Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Out of interest, what's the height difference between a Warhound & the Leviathan?

Raptor007 wrote:
If you are looking around the 500 point level for the model, including a D weapon is going to be tricky.

To compare, the Shadowsword is close to that amount in points and only has one D weapon large blast. So adding the ability to have a void shield, shoot another massive titan level gun and be able to smash other titans and models in close combat for the same price needs some downside. The HP reduction to 6 does seem reasonable though, about %30 from the Warhound.

Honestly if you want to have the titan close combat weapon and void shield you will need to downgrade the weapons some. Go for Str10 Ap1 ignores cover large blast, or maybe Str D small blast. Something like that. I don't know all the other stats for the remaining guns.

Since you only have modeled CCW for the left arm make that weapon mandatory so no two ranged guns. Perhaps lower the BS to 3 so the WS can go up to 4.

Here is a summary of the imperial guard superheavies which are all around the point level you are looking at. So the Knight should be close to this level of dakka. http://cadiascreed40k.blogspot.com/2013/12/escalation-review-quick-one-for.html

Awesomely made rule sheet btw.

Thank you very much for the input, and I think you may are right about the weapons, it's under points for what it has... I'm wondering if the points could be raised enough for it to still make sense instead of a warhound...
It would really have to be higher to take a TCCW and second weapon, perhaps 600 points? and then maybe limit it to the Vulcan Mega bolter and maybe a couple of the other super tank weapons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 bubber wrote:
Out of interest, what's the height difference between a Warhound & the Leviathan?

The Leviathan is made by dreamforge and is not an actual 40k model, resembles (rather significantly) a 40k Knight Titan, with the main difference being that it is considerably larger than a Knight titan. The Warhound is a scout class titan made by Forgeworld (and before that armorcast) And the newer model is slightly taller and more bulky than a Leviathan. These aren't my pictures but this a size comparison with a Forgeworld Warhound and Reaver titans:


This is it compared to the original armor cast Warhound though (they are roughly the same size):

Cheers - that helps a lot.
Might have to get Mortis after all.

I love it. I just hope some stores allow it. While Forgeworld make some impressive stuff the cost is insane. I don't know why anyone would not allow it as long as it is rule appropriate.

Forgot to say it's a great paint job!

Also where do these weapons come from?

 bubber wrote:
Forgot to say it's a great paint job!

Also where do these weapons come from?

Blood and Skulls Industry makes those

Cool - cheers for that!

Raptor007 wrote:
If you are looking around the 500 point level for the model, including a D weapon is going to be tricky.

To compare, the Shadowsword is close to that amount in points and only has one D weapon large blast. So adding the ability to have a void shield, shoot another massive titan level gun and be able to smash other titans and models in close combat for the same price needs some downside. The HP reduction to 6 does seem reasonable though, about %30 from the Warhound.

Honestly if you want to have the titan close combat weapon and void shield you will need to downgrade the weapons some. Go for Str10 Ap1 ignores cover large blast, or maybe Str D small blast. Something like that. I don't know all the other stats for the remaining guns.

Since you only have modeled CCW for the left arm make that weapon mandatory so no two ranged guns. Perhaps lower the BS to 3 so the WS can go up to 4.

Here is a summary of the imperial guard superheavies which are all around the point level you are looking at. So the Knight should be close to this level of dakka. http://cadiascreed40k.blogspot.com/2013/12/escalation-review-quick-one-for.html

Awesomely made rule sheet btw.

Thank you to Raptor for the consult on trying to get the rules more fair... This is the new and hopefully more balanced datasheet:

I was also thinking of adding the Hades Gatling gun like the Lord of Skulls has...
What do you guys think?

Also I pretty much finished the base and will try to post pictures of that later tonight. I think it still needs a few minor finishing details but it's getting close to being done.


**Edit- Thanks for the spell check and fact check, didn't mean to do the 5" blast. It should be right now, and you are right about the BS skill so I may just make a different variant data sheet and tweak the stats to let that one have more high volume shots like the Vulcan and Hades.

Thanks again!

That looks pretty good. 50 points is about where the Hellhammer gun should be.

Works out to 60 point premium over the real hellhammer for close combat abilities, movement increases, and an auto-cannon, with a small survivability decrease. After a test battle that may need to go up to 80 or something, but no more then that.

I will say the Hellhammer gun is actually a 7" blast, not a large blast. Was it your intention to reduce it down to large blast (5")?

Other then that note it looks good to me. If you are thinking of adding another ranged gun like the Hades Gun then the knight titan would have to go down to BS 3, like the Lord of Skulls. The BS 4 makes a large difference with 15 shot guns. Less so with the blast guns that Hell Knight has now.


That rule sheet is still awesome. Check for a couple spelling errors though, "Hell Knigh", "Plasma Destoryer", and I think Auto Cannon should be Autocannon.

Another small update... I am almost done with the base and have my Plasma Destroyer cannon spliced together and painted, but didn't get a chance to get pics yet. I should have some later tonight though.

If you look for them you can see the 2 magnets that his feet lock onto. I didn't want to have him permanently attached, as he stands well on his own and it might be handy to be able to remove it during play.





I think I may add some razor wire and other smaller details to better show off the scale of this monster.
I hope to get a camera that can capture detail and contrast better some day in the near future as the pics don't really show the base detail at all...

Adding razor wire would be good.
Also maybe making one of the craters into a puddle?

 bubber wrote:
Adding razor wire would be good.
Also maybe making one of the craters into a puddle?

I think I may try that too, I will have to get some of the water stuff.

Here is my Plasma Destroyer Cannon:

Nice Work.

I like your latest datasheet, I'll probably have to steal some of your ideas. In my mind a Reaver costs 1450, Warhound 720, so I figured the Knight Titan should be in the ball park of 360. I'm going to try and kit him out based off of that pts range.

On a seperate note, any tips/secrets on how you do your weathering technique? Awesome as usual!

I heard a rumor that some kind of rule set is coming out for knight titans in the near future. I wonder how close they will be to the above rules?

 Invicta wrote:
I like your latest datasheet, I'll probably have to steal some of your ideas. In my mind a Reaver costs 1450, Warhound 720, so I figured the Knight Titan should be in the ball park of 360. I'm going to try and kit him out based off of that pts range.

On a seperate note, any tips/secrets on how you do your weathering technique? Awesome as usual!

If your Knight titans are more to scale that would make sense, the dreamforge is a little larger than it should be so I was trying to point match the size to some extent. Many people use it for a warhound proxy as it is almost that size. But I agree, a normal sized knight would be in the 360-450 range depending on it's load out.
My weathering technique is as follows:

Metal frame:
Black spray primer > brush Abbadon Black > heavy drybrush Ironbreaker > drybrush highlight with Runefang Steel > wash all with Nuln Oil > Drybrush sparing highlight with Necron Compound
Then I go back and do more detail on bolts and various areas washes or technical paints for corrosion/rust etc.

Red areas:
Spray red primer (army painter) > Multiple very thin coats of Mephiston Red (until color is consistent) > drybrush Ironbreaker (in raised areas that look like they would be more susceptible to damage) > wash all with Nuln Oil > fine scratches with Runefang Steel

Hope that helps, and let me know if you have any other questions. I can't wait to see your Knights done! Also using Mr. potato head = winning.

 sub-zero wrote:
I heard a rumor that some kind of rule set is coming out for knight titans in the near future. I wonder how close they will be to the above rules?

If this is true it will be very interesting to see what type of unit the make the knight datasheet, as well as points/weapons/special rules etc. I hope they make a chaos version, but I guess time will tell.

currently building mine, am probably going to fit with 2 warhound weapons and use similar points cost, maybe less armour

I love where you are going with this but please for the love of the Emperor stop calling it a Knight Titan. Titans are one thing, Knights are totally different. A knight is the largest weapon system known to man which can be controlled by a single pilot. Warhound class scout-titans (the smallest of the Titans) requires 4. Not trying to be an utter tool here but I have an OCD or something with people calling Knights "Titans". Aside from that I think yours looks great. If you haven't read it already I'd suggest giving "Mechanicum" a read from the HH series. It's got the best source for Knight based fluff outside of the old Titan Legions game books.

First. You've managed to make a great model absolutely beautiful. It looks like it walked right out of a Blood Pact army from the Guant's Ghosts novels.

Second: The last set of rules you've made really make the most sense. The kits just don't look like they should have two war hound weapons on them. I don't know that any is really right for what their battlefield role is.

If in theory, you have one reaver for every two or three war hounds, you'd have two or three knights for every war hound. So if you had three knights with six war hound weapons.. Well you wouldn't really need the reaver except for long range support.

If/when I get one of these models. I think I'm going to use the rules for the Decimator demon engine. Might be fun, at least.

Nuwisha wrote:
I think I'm going to use the rules for the Decimator demon engine. Might be fun, at least.

Not a bad idea, I actually have a 15mm leviathan that I haven't started yet, but when I do I will probably use decimator rules. I don't know that it really matters, but have the forgeworld decimator and it is no where near the size of the 28mm crusader. Still a good idea though and you would be able to get it into a normal game that way.

Here are some pictures of the Cultists on the base. Still waiting on the razor wire and some "water" effects and then I think it will be pretty much done. Oh and I have to paint the Hellhammer cannon.
Sorry pics aren't the best, just grabbed some really quick.

very nice work!

I love the added cultists, great job man. This thing is a beast! I've been thinking about getting one of these or the Blight Wheel Miniatures Prometheus (because it looks like a giant Iron Warriors marine), your data sheet may have sealed the deal.

This is some really great work! I've been planning a similar conversion, though more radical in use of 40k and WHFB Chaos parts. I like how your conversion doesn't really use all that much in the way of GW Chaos bits spikes, skulls, etc., but still manages to fit in nicely with the rest of your army/aesthetic. Keep up the good work!

-Ben

 catharsix wrote:
This is some really great work! I've been planning a similar conversion, though more radical in use of 40k and WHFB Chaos parts. I like how your conversion doesn't really use all that much in the way of GW Chaos bits spikes, skulls, etc., but still manages to fit in nicely with the rest of your army/aesthetic. Keep up the good work!

-Ben

I am going to be doing a Mortis pretty soon and I may go a little heavier on the conversion, but I don't love the look of Chaos stuff with lots and lots of bits on it as I don't think they are necessarily needed to convey the evil look. But then again this is reflected in the rest of my army as well. If you do decide to make one make sure you post some pictures, I would love to see it!

I have about 100 votes on the poll and these are the results so far:




So it seems that a Warhound proxy is the way to go if you actually want to use your Leviathan. I'm going to close the poll out and then start a new one later. I will be interesting to see what happens if the GW offical Knights and Knight rules are released like the rumors.

Hi bladeiai, great paint job. Can you explain how you painted that rust effect for us noobi's please :-)

bopins wrote:
Hi bladeiai, great paint job. Can you explain how you painted that rust effect for us noobi's please :-)

I don't know if you saw my reply higher up the page but this is how I do the base colors:
(I may have used different techniques in different areas so if there is a specific area you were referring to let me know and I will try to answer specifically )

Metal frame:
Black spray primer > brush Abbadon Black > heavy drybrush Ironbreaker > drybrush highlight with Runefang Steel > wash all with Nuln Oil > Drybrush sparing highlight with Necron Compound
Then I go back and do more detail on bolts and various areas washes or technical paints for corrosion/rust etc.

Red areas:
Spray red primer (army painter) > Multiple very thin coats of Mephiston Red (until color is consistent) > drybrush Ironbreaker (in raised areas that look like they would be more susceptible to damage) > wash all with Nuln Oil > fine scratches with Runefang Steel

And the for the rust it varies by location and how bad I want it to look, but the basic idea is:

Rust/Corrosion
Drybrush with Doombull Brown > sparing use of Typhus Corrosion (I don't always use this) > Light Drybrush on highest point/corner with Runefang Steel

Sometimes I also do a wash with Agrax Earthshade before the above steps and also it works better if you already done the base as I posted above, as you will have the Ironbreaker under all of that to make it look better. The Typhus Corrosion can be used to varying degree and has a nice grit in it that adds to the effect. I didn't do any on this particular model (yet) but sometimes I do a very light and sporadic drybrushing with Fire Dragon Bright to highlight some of the rust areas. I have some chain that I did using it that I plan to hang from the Knight titan and my Reaver Titan and I was happy with the results, I'll post some pictures of it in the near future.

Also I finally got my razor wire for the base! So I should have an update with that soon too.

Well I finally managed to get some work done on my Reaver Titan, It still needs a few armor plates finished and a good amount of detail/aging work, but I think I can get most of that done tomorrow as it looks like I'm going to end up with a snow day.
There it is so far:
(Sorry pics are kind of blurry/dark/crappy)

Reaver is looking good! I guess the debate is over for the Knight Proxy rules since GW released the Knight Paladin and Errant

Sort of over. The sizes are still off. I think it's up in the air if you choose to use it for a knigth or a warhound, but that might all be settled once we see them side by side.

 Invicta wrote:
Reaver is looking good! I guess the debate is over for the Knight Proxy rules since GW released the Knight Paladin and Errant

Yeah I have pretty much decided to abandon the custom rules and go with the Knight Errant, it's a better deal points wise IMO anyways. I was going to start a new poll but can't figure out how to restart it (if it's even possible)

 Yonan wrote:
Sort of over. The sizes are still off. I think it's up in the air if you choose to use it for a knigth or a warhound, but that might all be settled once we see them side by side.

Well I was really hopeful that it was going to be the correct scale since the GW website originally said 8", but alas it is now looking like the 6-6.5" estimates where spot on. I still plan on running them as Knights, as the was the original idea anyways. I'm just glad there are official rules now.

Still a long, long, loooong way to go, but this is how he stands today (and this is after fixing paint/parts from dropping him
Without further ado, a ton of pictures:














Automatically Appended Next Post:
New poll started on the first post involving Warhound or Imperial Knight rules.