What is your Perception of Artistic Value?

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**A Town Called Malus**

trexmeyer wrote:
Stating that rap doesn't have to be that way and then linking white rappers is subtlety racist.

Better?

**trexmeyer**

No. In a way, that's almost actually worse.

Will Smith is by and large considered to be an exceedingly mediocre rapper that was never embraced by the progenitors of rap due to him creating what amounted to pop music. He was tolerated more than most in the mainstream because he was more family-friendly than other artists. In this case, family-friendly is coded language for inoffensive to white America.

I'm curious as to why you guys are defaulting to those rappers specifically designed to be inoffensive to whites.

Edit: I'm going to assume it's because you're not American.

**A Town Called Malus**

trexmeyer wrote:
No. In a way, that's almost actually worse.

Will Smith is by and large considered to be an exceedingly mediocre rapper that was never embraced by the progenitors of rap due to him creating what amounted to pop music. He was tolerated more than most in the mainstream because he was more family-friendly than other artists. In this case, family-friendly is coded language for inoffensive to white America.

I'm curious as to why you guys are defaulting to those rappers specifically designed to be inoffensive to whites.

Edit: I'm going to assume it's because you're not American.

So your argument is that rap is not for everyone if we dismiss the subgenres of rap which are enjoyed by demographics which generally do not enjoy other subgenres which you personally feel more embody the soul of what rap is?

Why should we dismiss those artists who choose to use the medium of rap to instead make pop-infused music? Also, who do you mean by the progenitors of rap?

**trexmeyer**

I didn't say that the artists you link have no artistic value. I questioned why you referenced white artists initially. Specifically Super Ready who said: "Rap doesn't have to be that way" and linked some white British rapper. The implication being that rap doesn't have to be black.

All I said initially concerning rap was that people dismiss it do the use of vulgarities and subject matter. You could have referenced numerous black American rappers that don't create music like that.

Instead Super Ready linked a white British rapper. I said that was subtlety racist. Is this clear now?

**Super Ready**

For what it's worth - it might well indeed be because I'm not American - because my only example of a different style black rapper I can think of would be Skee-Lo's "I Wish". And you're lucky I remember even him, because he was a one-hit wonder over here.
Maybe it could be said there's a racial factor to rap not being as big over here - maybe - but that's hardly something I can personally be blamed for.
Anyway, let's not get the thread locked on this point, the real reason I posted Mr B is because he's the most amusing rapper I can think of.

**SkavenLord**

It’s been very interesting hearing everyone’s input on this subject, and seeing some of the discussions that have come out of it. Thanks for replying folks!

tauist wrote:
I think most artists want you to feel something when you are exposed to their creations. Any inherent "value" beyond that goes into specifics of the piece and it's creator.

My father is an artist. He taught me everything there is to know about being one. Its a state of consciousness above all else (and can be very dangerous if fed back too strongly into itself). In this state of consciousness, you transcribe things you experience into a form of sorts. Its communication but one which has no formal and globally understood language.

Another interesting analogue to art could be 40K's depiction of "warp". Psykers are the artists, and some people are psychic nulls, others more or less sensitive to it etc. You can manifest its power's, but it can also use you and devour you into it.

I’m curious what you mean by a “state of consciousness”. Is this similar to the feeling of “flow” one gets while working, almost like you’re being hypnotized by what you are observing? Is it perhaps instead a feeling of trying to sleuth out what the artist attempted to transcribe? How does this state of consciousness impact your life?

Furthermore, how would you differentiate this feeling from simply reacting to it emotionally? (Ex. Feeling optimistic and confident after listening to a song you like)

**Easy E**

ITT- Rap gatekeeping in a thread about perceptions of artistic value.

I am actually glad the concept of "Art" has moved away from simple paintings and sculpture. I am glad it has evolved into music and potentially cinema, theatre, and TV as well.

**A Town Called Malus**

Easy E wrote:
I am glad it has evolved into music and potentially cinema, theatre, and TV as well.

Any remaining arguments as to whether TV shows could be art died with Twin Peaks

**SkavenLord**

A Town Called Malus wrote:
Easy E wrote:
I am glad it has evolved into music and potentially cinema, theatre, and TV as well.

Any remaining arguments as to whether TV shows could be art died with Twin Peaks

Because nothing says art like a damn fine cup of coffee.