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That is a tiny play space:

Well it is for demoing in a crowded hall.

It's enough for quick 4 round/15-20 minute demos. Both Warmachine and Heavy Gear used a similarly sized setup for demos at Gencon when I used to go a few years back.

Looks great. We think that is a 2 by 2 demo table. Which a lot of booths use in conventions. Although we cannot wait to see mass scale armies on a 6 by 4.

So from looking at the Video yesterday, a Squad of Regaults appears to be 6, and they had 5 Damage boxes each, the Tomahawks were in squads of 2 and had 24 damage boxes, wonder if that 80 on the left side of the VF card is point cost for the squad.

Gotta say, I do like the look of the terrain there. The shattered building is very cool.

OK, got a couple free minutes at work to check out the updates since I first checked this morning.

The 220k stretch, to me, is another weak stretch goal. It upgrades a purchased add-on? Maybe it should upgrade the contents of the main box. It would even be better to upgrade the other Destroid add-on instead.

I'm really hoping that these weaker stretch goals are because of their anticipation that this KS is going to generate a ton of money and they're saving "the good stuff" for later on.

So far I'm not seeing too much that's begging for more money to be thrown down in good amounts. This just seems to be getting run so different to many, many, other Kickstarter and Indiegogo projects for games. So much opportunity for low cost, high value add-on stuff that's been suggested too. People need to keep it up in the Comments area about, decals, bits frames, bases, and so on.

I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.

Can someone give me a quick history between Macross/Robotech and Battletech?

Gitzbitah wrote:
I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.

However, as I stated, if they would just up the count on the box by 2, you'd get the same thing and not have to spend another $20 on top of the boxed set.

So this Stretch Goal basically caters to people that are more than likely spending less money, by getting just the add-on boxes, than those getting the boxed set alone or boxed set plus add-ons.

Seems like a backwards way to reward the folks that are more than likely your biggest spenders.

Maybe that's why it doesn't sit right with me.

Think of it this way: what is the intended MSRP of a squadron (apparently 2 models) of destroids? Is it $10 or $20? When I say, MSRP, I mean how much will it cost in general release? Because it would be kind of lame to spend $20 for 2 models during the kickstarter and only pay $20 for 4 models after. See where I'm going? The stretch goals are probably taking into account that Palladium/Ninja Div were totally confident that they'd be reached.

TalonZahn wrote:

Gitzbitah wrote:
I for one, love this new stretch goal- it means I can just drop 20 bucks, and get a full support lance of Warhammers and Riflemen. If they just do the same with the Longbow and Archer, I'll be a happy camper. The Marauder is just a bit too expensive for my tastes at this point.

However, as I stated, if they would just up the count on the box by 2, you'd get the same thing and not have to spend another $20 on top of the boxed set.

So this Stretch Goal basically caters to people that are more than likely spending less money, by getting just the add-on boxes, than those getting the boxed set alone or boxed set plus add-ons.

Seems like a backwards way to reward the folks that are more than likely your biggest spenders.

Maybe that's why it doesn't sit right with me.

That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.

Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.

Gitzbitah wrote:
I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.

I don't think anyone can fault you for that! It's an unspoken goal of this KS after all ...

Anyhow, you're not detracting from us folks who want to play Robotech. The more dollars you add, the more stretch goals get unlocked. I look at it this way: if it weren't for the add on options, the project would be less likely to get any of your dollars.

 Manchu wrote:
Think of it this way: what is the intended MSRP of a squadron (apparently 2 models) of destroids? Is it $10 or $20? When I say, MSRP, I mean how much will it cost in general release? Because it would be kind of lame to spend $20 for 2 models during the kickstarter and only pay $20 for 4 models after. See where I'm going? The stretch goals are probably taking into account that Palladium/Ninja Div were totally confident that they'd be reached.

They haven't come out with the MSRPs but my assumption (and it's just that) is that the original add on prices will be the MSRPs. It's likely that the stretch goals are already predetermined and are a mix of adding free stuff (whether models or bits for variety) to the core box, free stuff to existing paid add ons, and completely new items. $20 for two large plastic models of terminator size or larger is a fair retail value. Doubling that during the kickstarter for add ons is a fair offer for early adopters as well. As pointed out earlier, doubling the box content destroids (when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out) would likely satisfy the average consumer's demand for those models and not generate as much additional money as increasing the value of the paid add on packs.

@Gitzbitah: There is always trading.... I don't think it'll be too hard to find someone who is willing to trade at a comparable "retail" value (so $5 per destroid with the upcoming stretch goal and $4 per battle pod with the current add on price).

Gitzbitah wrote:
That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.

Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.

This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.

People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.

At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.

You need to check yourself before you reply.

TalonZahn wrote:
You need to check yourself before you reply.

Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.

TalonZahn wrote:

Gitzbitah wrote:
That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.

Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.

This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.

People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.

At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.

You need to check yourself before you reply.

If he's being disparaging, it's to himself. We've got enough mods posting in the thread so I'll let them do their red text job but I will pipe in with this... I believe you need to add "wreck yourself" for the proper reply.

TalonZahn wrote:

Gitzbitah wrote:
That is undoubtedly true, and par for the course for Palladium. I will undoubtedly be one of those very, very minor contributors because I have no use for a dozen Battlepods, and no interest in the game. It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, who are going to have less and less expense on the game as time goes on and the timeline advances, are being rewarded.

Yet I am being rewarded, and I am happy about that. I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company. I am just out to get cheap Unseen.

This type of response is totally uncalled for. There's no need to be an ASS about it.

People that spend more should get more. This is a reality of life, not just this Kickstarter. It has also been the pattern of every other Kickstarter before this one.

At no time did I make any remarks that should have brought that sort of response and I didn't single you out either.

You need to check yourself before you reply.

I am massively confused about what you found so offensive in his reply. I don't see anything there that needs you calling him names over, and at the moment, your response seems totally unwarranted.

 Manchu wrote:

TalonZahn wrote:
You need to check yourself before you reply.

Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.

The manner and phrasing of his "self-depricating remarks" came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here.

This:

It is weird that bottom feeding people like me, I feel for all of you who truly support this game, and this company.

Is passive-agressive BS.

So if he spends $20 and get a $20 bonus, great.

I don't think that's the way to go for a Kickstarter, and neither do any of the other companies that have come before.

You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.

TalonZahn wrote:
came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here

Use the report function. Responding like that will get you suspended.

TalonZahn wrote:
You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.

Thanks to the franchise crossover, this is a special case.

TalonZahn wrote:

 Manchu wrote:

TalonZahn wrote:
You need to check yourself before you reply.

Whoa there. I don't think he meant to offend anyone.

The manner and phrasing of his "self-depricating remarks" came across in a passive-agressive manner to me and I don't think there's a place for it here.

So if he spends $20 and get a $20 bonus, great.

I don't think that's the way to go for a Kickstarter, and neither do any of the other companies that have come before.

You cater to people that spend lots of money, not to people that spend less money.

Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.

 warboss wrote:
(when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out)

That's true from a Robotech POV but what about Battletech? I know there's a premium for Unseen but having other plastic mecha for BT is pretty huge, too. I know that is one of the things that has kept me from getting into BT.

From WilhelmRochRedDuke on Robotech Battles:

Speed (SPD) – movement.
Gunnery (GN) – accuracy.
Defense (DF) – damage resistance.
Piloting (PIL) – performance.

 Manchu wrote:
Can someone give me a quick history between Macross/Robotech and Battletech?

Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.

Macross: tv show in Japan in 1982, 36 episodes

Robotech: Harmony Gold bought license for Macross (and other shows) but US TV required 65 episodes for daily syndication; Carl Macek edited together Macross, Southern Cross, Mospeada to make the 85 episode space opera known as Robotech. it's called Robotech only because at that time REVELL was releasing japanese model kits in the USA under the name Robotech

Battletech: originally Battledroids (C&D by George Lucas made it become Battletech). FASA licensed Macross designs (and other designs from Crusher Joe, Dougram, etc) but not from Harmony Gold, and there was a big ol court case in the 90's, and then FASA/then WIZKIDS/then CATALYST don't use the designs anymore (now called the "unseens") and obviously the old minis of them are way out of print and hard to get

shade1313 wrote:
Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.

Do try to keep up.

I already stated my displeasure before he began the passive-agressive garbage.

Okay, please direct any criticism anyone has about this KS at the KS. Personal attacks are against this site's rules. I'll delete further posts on this outburst as off-topic. Thanks!

TalonZahn wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
Sounds to me like you're angry with Palladium and the way they've structured the KS, and are taking it out on someone who benefits from the structure that is benefiting him, rather than you.

Do try to keep up.

I already stated my displeasure before he began the passive-agressive garbage.

<deleted out of courtesy to Manchu. He's right, this is nonsense that is not on topic>

The figures look awesome all painted and with that great cityscape.

 judgedoug wrote:
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.

Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?

 Manchu wrote:

 warboss wrote:
(when destroids are less popular than veritechs to start out)

That's true from a Robotech POV but what about Battletech? I know there's a premium for Unseen but having other plastic mecha for BT is pretty huge, too. I know that is one of the things that has kept me from getting into BT.

I can only comment from my perspective as a Robotech fan and Robotech gamer in that I've almost universally noticed in both minis games and RPG sessions over 15 years (both locally and at gencon) that Veritechs were more popular than destroids. My only experience with Unseen in Battletech was buying the plastic starter that had all the plastic unseen around 15 years ago and selling it last year. I'm not sure from a 2025 or whatever year perspective which unseen are considered better for their role/points costs in battletech so I can't comment about the utility of them for that purpose.

Never mind miss read your earlier post