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2021/09/26 17:36:11
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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I was wondering about whether or not any planets in the Imperium are known to make use of eugenics to alter their population to better suit their environment, or perhaps if they are unable to raise enough troops to meet their quota for the Astra Militarum they might actually use some kind of cloning tech to boost their numbers. Are these kinds of things ever done? Or would the very thought of doing this be considered heresy. Before I get the sarcastic answers, yes I know that the Space Marines are basically genetically enhanced humans, but I was thinking of non-Astartes here.
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2021/09/26 17:39:26
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Moustache-twirling Princeps
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Death Korps of Krieg is the 'biggest' one, being vat-born clones but there's also the Gland Warriors (Lostock 23rd). It is generally frowned upon and very close to heresy.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 17:41:29
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2021/09/26 17:39:59
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Preparing the Invasion of Terra
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IIRC Cloning is illegal in the Imperium. You can use growth hormones or speed up development but clones are not allowed. The Death Korps Vitae Wombs are allowed (sort of) because they're essentially massive surrogate growth chambers, like industrial-scale IVF. It's only an illusion of cloning because the soldiers don't have names, rather numbers, and always wear their helmets/masks.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 17:41:41
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2021/09/26 17:50:44
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon
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It’s surprisingly common. Perhaps not entire planetary populations, but certainly proportions thereof.
Servitors for example can be vat borne. Goliaths likewise (for a long time, they were incapable, by design, of regular reproduction). House Escher use parthogenesis.
So it’s definitely not illegal, and it’s accessibility likely depends upon your planet’s technological base.
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2021/09/26 18:03:52
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Dakka Veteran
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Vat growing is pretty common, though as MDG notes it’s mainly servitors, cherubim and the like rather than for citizens. There is the exception of Goliaths, though they originally started as slaves that managed to rebel and become citizens.
Vat growing doesn’t seem to be exactly the same as cloning though. It’s very clear that some degree of genetic manipulation is possible in the process, given some of the weird and wonderful servitors produced, or the gland warriors or again the Goliaths. From the Goliaths there also seems to be some degree of genetic variation possible as well.
Cloning individuals is also possible but that is heresy and usually punished. Not that it’s always stopped people, one of the most infamous examples is the Afriel Strain where the Mutinorum tried to make the perfect guard regiment by having them all be cloned heroes (think Macharius, Sebastian Thor, etc).
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2021/09/26 18:21:13
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Preparing the Invasion of Terra
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The difference between being vat-born and being a clone is significant.
Being a vat-born basically just means you were made naturally (i.e. biology) but brought to term in a machine. There are still two genetic donors which means they aren't clones. Two vat-born may be genetically similar but not identical, siblings essentially. Vat-born humans might also live for a drastically shorter lifespan depending on the machine that brought them to term, technology being no replacement for humanity and all that.
Clones are specifically from a single donor. The Horus-Clone made by Bile during the Legion Wars was a replica of the real Horus complete with memories and everything, it just lacked his soul, which was how Khayon knew it was a fake and not a resurrection.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/26 18:24:37
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2021/09/26 18:55:49
Subject: Re:Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Confessor Of Sins
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As for genetic engineering, it us extensively used in the Imperium. Be it simple enhancements, such as those used to extend the human lifespan or fix minor genetic problem or more extensive changes like those to make the Astartes, Custodes, or members of the Assassinorum.
However, extensive changes to humanity on a mass scale are frowned upon and generally considered to be heresy. The Abhumans were created this way and are a few mutations away from being considered mutants fit for summary execution. Only select strains are allowed to exist under careful oversight, be they psychers (human or abhumans like the Navigators) or useful like Ogyrn and Ratlings. All are 2nd Class Citizens of the Imperium, even if prestigious in some cases.
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2021/09/26 19:45:40
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon
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It’s not really clear if Abhumans are in fact the result of genetic tinkering, and not just the impact of natural evolution to extreme environments.
It could well be a bit of both.
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2021/09/27 02:22:16
Subject: Cloning and/or Genetic Engineering in the Imperium
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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beast_gts wrote:Death Korps of Krieg is the 'biggest' one, being vat-born clones but there's also the Gland Warriors (Lostock 23rd).
Personally, I wouldn't call the DKOK clones.
More like artificially birthed humans, they wouldn't be clones of people on Krieg but actual babies growth from genetic material harvested from previous generations.
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