Switch Theme:

Webway Gate – updated Fortification for AELDARI (and THOUSAND SONS)  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in gb
Dakka Veteran




Webway Gate (Fortification, Power Rating 5, 95pts)
1 Webway Gate: M -; WS -; BS -; S 8; T 8; W 14; A -; Ld -; Sv 3+
A Webway Gate is a single model formed from two separate arch pieces. When setting up these arch pieces, place them so that an arch is formed, with the bases 5" apart. This model's arch is a straight line, 1mm in thickness, drawn between the closest parts of its two arch pieces.

Abilities
  • Eldritch Aura: This model has a 5+ invulnerable save.
  • Shimmering Arrival: When you set up this model during deployment, it can be set up anywhere on the battlefield that is more than 12" away from the enemy deployment zone and any enemy models. It must be set up so that its arch is more than 3" away from any objective markers.
  • Corrupted Gate: If your army is a Cabal of Sorcerers, replace every instance of AELDARI on this unit’s datasheet with TZEENTCH.
  • Arch of Infinity: When declaring reserves and transports (or during deployment, if you are playing a mission without this step), for each WEBWAY GATE model in your army, you can select one other AELDARI unit in your army (excluding Fortifications). Set up that unit in the webway instead of setting it up on the battlefield; it can only be set up on the battlefield using the Ancient Passages ability.
  • Ancient Passages: In the Reinforcements step of your Movement phase, select any number of friendly AELDARI units that are in Strategic Reserves or set up in the webway. Set up each selected unit wholly within 3" of this model's arch. If such a unit is set up within 9" of any enemy models, it must be set up within 1" of this model's arch, with each model set up as close to this model's arch as possible; if it is set up within Engagement Range of any enemy units, it counts as having declared a charge against those units and made a charge move this turn (those units cannot fire Overwatch or Set to Defend as a result). You can use this ability in any battle round, regardless of any mission rules.
  • Escape to the Webway: In your Movement phase, each time an AELDARI unit finishes a Normal Move, Advance, or Fall Back move wholly within 3” of this model's arch, you can remove that unit from the battlefield and place it in Strategic Reserves. That unit cannot be set up again this turn.

  • Keywords
  • Faction: AELDARI, UNALIGNED
  • Keywords: VEHICLE, BUILDING, WEBWAY GATE


  • Spoiler:
    Webway Gate (Fortification, Power Rating 5, 95pts)
    1 Webway Gate: M -; WS -; BS -; S 8; T 8; W 14; A -; Ld -; Sv 3+

    A Webway Gate is a single model formed from two separate pieces. When setting up these pieces, place them so that an arch is formed, with the bases 5" apart.

    Abilities
  • Shimmering Arrival: When you set up this model during deployment, it can be set up anywhere on the battlefield that is more than 12" from the enemy deployment zone and any enemy models, and more than 3" from the centre of any objective markers.
  • Eldritch Aura: This model has a 5+ invulnerable save.
  • Webway Gate: When measuring distances to and from a Webway Gate, measure from the closest point of the model. If a Webway Gate is destroyed, remove both arch pieces from the battlefield.
  • Corrupted Gate: If your army is a Cabal of Sorcerers, replace every instance of AELDARI on this unit’s datasheet with TZEENTCH.
  • Arch of Infinity: When declaring reserves and transports (or during deployment, if you are playing a mission without this step), you gain 1CP for each WEBWAY GATE model in your army. These CPs can only be spent on placing friendly AELDARI units into Strategic Reserves, or to use one of the following Stratagems: Webway Assault; Webway Infiltration; Webway Portal; Webway Strike. If any of these CPs are not spent, they are lost at the start of the first battle round.
  • Ancient Passages: AELDARI units set up in the webway or in Strategic Reserves can be set up in the Reinforcements step of any battle round, regardless of any mission rules. If they could not normally be set up in that battle round, they must be set up wholly within 3" of a friendly WEBWAY GATE model. When you set up a friendly AELDARI unit from Strategic Reserves, this model is considered to be part of your own battlefield edge, and a model in that AELDARI unit is considered to have been set up wholly within your deployment zone if you can draw a straight line, 1mm in thickness, between this model’s two arch pieces which passes through or over that model’s base.
  • Escape to the Webway: In your Movement phase, each time an AELDARI unit finishes a Normal Move, Advance, or Fall Back move wholly within 3” of this model, you can remove that unit from the battlefield and set it up in Strategic Reserves. If you do so, that unit cannot be set up again this turn unless it is set up wholly within 3" of a friendly WEBWAY GATE model.

  • Keywords
  • Faction: AELDARI, UNALIGNED
  • Keywords: VEHICLE, BUILDING, WEBWAY GATE




  • Automatically Appended Next Post:
    Summary:
  • UNALIGNED keyword means this doesn't break Power from Pain, Battle Focus, Cabalistic Rituals, etc.
  • "Corrupted Gate" allows you to use this in a THOUSAND SONS army, since... they do.
  • The current Webway Gate has you set up any number of units in the webway (at no cost), then deploy them one at a time within 3" of the Gate, exactly like Reinforcements, with all the un-deployed units lost if the gate is destroyed.
  • The new version instead uses existing Strategic Reserves rules. This means you have to pay CP for them (with a 1CP discount per gate), but means any lost units don't get destroyed when the gate is destroyed; you can still deploy them as normal Reserves.
  • You can also deploy units "early", like a Drop Pod, but have to do so within 3" of the gate.
  • You can also deploy units within 9" (or closer) of enemy units, if they get too close, but are limited to the space between the arches – just like deploying Reserves within 1" of your board edge, in your deployment zone.
  • You can also use the gate to dynamically redeploy, picking up units and putting them back in Strategic Reserves.
  • This message was edited 21 times. Last update was at 2021/09/02 18:35:59


     
       
    Made in us
    Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord





    In My Lab

    As written, this mucks with existing Strategic Reserves by FORCING them to come in from the Gate, even on turns two and three. Intent is clear, but could do with being cleaned up.

    You're also missing a points cost-though to be fair, I don't know what to assign it either.

    Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
       
    Made in gb
    Dakka Veteran




     JNAProductions wrote:
    As written, this mucks with existing Strategic Reserves by FORCING them to come in from the Gate, even on turns two and three. Intent is clear, but could do with being cleaned up.
    Whoops, good catch! Fixed.

     JNAProductions wrote:
    You're also missing a points cost-though to be fair, I don't know what to assign it either.
    I left it the same, 95 points and PR5. I figure it's a Drop Pod (85 points) that:
  • - You have to set up ahead of time, more than 12" from any enemy units or the enemy deployment zone
  • - You have to spend CP to "embark" units into, at a rate of 1CP for every 10PR past the first
  • - Can be killed before it helps you deploy anything, even if you at least keep the CP discount
  • + Can deploy bigger things than INFANTRY, with no real size limit
  • + Can technically be re-used for multiple units in that first turn, but deployment space will quickly be at a premium, CP costs will stack, and that's all in one place, not spread out
  • + Can be used to redeploy units via Escape To The Webway if you have multiple of them (or are willing to wait a turn and use Reserves)
  • This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/24 17:31:39


     
       
    Made in us
    Longtime Dakkanaut




    I like this a lot. I love all things webway, but the current official rules are kind of unusable. These rules make them waaaaay more user friendly while also probably being fluffier; letting reserves arrive on turn 1 makes it seem like the webway is basically an extension of my deployment zone rather than some sort of wonky pseudo-drop pod... thing. Being able to use it to escape the battle (to deny your opponent kills and reposition) is pretty fluffy too.

    Making it easier to bring in multiple units in a single turn and removing some of the crippling deployment restrictions (for arriving units) turns this thing into a way to exert threat rather than being a liability.

    Consider dropping the deployment restriction requiring you to keep it more than 3" away from other terrain features? I've never been clear on what that limitation adds to the game, but it sometimes means that the board can make the portal really difficult to deploy. It's not like 3" of space makes it less weird that there's been a giant eldar structure in the middle of the imperial city we're fighting over.

    You could maybe even get away with allowing it to be deployed within 3" of an objective. It's not like deepstrikers aren't currently allowed to land on objectives. Drop pods can land on objectives. Your opponent can kill the portal with moderate effort if it's really bugging them.

    Side note: How do you guys justify webway gates being in the middle of imperial cities, churches, etc.? The battle mats and terrain my FLGS has means we're fighting next to someone's imperial apartment or workplace more often than not. It's pretty odd that someone built a street with a big alien structure sticking out of it.
       
    Made in au
    Longtime Dakkanaut





    Wyldhunt wrote:

    Side note: How do you guys justify webway gates being in the middle of imperial cities, churches, etc.? The battle mats and terrain my FLGS has means we're fighting next to someone's imperial apartment or workplace more often than not. It's pretty odd that someone built a street with a big alien structure sticking out of it.


    You could go with a couple of options:

    Multi dimensional - the gate is only present in real space when it is activated, otherwise it only exists in the web way. Allows for them to appear anywhere.

    Hidden - the gate was buried (stargate style) and was uncovered by construction/explosion/archaeology.



    The first one is probably most likely the actual 'truth'.
       
    Made in gb
    Dakka Veteran




    Wyldhunt wrote:
    Consider dropping the deployment restriction requiring you to keep it more than 3" away from other terrain features? I've never been clear on what that limitation adds to the game, but it sometimes means that the board can make the portal really difficult to deploy. It's not like 3" of space makes it less weird that there's been a giant eldar structure in the middle of the imperial city we're fighting over.

    You could maybe even get away with allowing it to be deployed within 3" of an objective. It's not like deepstrikers aren't currently allowed to land on objectives. Drop pods can land on objectives. Your opponent can kill the portal with moderate effort if it's really bugging them.
    I'm not clear on the need for restrictions, either, honestly, so I just assumed there was good reason for it. There's nothing else I know of with that restriction. I guess it's down to being able to drop a Wraithknight out of the portal?

    Wyldhunt wrote:
    Side note: How do you guys justify webway gates being in the middle of imperial cities, churches, etc.? The battle mats and terrain my FLGS has means we're fighting next to someone's imperial apartment or workplace more often than not. It's pretty odd that someone built a street with a big alien structure sticking out of it.
    It just recently emerged into realspace/was uncovered by the Imperium/was deployed to the planet's surface using Aeldari sorcery. The ability is called "Shimmering Arrival", which suggests to me that it's not necessarily a construct that's always been there, but perhaps one that shimmers into existence when called upon, otherwise existing like a mirage or extradimensional ghost.
       
    Made in us
    Longtime Dakkanaut




    RevlidRas wrote:
    Wyldhunt wrote:
    Consider dropping the deployment restriction requiring you to keep it more than 3" away from other terrain features? I've never been clear on what that limitation adds to the game, but it sometimes means that the board can make the portal really difficult to deploy. It's not like 3" of space makes it less weird that there's been a giant eldar structure in the middle of the imperial city we're fighting over.

    You could maybe even get away with allowing it to be deployed within 3" of an objective. It's not like deepstrikers aren't currently allowed to land on objectives. Drop pods can land on objectives. Your opponent can kill the portal with moderate effort if it's really bugging them.
    I'm not clear on the need for restrictions, either, honestly, so I just assumed there was good reason for it. There's nothing else I know of with that restriction. I guess it's down to being able to drop a Wraithknight out of the portal?


    I think the 3" restriction was just standard for fortifications at one point. I always got the impression that it was basically there to prevent you from putting the webway gate on top of terrain and other fortifications, and someone decided to be extra cautious by making it a 3" limit instead of just saying, "You can't stick the gate on top of terrain or other models." IIRC, it was introduced during a time when you had scenarios like models standing on top of fortifications that were destructable raising questions about what happens to the models when the thing they're standing on is removed as a casualty. So maybe it was just an attempt at future-proofing.

    Whatever the case, in practice it has frequently kept me from putting the gate in a useful spot and occassionally forces me to put the gate at least partially in my own deployment zone (largely defeating the point.)
       
    Made in gb
    Dakka Veteran




    Makes sense. I'm going to leave in the 3" objective restriction, just because this version allows you to drop in units right on top of the enemy if you put it on top of an objective, which would be extremely oppressive.
       
    Made in us
    Longtime Dakkanaut




    RevlidRas wrote:
    Makes sense. I'm going to leave in the 3" objective restriction, just because this version allows you to drop in units right on top of the enemy if you put it on top of an objective, which would be extremely oppressive.

    I don't know. I think it's fine with the 3" restriction, but it actually might be okay without it too. The gate isn't that hard for your opponent to kill if they want it dead, and putting it on an objective potentially turns it into a springboard for their melee units.
       
    Made in dk
    Pyro Pilot of a Triach Stalker






    Ancient Passages: AELDARI units set up in the webway or in Strategic Reserves can be set up in the Reinforcements step of your first Movement phase wholly within 3" of a friendly WEBWAY GATE model, regardless of any mission rules. (Mentioning turn 2/3 is just confusing things, moving the rest of the ability into Shimmering Arrival makes things simple, this rule is just here to allow you to break the matched play rule that prevents T1 DS)

    Shimmering Arrival: When you set up this model during deployment, it can be set up outside your deployment zone buts more than 12" from the enemy deployment zone and any enemy models. When you set up a friendly AELDARI unit from Strategic Reserves, this model is considered to be part of your own battlefield edge, and a model in that AELDARI unit is considered to have been set up wholly within your deployment zone if you can draw a straight line, 1mm in thickness, between this model’s two arch pieces which passes through or over that model’s base.

    Webway Gate: If your army is Battle-forged, you receive 1 additional Command Point. When measuring distances to and from a Webway Gate, measure from the closest point of the model. If a Webway Gate is destroyed, remove both arch pieces from the battlefield. (Remove Arch of Infinity because all the restrictions aren't really necessary, who is going to bring this just for the CP?)

    Remove Escape to the Webway, you can teleport from one side of a Webway Gate to the other to get free bonus movement which is wonky. Turn 1 your Harlequin Players move up, bounce through so they are within 10" of the enemy deployment zone. If you want to up the value of gates just increase the CP it generates, that will make losing it hurt less or alternatively have it generate CP all game so losing it hurts more.

    The 3" restriction does nothing, the Webway Gate is already within 3" of the objective, since objectives are measured from 3" of the 40mm objective rather than from the middle of the objective. You are getting an automatic charge whether that limitation is there or not. Giving your opponent free bonus movement to an objective by placing a fortification there doesn't sound like a great idea in the first place, so I don't think it would be oppressive. The 3" limitation on terrain is there anyways, it doesn't need to be in the rules as long as you avoid saying "anywhere" since "anywhere" could be misconstrued to mean "anywhere including within 3" of a piece of terrain".
       
    Made in gb
    Dakka Veteran




    Alright, thank you for the feedback! I've made some changes to update/streamline this one...

  • The definition of "arch" is moved to the unit composition section; it's just a straight line drawn between the two arch pieces. The "gate" section, basically.
  • Shimmering Arrival no longer mentions terrain, since that's actually a baked-in rule in 9e. It still mentions objective markers, just because I don't want to make it trivially easy to force the enemy into webway charges by setting up units on top of their objective-claiming units.
  • Arch of Infinity just lets you set up one unit in the webway for free for each WEBWAY GATE you have. Effectively a 1-unit discount on Strategic Reserves, though there's no way to set them up without the WEBWAY GATE; you'll need to pay for Strategic Reserves if you want the extra flexibility.
  • Ancient Passages removes any reference to the actual Strategic Reserves rules and just spells out what it does. You can set up any number of units wholly within 3" of the arch (note: NOT the model, just its arch) and more than 9" from any enemy models, OR within 1"/as close as possible to the arch and within any distance, including Engagement Range, of any enemy units. And you can do this in any battle round.
  • Escape to the Webway now doesn't let you jump between gates on the same turn; you have to wait. Harlequins would probably have a Stratagem to get around the delay.


  • I removed the need to have the arch line pass over every model in your unit, because it badly hurt INFANTRY (you could maybe squeeze 10 models under there, maybe) and did little for TITANIC units (the tippy toe of the Wraithknight's 120mm base could be within the arch and he'd be fine). "Within 1 inch" makes it easy to fit in a mob of 20 Kabalites, while "and as close to the arch as possible" forces the Wraithknight to back up a little bit and stops you from stringing that large squad out to Engagement Range.

    The main question I'm facing now is whether allowing an unlimited number of units to jump in/out of the Webway Gate each turn is acceptable. I don't really want to return to the old "one per turn" limit, because it's daft to say that either a Wraithknight or a squad of 10 Players or a single Haemonculus can toddle through each turn. A Power Rating limit would be possible, but require an unpleasant amount of mathematics. I could treat it like a TRANSPORT (which was the original plan) and just give it a capacity that larger models count as multiples of, but that's a lot of variables to cover even if I'm just using the Wounds characteristic. Is the "wholly within 3" of the arch" limitation enough to keep it from looking like a clown car?
       
     
    Forum Index » 40K Proposed Rules
    Go to: