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Can anyone suggest a few "first" purchases if I want to dip my toes into Flames of War? I have always wanted to give the game/system a shot, and TheWarStore's 30% off sale has me ready to take the plunge.

Lets say I have $100-120 to spend, and need to buy for two players. Where do I begin?

They have the Open-Fire Starter set for $60, which says it comes with a 300pg rule book. Is this THE rule-book, or do I also need to buy the 3-book set? Also, what is this new 3rd edition book they have up for pre-order?

From there, if I indeed want that, what do I spend the next $50-60 bucks on, to flesh out forces, diversity, etc?


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Oh, as an addition, I don't know the mechanics very well, but do know i'd prefer infantry heavy lists, versus armor heavy ones, if that is at all viable.

Open fire has 'the rulebook' it's a great starter choice as you can choose to expand from there to one of three armies.

You get a decent number of germans
- HQ + panzerschrek,
- 2 full grenadier platoons,
- 2 Pak 40 Anti tank guns,
- three StuG's

For British
- 2 Fireflies
- 6 shermans

For US
- 2 short Para units

Decide which faction, - all of these units are for Late war so stick with that time frame IMHO

Spend a couple of dollars on 'easy army' it's got all the lists for the game - helps you plan out where you want to go!

If you want to be german's I'd probably next go for these units (they're all generic and can be used to make a core force of grenadiers on any front)
- Mortars
- HMG's
- more Pak 40's
- Panzer 4's (H or J) or Panthers (plastic soldier company is your friend here) For the first three whether they are SS or Heer (army) avoid fallscrimjager as they're quite different (German Para's!)

If you go with Brits, I'd go for a british armoured force, my next buys would be (i'm thinking of a market garden force)
- more shermans/fireflies (you want to aim for 2 HQ shermans and 2 - 3 platoons of 2 shermans and 2 fireflies)
Universal carriers (3 come in one blister and they're a good british recon unit)
Rifle platoon/company (depends if you want to expand)
OQF 25pdrs (some nice british artillery)

If you go US (not my major area of knowledge)
- more paras (you are only fielding short platoons if you use whats in open fire)
- Para mortars
- Para Anti tank

Hope that helps

Well that is a lot of info which I am sure to digest, but remembering that I am a complete novice who has no games nor demos under his belt.... what specifically would you recommend?

As I said, i'm looking at very first purchases, as I haven't even read the rules. I am just trying to jump on the amazing Warstore sale before everything goes sold-out. :-p

So, the Open Fire Starter comes with the newest edition rules, right? Ok, so it sounds like i'm definitely buying that.

From there, it is the wife and I who would be playing, so we need to use/buy/build two forces. Again, I know we would both prefer infantry with support armor, other vehicles, etc....

I've a few suggestions, but be warned that I, too, am a newb.

Open fire is a good starting point in my opinion, but if you want a less Armour and more Infantry focused game, I suggest you buy the Hell's Highway book.

The Hell's Highway book has army lists inside it based around Operation Garden Market. More importantly, it allows you to field very light armour forces.

The Allies in the book get the Recce Company and the Household Cavalry units for the British, and the U.S. Paratrooper companies. They're both very light on armour formations, with Armoured Cars and Infantry forming the mainstay if your forces.
(A note: Us and British units can be in the same force if you didn't know).

The Germans have acces to the Fallschirmjäger Kampfgruppe, which is mainly Infantry platoons backed up by Pak.40s and a few Stug Gs and Luftwaffe FlaK platoons.

This book will give you a variety of directions in which to expand, but keeps the factions involved simple.

I hope this helps.

So are any boxes generally safe to buy? I kinda wanna place one order to save on shipping?

Like, they have plastic "Rifle Company" for $40, for the US?

Are any of these "safe purchases" while I take more time to flesh out lists?

If possible, i'd like to add one box roughly like that to US and Germans to further balance what is in Open Fire. Suggestions?


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http://www.thewarstore.com/usarmydealsboxsets.html

Something from this list, for example, and then something from the matching German list?


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So, to make a list like this...

http://easyarmy.com/FOWCompany.aspx?PDF=12&Company=12

Would I buy this, and how many...?

http://www.thewarstore.com/product52381.html

Under the Forces book, if you add 5 PzIVs to the Germans you get 1255pts. ($30 PSC)

If you buy a third Sherman Platoon for the Brits and add one .50cal to each platoon it's 1255pts.
1 Box of PSC ShermanVs (with Fireflys) and 1 BF Sherman V blister ($12.50 Fow blister and a PSC box of 5 for $30)


The latest German book for Market Garden Bridge by Bridge doesn't let you use PzIVs with the Grenadiers though.
Other books will.

From Forces, additional purchases in Bold:
Germans/Grenadier
Compulsory Grenadier Company HQ - 1x CinC SMG, 1x 2iC SMG (40 pts)
- CinC Upgrade - 1x Upgrade CinC SMG to CinC Panzerfaust SMG (10 pts)
- 2iC Upgrade - 1x Upgrade 2iC SMG to 2iC Panzerfaust SMG (10 pts)
- Panzerschreck - 1x Panzerschrek (25 pts)
Compulsory Grenadier Platoon - 1x Command Rifle/MG, 6x Rifle/MG (155 pts)
- Command Upgrade - Replace Command Rifle/MG with Command Panzerfaust SMG (10 pts)
Compulsory Grenadier Platoon - 1x Command Rifle/MG, 6x Rifle/MG (155 pts)
- Command Upgrade - Replace Command Rifle/MG with Command Panzerfaust SMG (10 pts)
Grenadier Anti-tank Gun Platoon - 1x Command SMG, 2x 7.5cm PaK40 gun (105 pts)
Panzer Platoon - 1x Command Panzer IV H, 4x Panzer IV H (450 pts)
Assault Gun Platoon - 1x Command StuG G, 2x StuG G (285 pts)
1255 Points, 5 Platoons


Brits/Armoured
Compulsory Armoured Squadron HQ - 1x CinC Sherman V, 1x 2iC Sherman V (135 pts)
Compulsory Armoured Platoon - 1x Command Sherman V, 2x Sherman V, 1x Firefly VC (280 pts)
- AA MG - 1x Equip Sherman with .50cal AA MG (5 pts)
Compulsory Armoured Platoon - 1x Command Sherman V, 2x Sherman V, 1x Firefly VC (280 pts)
- AA MG - 1x Equip Sherman with .50cal AA MG (5 pts)
Armoured Platoon - 1x Command Sherman V, 2x Sherman V, 1x Firefly VC (280 pts)
- AA MG - 1x Equip Sherman with .50cal AA MG (5 pts)
US Parachute Rifle Platoon - 1x Command Rifle/MG, 6x Rifle/MG, 1x Bazooka, 1x M2 60mm mortar (265 pts)
1255 Points, 4 Platoons

From the book Market Garden, if you wanted to play US forces, you can pick up a US Para Rifle platoon blister instead of extra Brit Tanks for $23IIRC
82nd Parachute Rifle
Compulsory Parachute Rifle Company HQ (82nd Airborne) - 1x CinC Carbine, 1x 2iC Carbine (30 pts)
Compulsory Parachute Rifle Platoon - 1x Command Rifle/MG, 6x Rifle/MG, 1x M2 60mm mortar, 1x Bazooka (265 pts)
Compulsory Parachute Rifle Platoon - 1x Command Rifle/MG, 6x Rifle/MG, 1x M2 60mm mortar, 1x Bazooka (265 pts)
British Armoured Platoon - 1x Command Sherman V, 2x Sherman V, 1x Firefly VC (385 pts)
British Armoured Platoon - 1x Command Sherman V, 1x Sherman V, 1x Firefly VC (305 pts)
1250 Points, 4 Platoons

You'll be short the two command teams though. The PRP blister comes with 9 R/MG teams so you'll have enough figures for for the two command teams, but you'll have to make bases. You can cut one medium base in half for the two small bases.

Holy crap.... that is a serious wall of words that I don't understand. :-p

Do you want to have the US or the Brits as your Primary Allied faction?

If you buy 5 PzIVHs ($30PSC box) for the Germans gets them up to 1255pts.

If you want to focus on the Brits you need a box of PSC Shermans and one more Sherman V blister (6 tanks) to make up 1255pts from the free Forces list.

A US Parachute Rifle Platoon blister ($23) gives you 1250pts but you'll also need to get the Market Garden book($50 or EasyArmy or FOWlists above) for the US forces.

USParas and the Germans would be the cheapest ($53) but you'll need to improvise the 2 command teams from extra figures.

Openfire comes with the main Rulebook, and the Quickstart guide which includes Brit Armored and German Grenadier army lists.
http://www.flamesofwar.com/hobby.aspx?art_id=3543

This site has army lists also
http://fowlists.blogspot.com.au/p/welcome.html


ETA_The Forces book came with the hardback rulebook set, not with Openfire.

If you want to play US, the 6 Sherman Vs can be used as US Shermans, but the Fireflys can't.

So, having done some homework in the evening, I actually think the way I would ultimately like to go, might be Soviets.

I mean, I want to go Infantry heavy, and their lists are all about the meat-grinder. Is it fair to say, if I want to go infantry, Russia might be the way to proceed?

If so, I am even more clueless as to where to begin. My wife is German, and will probably play Germany, so Open Fire still seems like a bargain, but i'm thinking beyond our learning games, and what is in the box, neither of us will end up main-ing Brits or US.

So, is there a good way to take advantage of this sale and start building toward a Russian Infantry-heavy list?

Are such lists remotely viable?

Also, are PSC Infantry boxes a better place to start as I would need A LOT of guys? Do their sets come with bases?

Thanks for all the help guys. It really is appreciated. Please forgive my ignorance.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or, are there US/Brit Infantry heavy lists that can be both fun, and successful?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
So, having done some homework in the evening, I actually think the way I would ultimately like to go, might be Soviets.

I mean, I want to go Infantry heavy, and their lists are all about the meat-grinder. Is it fair to say, if I want to go infantry, Russia might be the way to proceed?

If so, I am even more clueless as to where to begin. My wife is German, and will probably play Germany, so Open Fire still seems like a bargain, but i'm thinking beyond our learning games, and what is in the box, neither of us will end up main-ing Brits or US.

So, is there a good way to take advantage of this sale and start building toward a Russian Infantry-heavy list?

Are such lists remotely viable?

Also, are PSC Infantry boxes a better place to start as I would need A LOT of guys? Do their sets come with bases?

Thanks for all the help guys. It really is appreciated. Please forgive my ignorance.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or, are there US/Brit Infantry heavy lists that can be both fun, and successful?

My advice would simply be to get the open fire box and have some demo games, by yourself if need be, before you make a decision. After you have at least some understanding of the rules and you know what interests you in terms of the type of list that you want to run you could look into branching out. The Open Fire box can be used by all 4 major powers to varing degrees so you will have something to build on.

Thanks Palindrome. I know that is good, sage advice. A friend is buying my Christmas/Birthday gift, and just happens to have store credit at TheWarStore which likewise has 30% off FoW right now. As such, I am just trying to make forward thinking purchases.

This is what I ended up ordering...

Obviously, I ordered Open Fire. Too many people rave about it as a starter set, with so much value in excess of its price.

From there I also ordered these two items as they seemed very much staples or present in nearly any list for their respective armies. I figured if I HAD to blind guess, I had might as well get two items that seem likely to be multi-purpose staples.

http://www.thewarstore.com/product52381.html

http://www.thewarstore.com/product42690.html

Even if I can't use them now, per se... i'm sure I will, or can trade 'em down the road.

Were those good choices? Do any lists let me utilize those sets and Open Fire together?

They aren't what I would have chosen. The Fallschrimjaeger can only use the StuGs and the PaK40s (all though you will need to use the Grenadier crew as they have different uniforms) and the US rifle company will only be able to use the Shermans.

If its not too late to change your order you may want to consider http://www.thewarstore.com/product61841.html this http://www.thewarstore.com/product73073.html or this http://www.thewarstore.com/product71271.html for your germans.

I'm not familiar with US lists but some PSC Shermans won't go amiss http://www.thewarstore.com/product67236.html

What you have chosen will work out , they just don't work well with what comes in the Open Fire box.

Would they work in the short run as proxies?

IE, would the US Riflemen works as US Paras since their weapons are the same, even if their uniforms are not?

You can call a team pretty much anything you want while you're playing your wife, but others might have an issue.

One thing you can do with the US Rifle Co is play a US Glider Rifle company (Market Garden book or PDF) backed up by the Brit Shermans and Paratroopers.
http://www.flamesofwar.com/Portals/0/Documents/Briefings/GliderRifleCompanyBriefing.pdf

A more appropriate box would be the US Parachute Rifle Company.

The PSC US Heavy Weapons set will also help you out a lot.
If you buy any US infantry at all you should buy this box also.
http://www.thewarstore.com/product73071.html

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/563428.page
4 x 1917 MG teams,
4 x 1919 .30 cal teams,
4 x .50 cal teams,
4 x 60mm mortars,
4 x 81mm mortars,
4 x 4 inch chemical mortars
4 x bazooka teams

That is awesome. I actually found that exact list on EasyArmy.com, and from my limited experience it seemed like something I could do, legally.

And I have, ironically, been looking at those PSC boxes as well, so it seems like it might be a way to go.

Can you tell me... are FoC's all roughly balanced? In THEORY can any of them, beat any other list, if built correctly?

Also, are there any "similar" German lists I could build for the wife? IE something that uses the Infantry box I originally linked to, Open Fire!, and perhaps just one or two more additional purchases?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:


Can you tell me... are FoC's all roughly balanced? In THEORY can any of them, beat any other list, if built correctly?

Also, are there any "similar" German lists I could build for the wife? IE something that uses the Infantry box I originally linked to, Open Fire!, and perhaps just one or two more additional purchases?

Lists are effectively balanced against each other if played in the correct period (early, mid or late war). There are some lists that are better than others but nothing significant and FoW is nowhere near the completely unbalanced GW games.

The obvious answer would be a Grenadier kompanie with http://www.thewarstore.com/product61830.html or possibly a gepanzerte panzergrenadier kompanie with the heavy weapons box and http://www.thewarstore.com/product67237.html

So, stupid question, but does PSC stuff come with bases for infantry?

And again, thank you so much for the help. These lists were kind of exactly what I imagined, and surely if the game proves fun, will only be the start of our collections.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
So, stupid question, but does PSC stuff come with bases for infantry?

No but they are easy enough to make or you could buy some thrid party ones like http://war-bases.co.uk/Bases/ROUND-CORNERED-BASES

You can get a blister of the mixed bases or the rubble/rural textured bases from BF
http://www.thewarstore.com/paintsbrushesbases.html

An example 1500 point grenadier list (chosen from Grey Wolf) could be:

HQ with mortars, 1 sniper and panzershrek team

Full grenadier platoon with panzerfaust

Full grenadier platoon with panzerfaust

Full grenadier paltoon with panzerfaust, pioneer upgrade

machinegun platoon, 1 section

2 section heavy mortar platoon

anti tank gun platoon (2 PaK 40)

Panzer platoon (3 StuG)

Anti tank gun platoon (2 PaK 40)

Looted panzer platoon (M4)

If you wanted to make this list you would need to buy the PSC heavy weapons box, a PaK 40 blister, and a Grenadier blister (both from Battlefront for simplicities sake and I would use the metal grenadiers as your pioneers), everything else is in Open Fire.

Its not my ideal list but its perfectly serviceable and it will give you a good overview of the game.

Thanks guys. You've been great.

Its fantastic to think that $200 can get to players up and running with modest little starter setups. I usually only find that possible in the smallest of 28mm skirmish games.

Just to say thanks for this thread guys, just starting Flames of War myself and starting a US army so this has been a great help.

Think I'll get the starter set Open Fire for the rulebook plus some models to practice painting at such a smaller scale.

Open Fire is the best way to start, and skip everything else till you know you will invest in the game system.

A lot of your questions will be answered once you have the rule book and the open fire supplement in your hands.

Of course the assault phase is likely to raise 100 new questions hehe, it is a touch complex. All in all however the game is quite straightforward and learning how to win will be harder than learning how to move your little guys and gals about. Which is how it should be!

Well, i'm a table-top vet at this point, and as I usually say, if I survived Malifaux, with all its fiddly bits, then I am capable of learning any system. ;-)

Meanwhile, can someone advise me as to what the equivalent boxes to those PSC Weapons Crews are for actual Battlefront models/boxes? As odd as it sounds, I LOVE that PSC has bargain options, and their tanks look great... but I don't like the aesthetics of the sprues pictured. They don't look remotely like the art-style of FoW.

You will need to buy individual platoon blister packs (mortars, heavy mortars and machine guns).

Each set of 4 weapons in the PSC HW pack is $12-23 from BF. BF doesn't sell the .50cal teams separately though.

HMG platoon 12.50
81mm Mortars 17.50
4x M1919+3x 60mm 17.50
4x Chem mortars $23
10x bazookas 12.50
$83 from BF

Sure you do get bases and command figures from BF.
But you could pick up the Rifle Company Command blister with 6 command teams and 2 bazookas for $12.50.
$42.50 instead of $83

(Full retail prices listed)

Again ORIGINAL POSTER please....Read top Post on the Board, and then come back to us.

Again!!! :-p

Relax man... As I told you else-where, that thread is a lovely resource, but is also an impersonal, intimidating wall of text for someone just thinking of dabbling in a new system.

Its not like this forum, sadly, is a high of activity.

Incidentally, another question for the fine, fine folks who have been helping out.

Can the wife and I do anything of substance with TWO Open Fire! starters, instead of the one starter, and two infantry boxes?

Yes, although you will of course have some spares and it will be a bit harder to make use of everything.