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I play Astra Militarum, and I'm running into issues in that a lot of people at my shop play Custodes, and a lot of my high-ap shooting gets wasted.

Simple Question: What IMPERIUM unit is effective at taking out custodes efficiently? It doesn't necessarily have to be guard.

Am yet to encounter Custodes myself. What is it about them that causes you trouble? Why does your high -AP shooting get wasted? Do they have invulnerable saves?

 Darian Aarush wrote:
Am yet to encounter Custodes myself. What is it about them that causes you trouble? Why does your high -AP shooting get wasted? Do they have invulnerable saves?

They're 2+/4++ across the board, minimum of 3 wounds a model. (There is, I think, one or two FW models that have a 3+ armor, though.)

Taking a quick glance around them I even see a lot of units (like the standard troops) having easy access to 2+,3++ at T5.
I don't have practical experience, but from a theorethical point of view the ideal weapon profile to tackle that would be T>=5, AP -1, cheap, with as much shots as possible. So Bolters, Autocannons, Heavy Flamers should work well und feel less "wasted" than Lascannons with their -3 AP.
So going along this line: if you stay with IG you could try to spam these weapons. Also the Macharius Vulcan would be very attractive since he has the quite Anti-Custodes effective profile S6, AP-2, D2, and can still fire it, even when locked in CC.
Alternatively Adepta Sororitas with their broad access to bolters and flamers might be a nice addition


But again: this is just from looking theorethically at the problem.

SM libby with null zone, to remove their inv. Try to smite spam them with primaris psykers, or use psychic maelstrom, anything that causes MWs. SM heavy bolter with hellfire shells. SM ML with flakk missile against FLY. Any weapons that do MW in addition, like admech ruststalkers. Vindicare or callidus assassins, no inv against their weapons, and MW in addition on 3+, 4+, etc. for the vindicare.

Throw a lot of shots onto them with AP-1. They will "only" have a 3+ sv against it, and the custodes player will roll those 1s and 2s. SM mortis contemptor dreads with twin HBs, twin AC. SM rapier carriers with quad HB. SM stormtalon gunships with AC and HB, SM inceptors, etc.

LRBT commanders with battlecannons are pretty effective.

They have a higher BS which helps mitigate the -1 to hit from the vexilla
They have a good weapon profile for dealing with custodes units, Str 8 means your always wounding on 3's (except telemons) -2 AP means your never overspending for AP, and high volume D3 damage threatens all of the custodes units

I would also ALWAYS pay the cp to get access to the relic flat 3 damage battlecannon.

Then target priority is important, deal with anything that threatens your tanks first. Basically jetbikes, grav-tanks, and the telemons.

Yeah, LRBT Commanders (especially, as mentioned, the Hammer of Sundrance relic) should do a number on them, as should Basilisks.

If you've playing or allying Knights and have any Helverins, the Armiger Autocannon has a pretty great profile for killing Custodian Guard - S7, AP -1, flat 3 Damage makes each failed save really costly.

As stated above. LR commanders are going to be money. Go for demolisher with Vostroyan. Take all heavy bolters.

I also include hell hammer a lot when I run these guys.

Triple demolisher and hellhammer is GG for Custodes. +1 to hit for your superheavy for 1 CP. Take sponsons too.

I ran this supreme command a bunch when marines were weak and I needed big guns to support my intercessor horde. It worked REALLY good. The demolisher is now buffed so it would work even better now.

Also taking a vindicare assasin for CP is not a terrible Idea ether. Killing that Vexilla is pretty important. Could take 9 eliminators and a captain. Not a bad Idea in general - most armies that give AM trouble it is due to a character they can't shoot.

A few command squads with 4x grenade launchers. Krak grenade launchers are the most efficient way to shoot Custodes for their points. You could buy 6 bs3+ guys with grenade launchers for each basic custodian!

Thanks for everyone's advice. I'm going to look at adding more heavy bolters by weaving them into my already existing tanks and guards squads.

I'm also going to think about using tempestus scions for the krak grenades, but I'm not sure.

Probably also going to add a vindicare as that will be useful in almost any game, not just custodes.

*reads thread about a high volume shooty gunline army, that has droves of low cost models, and it's player having difficulty against custodes*

Wow. Go all in on the mechanized. I had one opponent once with three hydra squads, which I thought was hilarious, up until I had no bikes left and he was controlling all the points with cheap infantry.

Hydras, Wyverns, Manticores, and Hellhounds (and their ilk). Go Catachan.

Against fw custodes, demolishers are your best bet. They are real strong. Tallarn the. To guarantee they get range to shoot.

Against plastic custodes, tank heavy will win. Non forge world stodes have bad efficiency killing russes. As long as you remember to screen them and not get combat wrapped

As others have said mortal wounds and null zone is the way to go. Take a supreme command of space marine psykers. White Scars, Raven Guard and one other to spam mortal wounds with esculating smite.

Failing that at least cram in 3 primaris psykers.

Additionally, if you aren't opposed to allies Knights are the bane of Custodes. Custodes only really have aquilon terminators to deal with them efficiently in CC but if you screen they will never touch your knights.

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
*reads thread about a high volume shooty gunline army, that has droves of low cost models, and it's player having difficulty against custodes*

Wow. Go all in on the mechanized. I had one opponent once with three hydra squads, which I thought was hilarious, up until I had no bikes left and he was controlling all the points with cheap infantry.

Hydras, Wyverns, Manticores, and Hellhounds (and their ilk). Go Catachan.

It is kinda funny that AM is asking for help vs custodes. Custodes struggle vs 1.0 mono marines. AM it's not even really a game. Custodes should be tabled after 3 turns.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
*reads thread about a high volume shooty gunline army, that has droves of low cost models, and it's player having difficulty against custodes*

Wow. Go all in on the mechanized. I had one opponent once with three hydra squads, which I thought was hilarious, up until I had no bikes left and he was controlling all the points with cheap infantry.

Hydras, Wyverns, Manticores, and Hellhounds (and their ilk). Go Catachan.

It is kinda funny that AM is asking for help vs custodes. Custodes struggle vs 1.0 mono marines. AM it's not even really a game. Custodes should be tabled after 3 turns.

I haven't really been playing AM long. Been a long-time ork player.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
*reads thread about a high volume shooty gunline army, that has droves of low cost models, and it's player having difficulty against custodes*

Wow. Go all in on the mechanized. I had one opponent once with three hydra squads, which I thought was hilarious, up until I had no bikes left and he was controlling all the points with cheap infantry.

Hydras, Wyverns, Manticores, and Hellhounds (and their ilk). Go Catachan.

It is kinda funny that AM is asking for help vs custodes. Custodes struggle vs 1.0 mono marines. AM it's not even really a game. Custodes should be tabled after 3 turns.

That is so incredibly wrong. Custodes have absolutely every tool necessary to crush Astra militarum armies. -1 to hit from the flag is crippling on an army that already has a pretty eh ballistic skill. T6 Jetbikes aren't very vulnerable to artillery under it. 2+, re-rolling, hurricane Bolters can clear screens easy.

Sure, you fight somebody who brought no tanks and no jet bikes and you should be fine. If they bring either their common tool though, it's a very uphill match.

I wonder if scions would be good, AP-2 wounding on a 5+ is almost tailored for custodes.

 Eipi10 wrote:
I wonder if scions would be good, AP-2 wounding on a 5+ is almost tailored for custodes.

I think this is an efficient way to deal with anything with an invulnerable save, have just enough AP to reduce the armour save to the same as invulnerable and then go from there. Efficient presuming all weapons are costed relative to their strength, AP, damage and number of shots.