon. He deepstrike his characters and gets into
CC with some
FW and the stealth suits but hes just playing for points at this point.
Turn 3 I move out and take central objectives, ping down almost all his troops, leaving just characters. He pulls off some great maneuvering getting kill and hold and recon with like 5 models left. Turn 4 hes tabled.
Victory 30-12
Victory 30-12
Top table and last game! And I'm up against my good friend with his newly reinforced all-primaris Ultramarines. Hes playing a sneaky successor with stealth and long range marksman. His list is super focused and remarkably tough:
Gravis captain
Primaris chaplain
2x Primaris lieutenants
3x dakka redemptor dreads
3x flamer invictors
5x bolter aggressors
3x5 bolt rifle intercessors
2x3 eliminators
3x3 suppressors
This army is honestly kind of awesome. It's designed to stay in devastator tactics and just march down the field. He gives the chapter master the oath seal and tags the enemies meanest unit, giving rerolls on hits and wounds. Eliminators scare characters or ping hiding stuff and very hard to move with the stealthy trait. Suppressors are just point efficient at new costs, also tough in cover. Then the aggressors, redemptors, and invictors just lay a ton of pain. He uses the strat to put the aggressors in tactical mode to move and shoot twice while at -1
ap (60+10d6 shots). The extra 3" of range makes a huge difference in his mid range weaponry. Even intercessors double tapping from 33" away is frustrating. 90% of his shots are d1, minimizing the advantage of drones. The bonus
AP from doctrines really helps, negating the bonus of cover and causing a lot more wounds to slip through. The cover trait (while not as good vs Tau) makes them SO MUCH TOUGHER! Everything walking around with terminator saves unless you can get 3x markerlights on it. Just a scary, focused list.
Worst, this list is so hard to pick secondaries. No gang busters to be found, very little for Marked for Death. I had to pick Big Game Hunter and Butchers Bill, hope I could take down some vehicles AND some 10 wound stealthy marines every turn.
Another ruin heavy table with a large center piece blocking
LOS. We got standard long board edge deployment, I picked sides (took the one with the biggest
LOS blocking ruin) so he got to deploy first (if I'd had the option I would have let him pick). Hes a wily opponent so he immediately set up an invictor in front of that building. I set up the stealth suits on the opposite side, but he bided his time with small drops until I had to commit to one side of the other. I eventually committed to the building, then he deployed everything right across from it.
He has his buffing characters, 5x aggressors, 3x redemptors, and 2x invictors right across from my blob of suits and drones. His suppressors are all placed outside of 36 of the building (they have 51" range with marksman trait). My
FW and stealth suits are hunkering in ruins on the opposite side of the board, with 1 invictor and 2x intercessors facing them. He tags the crisis squad with the oath seal.
I got first turn (less drops helping again) and montka to get
LOS while the stealth suits and their drones advance to get me recon. I tag a redemptor and the nearest invictor with 5x markerlights, power up CnC node and multispec sensor suite on the crisis unit, and let loose. I divide up my fire to try and take out both nearby invictors, the tagged redemptor, and a squad of eliminators in an effort to get butchers bill AND Big Game, I felt so confident...
When I target the redemptor he stops me and uses the "cut all damage in half for a dread" strategem.
IT TOOK SO MANY MISSILES
TO BRING DOWN THAT DANG DREADNOUGHT. Seriously on average it should have been like 25 missiles to kill that thing but with the half damage strat it took like 40! The gambit fails. I leave both invictors with 1-2 wounds on them, fail to kill the eliminators, ending up killing only the redemptor.
My opponent sees my distress and pounces. He moves up everything except his suppressors. He uses the tactical doctrine strat on his aggressors. Eliminators force me to use drones to protect my ethereal. Chunked invictors still get like 16 flamer hits and get right up in my face. The redemptors pound my crisis team for like 40 shots, all 1 wound making drones terribly inefficient protection. The aggressors follow suit and with reroll hits and reroll wounds and -1
AP they put 30 wounds on the suits alone, on average killing 3-4 suits even in cover. Then lastly his suppressors open up, also rerolling wounds, with D2 shots. Just a brutal turn loses me half my suits and drones.
My turn 2 I kauyon to try and pull it back. I CnC/
MSS node the broadsides as they are now the big unit. My marker lights dont do as well as I only get 5 on the aggressors. They NEED to die because next turn theyll get to double tap and that'll be it. The commander starts to tag them with focus fire. The broadsides focus them down and use
SMS to finish off invictors. I kill both invictors near me but one explodes, doing 3x mortal wounds to just about every unit, about a total of 12(!) wounds.
I kill the weakened eliminators and my deepstrike commander takes out a squad of suppressors to get me some points. I throw some shots at the nearer of the 2 remaining redemptors but dont even bracket it, again due to the half damage strat. My suits actually dont do much damage because they arent rerolling wounds AND are only
AP-1 AND most of the enemies have cover due to the trait.
Turn 2 he moves up again, using the 3rd invictor to clear up my stealth suits and some fire warriors. He opens up the redemptors and suppressors on the broadsides this time and only great saves keep 2 of them alive. He ends by assaulting shadowsun through a wall with his forward redemptor, she has to pass a 6+++ feel no pain roll to stay alive and she does!
I have just the tiniest chance to pull this out. If I can kill his last 2 redemptors, I can kite his last invictor and his characters with my commanders and work on points. I pull shadowsun up to the second floor and line everyone up. Her shots go into the near redemptor and kill it! It then explodes and does 4 mortal wounds to her, the broadsides (killing one), the remaining drone team, and my coldstar commander. I was utterly deflated at that point. I emptied my remaining shots into his other redemptor, which popped half damage and took like 4 damage from 450ish pts of shooting.
On his turn the redemptor, remaining invictor, remaining suppressors, and his 3 melee characters reached my bastion and I was effectively tabled. The redemptor being so close really put the nail in the coffin; I'd been wondering why he chose to move them all every turn rather than maximize his shooting but the finishing blow that big ugly dread put on made it clear. My math later showed he'd only sacrificed around 15% of his shooting to finish it out so meaningfully.
Result: LOSS AND COMPLETELY TABLED
It ended something like 24-12, my last point of recon (scored by stealth drones that ran away to a corner and lived all game!) putting me over the top to keep 2nd place from the guy I'd beaten in round 2 (who had utterly demolished his 3rd round opponent, a very wily necron player). There had been a few instances of bad luck (explosions, mostly) but also my opponent had put together a very focused list that used every aspect of his codex's strengths and played together seamlessly, with multiple range bands, multiple angles of attack, threats in shooting and combat, using every trait and doctrine and relic and strategem to their maximum effect. Just a good game with a good player!
Thoughts on the marine codex:
Lessons from that last game (the first time I've been tabled in a decade of playing) include:
-dreadnoughts with the damage reduction strat are too tough for their damage output to justify going after them early, ignore them in favor of squishier invictors, suppressors, and aggressors
-Dont get greedy vs stealthy space marines, that extra +1 to their save without markerlights or
MSS changes the math of shooting them by a LOT
-On the flip of that, the extra
AP from space marine doctrines also changes the math a lot; Broadsides in cover are used to feeling safe but rolling 3 or 4+'s vs things like suppressors hurts, a lot. Speaking of which...
-Suppressors and eliminators are no joke, with some rerolls their damage output it super solid for a 30/24 point model, and from a hard to reach range.
-Watch out for space marine players who know their codex and deploy/move intelligently to maximize their honestly impressive mid range fire power.
All in all I can say the new marine books are good and quite fun to play against! They have a wide range of viable units and strategies, with some strong strats like the dreadnought damage block that take push over units like redemptors and make them good. Doctrines is a powerful advantage if used correctly and incorporated into the plan of the army.
I think we all have to plan for the inevitability of invictors from now on, they are just too versatile and cost effective to leave at home. A single min unit of stealth suits with drones feels very cost effective to protect half a deployment zone from their shenanigans (not to mention how much they help in important positional secondaries like Recon or behind enemy lines).
Evaluation of my army/tournament performance
The big crisis unit did VERY well this tournament. It just blew the first two armies clear off the map over a few turns, using
LOS blocking terrain to segment an army or just kauyoning and blowing everything up. The low drop count of the army helped me win first turn twice. Their multimodel status status also allows them to do fun silly stuff like tri point enemy intercessors to deny double tapping aggressors (like I did in game 1). They also blow invictors out of the water (usually), averaging out to kill 2 per turn of shooting even without Kauyon.
The disadvantage of a big death star unit was highlighted in game 3 where the rerolls granted by the ultramarine Oath Seal relic against my crisis made then die even faster than usual to aggressor bolters and redemptor cannons. And once they went down my list starts getting desperate.
I really liked the 1x missile pod coldstar and 1x deepstriking
CIB commander using VRT. They are both quick but have slightly different shenanigans available. They make positional objectives like Recon a LOT easier, you'll max recon every game if you're careful. The single commander with 2x drones deepstriking requires an inordinate response to actually address too, a great strategic distraction.
This list is utterly dependent on efficient allocation and target priority; when things dont go as planned there aren't a whole lot of layers of redundancy to pick up the pieces. Firing the biggest unit first and softening up a variety of targets works VERY well as long as you dont over extend like I did against the redemptors in game 3.
Lemme know what y'all think, I'd love thoughts and feedback or suggestions!
