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As in the title... is this a flexible all-comers loadout that matches reasonably well with Doctrines in terms of something to benefit in each turn? I'm not sure about cost effective, and I'm mainly wondering plasma pistol vs. combi-plas on the sergeant. But I have the parts to build a quick one with bits I've got handy. Thanks!

Expensive, squishy, and unfocused in its role is pretty much what you’re going to hear from most people, I believe. Despite taking advantage of doctrines for most of the game, it’s not going the contribute as much as it’s price tag is worth. Tacs aren’t exactly tearing up the scene, so even in a more casual meta it seems like either give them a ML and sit back on a home objective, or give them plas/combi-plas and hold a midfield objective would be better


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But not both as you’re condensing too many points into a relatively fragile unit

It’s not bad.

We can’t give specific advice in a vacuum any more. Granted, more context always helped, but the stock assumptions were more stable, with less variables. What CT you using, what warlord, what’s the rest of your army, what gimmicks are you leveraging? As always when selecting a unit and it’s options, think about what role you want it to fill, and make sure it has the tools to do that job. Think about if it’s better to invest points elsewhere. Paying for flexibility is nice, but has diminishing returns.

Plasma remains our best generic option for special weapons. If you don’t have any re-rolls around, grav is a contender IMHO. But there are a lot of ways to get re-rolls. Anytime you are asking generic advice without a roll in mind, you should probably go plasma. It’s generically good vs. a lot of things.

IMHO sticking a few foot based MLs (and HBs) in your list for stratagem use is a good idea. Sometimes you just need a few mortal wounds somewhere, and have a CP to spend.

Points allowing, I’d c-plas on the sarge. Tacs are a shooting unit. Fancy pistols are really for people who plan on getting stuck in CC, or don’t have other options.

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While I still field full 10 man tac squads with both the special and the heavy, I’m an Ultramarine. If we don’t follow the teaching of the codex, who will? But have you considered 2x5 man squads? Points are the same, you get an extra free sarge, more options, and generally MSU is the superior option.

If points are tight, a stormbolter and a chainsword will make your sarge happy, for minimal investment.

If points are abundant, and you plan on being aggressive, you can consider a CC load for the sarge. Power weapons are reasonably priced these days. This would not be my first pic, but it’s an option. I used to hand out melta bombs with the loose 5 points at the end of list building, these days I hand out swords.

Unfortunately there really is zero reason to take a full 10 man tac squad, you are more of less always better off taking to squads of 5 as you get an extra srg and thus an extra combi-weapon and attack.

Tacs could really do with a special strat that only effects squads that started the game with 10 men which would help give them a place but I guess GW doesn't really want to give them any love to take away from the new shinny stuff.

I still use tacs, they won't set the world on fire but can have their uses.

I've run them in a few different ways which vary in usefulness between the different chapters.

Backfield support - give them a heavy weapon with good range and park them on an objective in cover far away from the enemy. Cheap and does a job whilst putting damage on something once in a while.

Cheap detachment filler - give the srg a chainsword and stormbolter and call it good - Puts out a little dakka and costs very little.

Transport squads - I like to run two similarly armed squads paired in a rhino (which are still surprisingly useful as long as you have other vehicles in your list). Push forward then get out and unleash with either two sets of Combi-plasma + Plasmagun or combi-melta + meltagun. Respectable damage where you need it and protects the squads as they are more expensive than you'd like. You need to have other vehicles pushing up to join them.

Running any heavy weapon besides the Grav Cannon on them is silly.

There isn't anything a tac squad can do that something else can't do better or for cheaper. I think that unless you're married to them they should retire to the shelf until something shakes up the current meta.

Thanks for all the insights... I'd be curious to hear the argument for gravity so I was thinking of that as more of a 7th edition thing... but I do have 4 resin 3rd party ones I bought at the tail end of the edition. But for now I'll go missile launcher and combiplas and go from there.

 MacPhail wrote:
Thanks for all the insights... I'd be curious to hear the argument for gravity so I was thinking of that as more of a 7th edition thing... but I do have 4 resin 3rd party ones I bought at the tail end of the edition. But for now I'll go missile launcher and combiplas and go from there.

Your basic grav gun is 18” rapid fire 1, S5, AP -3, D-d3 vs. most relevent things

Vs. non-overcharged plasma targeting MEQ, TEQ, or other similar elite T4 infantry units, it gets it’s multiple damage while the plasma is still D1. So if you are burning down multi-wound guys like terminators and primaris, it’s better unsupported. How often do you need to kill multi-wound infantry? That’s grav’s niche.

Once you step outside that, plasma takes a commanding lead. S7 lets you threaten vehicles better, wound T3 on a 2+, and you can overcharge to 8, which is a huge breakpoint.
Better range.
If you overcharge, there is risk, but with the abundance of re-rolls, that’s significantly mitigated.

For the 1 point more, plasma is almost a no brainer.

That said, if I was stuffing a tac squad into a pod to drop into the backfield, without help, I might go grav.

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The grav cannon is a slightly different kettle of fish.
Range matches the bolters in the tac squad, and it gets a flat 4 shots (Heavy, but there are a few ways around that). With 4 shots at 24”, even if you eat the -1 to hit for moving, you are still getting hits on target.
They have a nice little strat to help with the wound/damage. Worth the points for the extra firepower they bring to the squad IMHO.

PCs are not as good as their basic brothers.
You trade Rapid Fire 1 for Heavy D3 and +12” of range. Woo. Not as an impressive boost as the grav gets for going big. Variable shots is dicey. Literally. In a Dev squad, maybe. You are more likely to be sitting back and need the range. But on a tac squad you pay more for roughly the same firepower as the gun. And you never want to move and overcharge.

I have been messing around with a raptors list with Lias Issodon, 2 10 man tac squads and a grav devastator squad. They all go in reserve using Issodon's ability and arrive on turn 2 under tactical doctrine. I have been just taking bolters and a plasma gun. Maybe a combi plasma if I have the points.

The set up has been doing rather well for me.

Okay, cool... I had been thinking grav and grav cannon were a bit passe after the glut of grav bikers in 7th (I made some, but never played them), but it sounds like they deserve a second look, at least the grav cannon Devs. White Scars have a strat that lets you disembark after moving, so that could be fun. Maybe I'll build and paint the four I've got for some future painting contest.

In 7th, Grav was better then Plas for pretty much every role but clearing chaff, and a few niche cases. Tables have turned in 8th. Loosing the wound on armor save for S5 hurt a bit. Going from salvo 2/3 to rapid fire 1 also cut their damage hard, especially on bikes.

For the cannon, salvo 3/5 for heavy 4 is not so bad.

It’s not that Grav is really bad this edition, it’s just plasma is all that and a bag of chips. so Grav is in the same boat as all the other special weapons.

 MacPhail wrote:
Okay, cool... I had been thinking grav and grav cannon were a bit passe after the glut of grav bikers in 7th (I made some, but never played them), but it sounds like they deserve a second look, at least the grav cannon Devs. White Scars have a strat that lets you disembark after moving, so that could be fun. Maybe I'll build and paint the four I've got for some future painting contest.

Grav was pretty weak until the second SM codex. The strat for 1CP that gives rerolls to grav weapons is pretty insane on devastators with four grav cannons. With the cerub you get 20 shots rerolling all the wounds and damage for 1CP. The downside is most opponents will target them if they can so that unit doesn't live long after dropping in.

For special weapons, plasma is the best no contest. For heavy weapons grav cannons are better than plasma, especially if you have more than one in the squad.