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While reading various forums and tactics on tau, I have seen many references to attaching an IC to a Riptide. I am confused as to how this is possible/allowed as the BRB states that an IC can't join single model inits (i.e. vehicles and MCs). All I can figure is that the Riptide is an exception because it can take drones making it not a single model unit. Is this the case? or are you not allow to do this?

Most MCs are single model units. The riptide can take drones so it is not always a unit of 1. Carnifexes can also be joined by ICs add they come 1-3.

You said it right, because he has the "option" to take drones he can be joined by an independent character. He doesn't even have to take the drones. Just because he has the "option" to do it, he can be joined by a IC.

Also Necron Canoptek Spiders

Thank you all for your speed and helpfulness!

Necron canoptek spiders, riptides and Carnifexes are the few monstrous creatures an IC may join.

Or a prime joining a swarmlord/tyrant with guard. IC (prime) joining mc (swarmlord).

Poly Ranger wrote:
Or a prime joining a swarmlord/tyrant with guard. IC (prime) joining mc (swarmlord).

Not quite. In this scenario, the Prime is joining the Tyrant Guard. Who happen to also be joined by a Tyrant. Of course what happens if the Guard get killed off is debatable.

 Happyjew wrote:

Poly Ranger wrote:
Or a prime joining a swarmlord/tyrant with guard. IC (prime) joining mc (swarmlord).

Not quite. In this scenario, the Prime is joining the Tyrant Guard. Who happen to also be joined by a Tyrant. Of course what happens if the Guard get killed off is debatable.

Wouldn't the prime have to split off from the tyrant since the tyrant itself is only an IC as long as it's a part of the guard unit? I must say I'd love to know since I'm a 'nid player and thought of playing such a point-sink unit ....

The rules don't cover the situation.

That is a very intresting point actually!

They stay together actually, the death of the Tyrant Guard unit doesn't change the pseudo-IC status of the Hive Tyrant.

 PrinceRaven wrote:
They stay together actually, the death of the Tyrant Guard unit doesn't change the pseudo-IC status of the Hive Tyrant.

I'm confused by this statement. The tyrant is never truly an IC, it just may join guards as if he were one, and benefits from a few of thier rules (LoS!, precision shots ...) when with them.
Once there is no more guard units, the tyrant isn't an IC in any way. You'd get an IC joined to an always consisting of 1 model unit. And then the game breaks as you divide by 0 ...

Basically, Shield Wall has it join the unit "just like an IC" and once the Tyrant Guard die, it is still joined to the Prime "just like an IC". It will only lose this pseudo-IC status once it's no longer attached to anything.

I thought the rules on ICs only covered them joining, not remaining joined.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
I thought the rules on ICs only covered them joining, not remaining joined.

I agree. I'd ask to be shown a rule that forces them to separate, I'd also point to the IC's section which state they count as members of the same unit for all intents and purposes. To my knowledge nothing exists which would force us to check the status and legality of ICs joined to a unit once joined. If you can legally join, you stay joined until you choose to leave, then you could not later rejoin.

ICs joining a unit is checked at the end of every movement phase; if your unit is not legally allowed to be joined then your IC is no longer joined; and has to move 2" away.

second paragraph of "Joining and leaving a unit" under the IC rules on page 39 of the brb.

Technically every movement phase you have to move the unit then the ic separately; but in practice everyone just moves them both together.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
ICs joining a unit is checked at the end of every movement phase; if your unit is not legally allowed to be joined then your IC is no longer joined; and has to move 2" away.

second paragraph of "Joining and leaving a unit" under the IC rules on page 39 of the brb.

Technically every movement phase you have to move the unit then the ic separately; but in practice everyone just moves them both together.

That is not what page 39 says at all. There is not clause that states a character auto leaves a unit every movement phase, quite the opposite. Leaving a unit is a distinct choice, therefore once joined to a unit the IC is part of that unit unless the IC chooses to leave the unit.

I suggest you carefully reread the relevant rules on pg 39 with understanding.

what do you suggest happens when you have an IC start the game joined to a unit, and at the end of the first turns movement phase the IC is within 2" of both the unit started and another eligible unit?

Are you claiming the controller player does not have to declare which unit he is joined to, as the rules say?

joining, not remaining joined. Joining is a distinct action.

Which happens at the end of every movement phase, yes.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
what do you suggest happens when you have an IC start the game joined to a unit, and at the end of the first turns movement phase the IC is within 2" of both the unit started and another eligible unit?

Are you claiming the controller player does not have to declare which unit he is joined to, as the rules say?

He does not, as the IC is part of the first unit, and has not satisfied the requirements for leaving the unit, ie moving out of coherency.

The rule you are referencing is if you have an IC who is not currently joined to a squad and has moved into coherency with multiple unit, then you have to declare what eligible squad he is joining.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
joining, not remaining joined. Joining is a distinct action.

This.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Which happens at the end of every movement phase, yes.

For unjoined ICs, yes.

IC joins squad at deployment. That squad then moves and the IC is never out of coherency and therefore has never left the unit. How do you join an IC to a unit its already joined to? Or are you using some rule which doesn't appear to be in the BRB which requires an IC to leave a unit and rejoin at the end of every movement phase? None exists.

Joining an IC to a squad, and an IC being part of a squad are very distinct states.

You seem to be overlooking the last rule on the left column for ICs.

I wish the riptide thing would be FAQ'd cause it makes the riptide stupid hard to kill when eldrad joins him and makes him reroll saves

 Kaptain Skullstompa wrote:
I wish the riptide thing would be FAQ'd cause it makes the riptide stupid hard to kill when eldrad joins him and makes him reroll saves

And the great thing is Eldrad doesn't even need to join the unit to cast Fortune on it.

I think I am missing something as people are referencing a rule that says that in IC cannot join a monstrous creature that consists of one model...

I've just checked both the IC rules and the MC rules and cannot find anything that says that an IC cannot join a single model unit.

which also I'd like to add doesn't make sense since multiple IC's can form their own unit.

Second sentence in the IC rule.

 nutty_nutter wrote:
I think I am missing something as people are referencing a rule that says that in IC cannot join a monstrous creature that consists of one model...

I've just checked both the IC rules and the MC rules and cannot find anything that says that an IC cannot join a single model unit.

which also I'd like to add doesn't make sense since multiple IC's can form their own unit.

Not just MCs; no units of only ever 1 model.

And ICs allowed to join each other is a specific allowance

I believe the MC reference was in 4th Ed. The wording on the IC rule has remained the same the past 2 editions.