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I think that's just the "core " of the army.

Is anyone trying out Scarab Farm?


Nemesor Zandrekh

Troops
10 Warriors w/ Ghost Ark
10 Warriors w/ Ghost Ark

Fast Attack
3 Spyders w/ P. Beamer
3 Spyders w/ P. Beamer
3 Spyders w/ P. Beamer

Canoptek Harvest
6 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
Spyder w/ Beamer
9 Scarabs

1638 I don't know where you'd go from here.

Decurion + CAD for scarabs with 4+ RP.

Decurion (Warriors x2, Immortals, Tomb Blades, Overlord)
+ Canoptek Swarm (wraiths, Scarabs, Sypder)
CAD
Cryptek
Immortals
Immortals
Spyder x3
Spyder x3
Spyder x3
Scarab Swarm
Scarab Swarm

I haven't had a chance to try the army out yet, but I imagine that my oppoenent will find it quite difficult trying to wipe out a scarab swarm that grows by 10 bases per turn and has 4+ RP.

How many points is that? Also and again the Destroyer Cult shines with the ability to take 1 more H. Support choice and 3 more Fast Attack Choices. However this army has no defense against flying so I dunno how that would work out.

Normal Cad
80 Points Cryptek w/ Staff of Light

Troops
5 Immortals (85)
5 Immortals (85)

Fast Attack
6 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (258)
9 Scarabs (180)

H. Support
3 Spyders w/ Particle Beamers (180)
3 Spyders w/ Particle Beamers (180)
3 Spyders w/ Particle Beamers (180)

Destroyer Cult
Destroyer Lord w/ Phase Shifter , Warscythe (155)
3 Destroyers 1 H. Destroyer (130)
3 Destroyers 1 H. Destroyer (130)
3 Destroyers 1 H. Destroyer (130)
3 H. Destroyers (150)

New question, am I crazy or would a Destroyer Cult w/ Tomb Blades , Doom Scythes and Annihilation Barges be awesome.

Like just straight up Massive Firepower as much as possible.

Hollismason wrote:
How many points is that?

I don't have it exactly tweaked, yet because I don't really know what I want out of the HQs, but my group is usually running 2000 points, but it would be easy to trim it to 1850

------------

The Destroyer Cult is the bane of Space Marines. My first game with the new codex, I ran the Destroyer Cult against Black Templars at 1000 points.
Move, Shoot, Jet Pack back into cover, repeat.
He had never played agaisnt Necron Desttroyers before. You should have seen his face when he realised none of his models would be getting to roll armor saves.

If you take a full Cult of the Destroyer and drop one heavy, you have just enough points to buy the D Lord a Phylactery and Phase Shifter and fit in 1000 points.

Having a tanker instead of a Heavy in one unit isn't ideal, but it's something I guess. You can keep the staff of light, or go for a Hyperphase Sword or Voidblade to taste.

Hollismason wrote:

New question, am I crazy or would a Destroyer Cult w/ Tomb Blades , Doom Scythes and Annihilation Barges be awesome.

Like just straight up Massive Firepower as much as possible.

I rekon you are spot on with the Destroyer Cult paired with a "biker" tomb blade army. I am not sure of the constitution exactly but I think it would be an MSU style army that are super hard to catch or shoot at and very resilient?

Not so sure about the Scythes or Barges though.. Maybe a big ass Obelisk deep striking in the middle of the board instead?

Hollismason wrote:


Is anyone trying out Scarab Farm?

I am, 5 game tourney today and tomorrow. I ended up taking the simpler list I posted first (CAD: CCB, 2 arks, 12 wraiths, 9 scarabs, 9 spyders), because keeping track of which unit belongs to the harvest and which doesn't, didn't feel like something I'd be able to do all weekend... I'll try to post a quick overview of how it went.

changemod wrote:

bodazoka wrote:
IMO the best "brick" to start with in a list contains the below;

Destroyer Cult;

1 x Destroyer Lord w/ 2+ armour save and a Warscythe

2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer

3 x Heavy Destroyers

Combined Arms Detachment;

5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe

Should be enough AA there to at least break even if not win the air battle, you also have the late game contest ability still. Destroyers arriving from reserve to contest / grab objectives and annoy the crap out of the enemy.

Any ideas on what else the list needs?

Meh, if you're gonna do flyer spam, take a Deathbringer flight and eradicate FMCs and heavy vehicles.

Necrons don't need to contest objectives with five guys, exterminating the offending unit and dropping a fast unit onto their objective to steal it works fine.

I think I like the flexibility to do both that the Night Scythe provides, it can remove flyers and take down FMC's as well as getting my units around the board. I also wouldn't think 3 x flyers is flyer spam? (I assume you don't like flyer spam?).

I don't think the Doom Scythe is any good, id take the Night Scythe over it any day.

bodazoka wrote:


I don't think the Doom Scythe is any good, id take the Night Scythe over it any day.

Tbh, the fact that the formation reduces the scatter of each additional Doom Scythe firing at a target. With three Doom Scythes, the 3rd blast is unlikely to scatter against the same target (I'm assuming big threats like Knights or a Flyrant).

bodazoka wrote:
I think I like the flexibility to do both that the Night Scythe provides, it can remove flyers and take down FMC's as well as getting my units around the board. I also wouldn't think 3 x flyers is flyer spam? (I assume you don't like flyer spam?).

I don't think the Doom Scythe is any good, id take the Night Scythe over it any day.

Three units is the low end definition of spam, yes. You could certainly take more night scythes than that without taking allies, but that's kind of an exception. Generally you'd be filling an entire FOC section if you took three units of something.

What makes a Doom Scythe great is the ability to cause an as close to guaranteed as you can get pen against any vehicle, with AP1. Some S10 AP1 hits on a FMC mixed in with your S7 AP- makes it's one turn of shooting death more likely too.

changemod wrote:
Some S10 AP1 hits on a FMC

Wait a second, since when can templates hit flyers? Am I missing something?

FMC's arent Flyers, they are FMC's.
FMC's and Vehicle (Flyer) have different rules regarding the templates.

Ah, upon rereading it becomes clear. Skyfire templates do seem to work. Awesome! Don't know how I missed that.

Why take a DS if you can take a Sylon?

Range isn't an issue because FMC want to get close.

You get more hits with Sylons and can now, even moreso than before, use your own troops to increase the amount of hits generated (thx Decurion) and pretty much instantly blast it away. Unless 7th introduced a rule for you to never hit (not target!) your own models.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Why take a DS if you can take a Sylon?

Range isn't an issue because FMC want to get close.

You get more hits with Sylons and can now, even moreso than before, use your own troops to increase the amount of hits generated (thx Decurion) and pretty much instantly blast it away. Unless 7th introduced a rule for you to never hit (not target!) your own models.

Because how would you take one in a Decurion? You'd need a CAD for that. Too pricey IMO. To me it's either Decurion or CAD, but not both. Doesn't leave enough points for the shiny stuff.

As a question, when you use a CCB, what do you use it for?

 vipoid wrote:
As a question, when you use a CCB, what do you use it for?

I'd take 2+ (aura) and 4++ (phase shifter), and warscythe.

 vipoid wrote:
As a question, when you use a CCB, what do you use it for?

popping tanks and killing anything that doesn't have armourbane CC

with the flamer it also has a solid MSU clearing weapon

the bargeLord does best when paired with threats you can tie up the armourbane CC with/

Only played a couple of games so far but I'm liking what I've seen so far.
Wraiths are absolutely disgustingly durable. With a 4+ RP they effectively have a 2++ and it shows - a full deathwing command squad with belial couldn't manage a single wound.
Lychguard just shred terminators to pieces and for 25 points a pop they feel like a real bargain.
I'm looking into a judicator battalion next for some AP2 shooting and some fast response units

So after clarifying that D weapons ignore all RP rolls, not just sixes like I thought, knights seem like our bane. What are some thoughts on army builds to deal with the giants?

 buddha wrote:
So after clarifying that D weapons ignore all RP rolls, not just sixes like I thought, knights seem like our bane. What are some thoughts on army builds to deal with the giants?

Doombringer Flight.

Could work if both Doomscythes come in at the same time so you can pincer it and bypass the shield with one.

Hey guys,

So I'm keen as mustard to get my Necron army going. So far I've got the Tomb Awakened and Battleforce bundles. This is what I've come up with so far, as I want to plan the rest of my purchases accordingly:

Decurion
CCB - Phylactery, Warscythe, Phase Shifter, Gauntlet of Fire

Warriors x20 - Ghost Ark
Warriors x20 - Ghost Ark
Immortals x5 - Gauss, Night Scythe

Tomb Blades x6 - Nebuloscopes, Beamers, Shield Vanes

Here's where I am stuck: I want to use a unit of 6 Wraiths (who doesn't!) but don't really care for the Spyder and Scarabs. I also like Deathmarks, Praetorians and Lychguard, but don't know where I could fit them in. I think the Doomscythe formation sounds good, but its damned expensive... The list above comes to 1294, and I want to keep it to 2000. How would you fill out the remaining points? Please note that I want to go silver tide, but I could drop the Warriors to 15 each to free up some points (and maybe drop a Ghost Ark and just have the one floating behind both blobs?). I'm also not averse to taking another unit of Gauss Immortals in a Nightscythe to get some more AA presence on the board.

Thanks for your suggestions.

 buddha wrote:
So after clarifying that D weapons ignore all RP rolls, not just sixes like I thought, knights seem like our bane. What are some thoughts on army builds to deal with the giants?

Big warrior blobs guessing them from multiple directions.

Jefffar wrote:

 buddha wrote:
So after clarifying that D weapons ignore all RP rolls, not just sixes like I thought, knights seem like our bane. What are some thoughts on army builds to deal with the giants?

Big warrior blobs guessing them from multiple directions.

If the problem is that Knights can kill large groups of our stuff... .throwing large groups of stuff at it doesn't seem smart.
Go MSU, that way even if you roll badly - there's only so much he can kill a turn.

exsanguis wrote:
Hey guys,

So I'm keen as mustard to get my Necron army going. So far I've got the Tomb Awakened and Battleforce bundles. This is what I've come up with so far, as I want to plan the rest of my purchases accordingly:

Decurion
CCB - Phylactery, Warscythe, Phase Shifter, Gauntlet of Fire

Warriors x20 - Ghost Ark
Warriors x20 - Ghost Ark
Immortals x5 - Gauss, Night Scythe

Tomb Blades x6 - Nebuloscopes, Beamers, Shield Vanes

Here's where I am stuck: I want to use a unit of 6 Wraiths (who doesn't!) but don't really care for the Spyder and Scarabs. I also like Deathmarks, Praetorians and Lychguard, but don't know where I could fit them in. I think the Doomscythe formation sounds good, but its damned expensive... The list above comes to 1294, and I want to keep it to 2000. How would you fill out the remaining points? Please note that I want to go silver tide, but I could drop the Warriors to 15 each to free up some points (and maybe drop a Ghost Ark and just have the one floating behind both blobs?). I'm also not averse to taking another unit of Gauss Immortals in a Nightscythe to get some more AA presence on the board.

Thanks for your suggestions.

Honestly, I'm not sure Decurion is the best way to go. You lose some list-building flexibility in that if you want to take a certain unit, others come along with it. Do they have some synergy and some good special rules? Absolutely. However, if you just want to build an army and play, I would probably recommend taking a regular Combined Arms Detachment. Most importantly, you gain objective: secured, which the Decurion does not have. So if you're playing objectives, and you don't kill the other guy's troops, he can simply withstand your firepower and win in the end. Not my kind of battle personally. And while the Decurion gives you a ton of durability, I am not convinced that it also makes you killy enough for that to be the difference maker.

That's just my two cents though. The other reason why I woudk advocate it is because then you could take what you want and not what you have to take. You can easily fit all the units you've listed in at 2k if you don't have other units that you have to take. And if you're tight on points, you could drop a GA or have someone besides the immortals ride in a night scythe. Or you can just have a Cryptek take a veil of darkness and teleport the unit (probably Lychguard) wherever you want them to go on turn on. All of your units that you want to play are good and have their uses. The only unit that I'm a little iffy on is the death marks because they only wound on 2+ the turn they come in; however they get to pop your opponent's unit before they blink so that is no small advantage either. Lots of great options.

To be honest, I think this is the first codex since Eldar that you really can say "just play what you want and it will be fine". So why limit yourself? You still get 5+ RP - that's only 16% worse in the worst case scenario. It can often be more like 6-8% of a difference if you take an armor save also.

luke1705 wrote:


You still get 5+ RP - that's only 16% worse in the worst case scenario. It can often be more like 6-8% of a difference if you take an armor save also.

It's 16% more to pass, but a 4+ RP vs a 5+ also means you pass a whopping 50% more of your rolls. That goes up to a 100% more vs ID wounds. Versus a single wound the difference is small, but I promise you that the effect will be noticeable over a game. I know I'll be playing decurion from now onwards

I agree with luke. Sometimes you just want to add different units and dont want to deal with prerequisites. Might start with a destroyer cult and want to add stalkers but dont have the points for praetorians. Might want obyron and a D lord for double veil action (flayed ones) and dont want a whole royal court. Wraiths without the canoptek formation.

Decurions are great and will probably be featured in about 1/3 of my lists. The buff is undeniable but sometimes list flexibility wins out.

TompiQ wrote:

luke1705 wrote:


You still get 5+ RP - that's only 16% worse in the worst case scenario. It can often be more like 6-8% of a difference if you take an armor save also.

It's 16% more to pass, but a 4+ RP vs a 5+ also means you pass a whopping 50% more of your rolls. That goes up to a 100% more vs ID wounds. Versus a single wound the difference is small, but I promise you that the effect will be noticeable over a game. I know I'll be playing decurion from now onwards

While that 50% stat is technically true for "how many more RP rolls you pass" it's also the definition of misleading statistics. Yes this is a dice game and anything can happen. And you're right - over the course of 100 shots, even 6% less unsaved wounds is not nothing. I'm merely pointing out that the difference is not as large as some people may have made it out to be. Saying that the difference is small for 1 wound and then different for a large amount of wounds is also not really true - the percentage holds the same throughout.

FWIW, I'm not saying that you won't notice the effects. I'm simply saying that I think it might be the tactically better decision to have obsec over increased durability. Because at the end of the game, I think I will more often notice that although I am alive, I can't contest any objectives. But I would love to be wrong. Decurion looks like a ton of fun and I will certainly give it a go at some point.

Math for those who care, those who don't, gloss away:

100 bolter shots vs Necron warriors:

Say they are BS 3, so 50 hits
Str 4 vs T 4, so 25 wounds
12.5 unsaved wounds (4+ armor)
6.25 failed RP (4+)
8.33 failed RP (5+)

So the difference between RP 4+ and 5+ for 100 bolter shots is 2.1 less dead Necron warriors. Again, not statistically insignificant, but nothing I plan on losing obsec over.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
FWIW it becomes a difference of 4 warriors when the BS is 4

Your almost always going to be better off with obsec. Necrons still do the late game objective steal better then most armies and with out obsec your basically losing this ability.

5 immortals/10 warriors in a NS don't need +1 RP, they need obsec.

If your planning on running a lot of ground pounding warriors then I still think your better off with obsec for different reasons.

1. You have the characters and ghost arcs to make the difference laughable.

2. You have the numbers

3. Your now much slower with very limited ranged weapons, your going to need obsec to prevent other armies from stealing/contesting.

I think the Decurion can be made to work, but why bother if it requires so much effort to make work. A CAD + formationsis much more flexible and will make TAC lists better.