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d-usa wrote: The petty argument is not about the size.
The actual argument is about the lie.
Eh? I thought Spicer et. & el. were arguing it's the largest crowd ever...
Did they walk that back?
No, Whem'. The point is that they lied about something so insignificant, and obviously, not what the lie was. And that they then talked about keeping the media "in check" (or whatever the phrase was)... because they called them out on such an obvious lie.
Remember what Spicer actually said: "This was the largest audience to ever witness an inauguration — period — both in person and around the globe."
Snopes won't call it false instead calling it unproven.
Team Trump got the Press (and all you) to piss and moan over it the last few days, massively diminishing the coverage of the Women's March and other issues. Pretty brilliant move really. Media shown a cookie and dove right for it, not realizing they got played. False or not, Team Trump is making the media dance like an organ grinder's monkey.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
d-usa wrote: The petty argument is not about the size.
The actual argument is about the lie.
Eh? I thought Spicer et. & el. were arguing it's the largest crowd ever...
Did they walk that back?
No, Whem'. The point is that they lied about something so insignificant, and obviously, not what the lie was. And that they then talked about keeping the media "in check" (or whatever the phrase was)... because they called them out on such an obvious lie.
Ah...
Meh... media did this to themselves (see last 8 years covering Obama)...
All this chicken little hysteria is falling right into their trap.
Seriously, this is stray voltage here...
So are you ever going to answer the question of how the media was lax on Obama? Now I'm sure they will be far more aggressive with Trump, (because he attacks them all the time), but you have yet to answer on how the media didn't go after Obama's mistakes/lies?
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
d-usa wrote: Are we still repeating the lie that the media was not adversarial towards Obama?
I see drinking the koolaid was not limited to the rightwingers in the US.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
d-usa wrote: #TeamAlternativeFacts is glad to have you on board.
Witty. I am going to have to raise the "I'm Rubber You're Glue" shields to maximum.
Frankly I prefer B5's better term " Goodfacts." remember Realfacts just get in the way. Where's Garibaldi when you need him?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 19:48:52
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Funnily enough, they seem to have had no shortage of links to, wait for it, media websites, that pointed out each and every flaw and slip and misstep of the Obama administration. Strange how that works.
I personally like the #seanspicersays. As in #seanspicerssays the rebels were not responsible for the destruction of the Death Star.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/01/23 19:54:40
Of course this has been covered over and over and over again in this thread and the ones before them. But you and others will just repeat it again. Go alternative facts!
I particularly liked the links about FEMA concentration camps and Jade Helm taking over the US. Whats less humorous is that there were people who weren't trolling and honestly believed them.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 19:59:31
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
d-usa wrote: Are we still repeating the lie that the media was not adversarial towards Obama?
You don't see how the press largely fawned over Obama himself??
Lie? Really?
You mean like the alternate fact - that the press secretary and other people in the Obama administration explicitly said false things about Benghazi? You mean like the alternate fact - the Obama administration sent Susan Rice to lie to the public over what transpired in Benghazi and not be ashamed? You mean like the alternate fact - that Obama and HRC blamed that youtube video over the fallen's own caskets? Was there press pushback? No... because it all occured in the backdrop of the 2012 elections, and the press by and large protected Obama. You mean like the alternate fact - that the Obama administration lied about the extent of the IRS targeting of conservatives? First it started as low level staffers... then, it was just peeps in Cincinnati... all.the.way. to Lois Lerner who was held in contempt of Congress for her refusal to cooperate. You mean like the alternate fact - where the Obama admin lied about cash transfers to Iran and the nature of the Iranian deal... You mean like the alternate fact - that Obama's own AG Holder is the first AG to be held in contempt of Congress over Fast & Furious... push back... do you see it? You mean like the alternate fact - on how divisive Obama was whilst in the WhiteHouse... Mr. "I Won" and Mr. "I have pen and phone"... never showing any inkling of wanting to work with anyone 'across the aisle'. You mean like the alternate fact - And probably the whopper where the president himself saying repeatedly ‘If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it’ while millions of people lost their healthcare plans... media always faults the GOP for "not fixing" the law.
Press don't got much credibility here... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
So are you ever going to answer the question of how the media was lax on Obama? Now I'm sure they will be far more aggressive with Trump, (because he attacks them all the time), but you have yet to answer on how the media didn't go after Obama's mistakes/lies?
Just did... not an exclusive list either.
EDIT: yes, media should be harshwith Trump.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:00:30
H.R.586 - To provide that human life shall be deemed to begin with fertilization.
... and it begins.
It's an interesting argument because there is no realistic practical way of determining that fertilization has taken place except retrospectively. If a woman has unprotected sex, and takes the morning after pill, there is no medical way of showing that her ovum had been fertilized unless it was, the pill fails, and several weeks later it is seen that she has become pregnant.
Another aspect of this is that fertlized ova do not automatically implant in the uterus, and when failing to do so either abort naturally or become a life threatening condition (implantation in the fallopian tube.)
In short, the concept is bs from a medical standpoint.
H.R.586 - To provide that human life shall be deemed to begin with fertilization.
... and it begins.
Actually thats not off from current case law. The real issue is when life can can exist outside the womb. As technology advances the state's compelling interest in protecting the life of its citizenry will advance.
An interest that isn't so compelling when it comes to medical insurance.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 19:59:55
Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Gordon Shumway wrote: Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Who are you talking to?
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Gordon Shumway wrote: Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Nah... just countering the idea that the press was 'adversarial' towards the Obama administration... nothing to do with Trump.
Gordon Shumway wrote: Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Who are you talking to?
Sorry, I should have used quotes. I was talking to Whembly, but didn't want the massive text quote.
Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt), who campaigned hard against the Trans-Pacific Partnership in last year’s Democratic presidential primaries, praised President Trump for an executive order to officially pull the United States out of the deal.
“I am glad the Trans-Pacific Partnership is dead and gone,” Sanders said. “For the last 30 years, we have had a series of trade deals – including the North American Free Trade Agreement, permanent normal trade relations with China and others – which have cost us millions of decent-paying jobs and caused a ‘race to the bottom’ which has lowered wages for American workers. Now is the time to develop a new trade policy that helps working families, not just multinational corporations. If President Trump is serious about a new policy to help American workers, then I would be delighted to work with him.”
Most Democrats in Congress opposed the TPP, putting them at odds with the Obama administration until its final day in office. During the campaign, Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton came out against the TPP after praising the negotiations that had resulted in it. After the election, Sanders and others saw Trump’s victory as the stake through the heart of the trade deal.
And today, Democrats who like Sanders had campaigned against Trump joined him in saluting the executive order.
“I support President Trump’s issuing of an executive orders that will pull the U.S. out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) and his recent steps to renegotiate the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA),” said Sen. Bob Casey (D-Penn.) in a statement. “NAFTA has adversely impacted middle class families in Pennsylvania and the TPP would have cost jobs and hurt income growth, which is why I voted against fast tracking the deal in 2015.”
Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-Wis.) shared a similar reaction on Twitter:
Withdrawing from #TPP & moving to renegotiate #NAFTA are good 1st steps from @POTUS, but more must be done to keep his word to WI workers.
— Sen. Tammy Baldwin (@SenatorBaldwin) January 23, 2017
Like Sanders, both Baldwin and Casey are up for re-election in 2018. Unlike Sanders, both watched their states break for Donald Trump in 2016, after decades of solid Democratic wins.
That victory not only emboldened the trade skeptics in the Democratic Party, but stirred a sense of urgency for the party to abandon any “neoliberal” tendencies. With Hillary Clinton defeated, and Barack Obama in retirement, no leading Democrat now supports major international trade deals. In an interview this month with the Washington Post, former Obama administration Secretary of Labor Tom Perez, now a candidate to run the Democratic National Committee, pointedly declined to say what the end of the TPP meant for workers.
Other forces on the left have gone further, asking that they, not Trump, get the credit for the turn against the TPP — and pointing out that by the end, it was Republicans in Congress who wanted it passed. In a statement today, AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka said that “a powerful coalition of labor, environmental, consumer, public health and allied groups came together to stop the TPP,” giving little credit to Trump.
“Today’s announcement that the US is withdrawing from TPP and seeking a reopening of NAFTA is an important first step toward a trade policy that works for working people,” said Trumka. “While these are necessary actions, they aren’t enough. They are just the first in a series of necessary policy changes required to build a fair and just global economy. We will continue our relentless campaign to create new trade and economic rules that end special privileges for foreign investors and Big Pharma, protect our planet’s precious natural resources and ensure fair pay, safe conditions and a voice in the workplace for all workers.”
And in his own statement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer insisted that “TPP was dead long before President Trump took office.”
“We await real action on trade,” he said.
I don't really know enough about the TPP... only that lots a people don't like it.
Re-negotiation of trade deals may be a good thing from time-to-time as economic realities may have changed since it's implementation.
Prestor Jon wrote: The Federal govt has a vested interest in making sure that university systems they subsidize allow for the free and open exchange of ideas and opinions.
Good luck turning that into a practical policy. What are you going to do, monitor every speaker at universities and add up their ideological bias, with funding withheld if the average gets too far left or right? Or should we skip the idea that universities get to set their own policies and assign each university a list of speakers to invite with funding penalties if they don't comply?
You're correct that student protests that result in the cancellation of guest speakers/lecturers isn't a violation of constitutionally protected free speech but while lawful it's still a terrible, unreasonable and intolerant practice.
SHUT UP DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT ANYTHING WE NEED TO HAVE FREE SPEECH HERE.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CptJake wrote: Team Trump got the Press (and all you) to piss and moan over it the last few days, massively diminishing the coverage of the Women's March and other issues. Pretty brilliant move really. Media shown a cookie and dove right for it, not realizing they got played. False or not, Team Trump is making the media dance like an organ grinder's monkey.
Of course that media distraction comes at the cost of presenting it as "Trump is a narcissistic clown who wants 1984 to be reality", so I'd say that's hardly a win.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:10:44
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
Gordon Shumway wrote: Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Nah... just countering the idea that the press was 'adversarial' towards the Obama administration... nothing to do with Trump.
If that were the case, how was it possible for you constantly post (before you started using spoilers, thanks by the way) massive stories about all of the misdeeds of the Obama admin? The extensive research you have posted ad nauseum about Benghazi, for example. All you know about it, as I'm guessing you weren't actually there, comes from "the media". Or Clinton's email stupidity? That came from "the media" too.
Here's the thing: everything we know about the world that doesn't come from our own personal observations, comes from "the media". "Media" is the middle man when it comes to stuff we can't personally experience or see. That is important. You must be consuming "the media" to have had such a hatred, or rather lack of appreciation, of Obama, as I doubt you have met him. That means that the media must have been printing/posting bad stuff about him or your reading skills are just bad.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:14:32
whembly wrote: *Long list of stuff that has nothing to do with your original argument*
You know what, I'm just going to stop humoring your Trumpian technique of not every actually seeing a single argument to completion. And this entire post has nothing to do with your argument, and offers no actual support to it.
You don't get to make the claim that the press was always soft on Obama and after 8 years if finally adversarial again, and then simply switch to another argument the moment you get called out on it, and then repeat the original argument the next month, only to switch to another different argument when you get called out on it again.
That's how every argument goes. You state A, then switch to "but B", then "what about C" and "yeah but D did E".
So just for this single time, give the thread that has put up with your underhanded arguments and refusal to ever see an actual argument to completion the common courtesy to see your argument through to the end instead of just switching the subject the moment it falls apart.
So let's be clear, for the argument of "the press was soft on Obama" it doesn't matter even one tiny little bit what Obama did because the argument was not about him. The argument is about the press and your claim that they were not adversarial to the Obama administration. It's not about Benghazi, it's not about about any other number of pet causes you have, it's about a single actor "the press" doing a single action "not being adversarial to Obama".
So finish that one argument before jumping into three different ones.
You're correct that student protests that result in the cancellation of guest speakers/lecturers isn't a violation of constitutionally protected free speech but while lawful it's still a terrible, unreasonable and intolerant practice.
SHUT UP DON'T COMPLAIN ABOUT ANYTHING WE NEED TO HAVE FREE SPEECH HERE.
So you’re arguing for or against the Heckler’s Veto here?
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt), who campaigned hard against the Trans-Pacific Partnership in last year’s Democratic presidential primaries, praised President Trump for an executive order to officially pull the United States out of the deal.
“I am glad the Trans-Pacific Partnership is dead and gone,” Sanders said. “For the last 30 years, we have had a series of trade deals – including the North American Free Trade Agreement, permanent normal trade relations with China and others – which have cost us millions of decent-paying jobs and caused a ‘race to the bottom’ which has lowered wages for American workers. Now is the time to develop a new trade policy that helps working families, not just multinational corporations. If President Trump is serious about a new policy to help American workers, then I would be delighted to work with him.”
Most Democrats in Congress opposed the TPP, putting them at odds with the Obama administration until its final day in office. During the campaign, Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton came out against the TPP after praising the negotiations that had resulted in it. After the election, Sanders and others saw Trump’s victory as the stake through the heart of the trade deal.
And today, Democrats who like Sanders had campaigned against Trump joined him in saluting the executive order.
“I support President Trump’s issuing of an executive orders that will pull the U.S. out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) and his recent steps to renegotiate the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA),” said Sen. Bob Casey (D-Penn.) in a statement. “NAFTA has adversely impacted middle class families in Pennsylvania and the TPP would have cost jobs and hurt income growth, which is why I voted against fast tracking the deal in 2015.”
Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-Wis.) shared a similar reaction on Twitter:
Withdrawing from #TPP & moving to renegotiate #NAFTA are good 1st steps from @POTUS, but more must be done to keep his word to WI workers.
— Sen. Tammy Baldwin (@SenatorBaldwin) January 23, 2017
Like Sanders, both Baldwin and Casey are up for re-election in 2018. Unlike Sanders, both watched their states break for Donald Trump in 2016, after decades of solid Democratic wins.
That victory not only emboldened the trade skeptics in the Democratic Party, but stirred a sense of urgency for the party to abandon any “neoliberal” tendencies. With Hillary Clinton defeated, and Barack Obama in retirement, no leading Democrat now supports major international trade deals. In an interview this month with the Washington Post, former Obama administration Secretary of Labor Tom Perez, now a candidate to run the Democratic National Committee, pointedly declined to say what the end of the TPP meant for workers.
Other forces on the left have gone further, asking that they, not Trump, get the credit for the turn against the TPP — and pointing out that by the end, it was Republicans in Congress who wanted it passed. In a statement today, AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka said that “a powerful coalition of labor, environmental, consumer, public health and allied groups came together to stop the TPP,” giving little credit to Trump.
“Today’s announcement that the US is withdrawing from TPP and seeking a reopening of NAFTA is an important first step toward a trade policy that works for working people,” said Trumka. “While these are necessary actions, they aren’t enough. They are just the first in a series of necessary policy changes required to build a fair and just global economy. We will continue our relentless campaign to create new trade and economic rules that end special privileges for foreign investors and Big Pharma, protect our planet’s precious natural resources and ensure fair pay, safe conditions and a voice in the workplace for all workers.”
And in his own statement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer insisted that “TPP was dead long before President Trump took office.”
“We await real action on trade,” he said.
I don't really know enough about the TPP... only that lots a people don't like it.
Re-negotiation of trade deals may be a good thing from time-to-time as economic realities may have changed since it's implementation.
There you go again, posting stuff from "the media". You sure like to hate on them while at the same time using them to make your observations. We can't trust it. It is from "the media". They have agendas.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:25:08
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Gordon Shumway wrote: Wow, for someone who says they really don't like Trump, you are sure defending his perspective. I wonder why that is? #seanspicersays: Whembly isn't handwaiving outright lies and doing our work for us by distracting from the fact that we are using "alternative facts".
Well he's been #TrumpForWhiteHouse from the beginning. No surprise therefore he protects his candinate.
whembly wrote: *Long list of stuff that has nothing to do with your original argument*
You know what, I'm just going to stop humoring your Trumpian technique of not every actually seeing a single argument to completion. And this entire post has nothing to do with your argument, and offers no actual support to it.
You don't get to make the claim that the press was always soft on Obama and after 8 years if finally adversarial again, and then simply switch to another argument the moment you get called out on it, and then repeat the original argument the next month, only to switch to another different argument when you get called out on it again.
That's how every argument goes. You state A, then switch to "but B", then "what about C" and "yeah but D did E".
So just for this single time, give the thread that has put up with your underhanded arguments and refusal to ever see an actual argument to completion the common courtesy to see your argument through to the end instead of just switching the subject the moment it falls apart.
So let's be clear, for the argument of "the press was soft on Obama" it doesn't matter even one tiny little bit what Obama did because the argument was not about him. The argument is about the press and your claim that they were not adversarial to the Obama administration. It's not about Benghazi, it's not about about any other number of pet causes you have, it's about a single actor "the press" doing a single action "not being adversarial to Obama".
So finish that one argument before jumping into three different ones.
So... I post some stuff that actually supports my assertions... but, you wanna ignore them because, seemingly, it's too inconvenient for you...
What gives man?
Lemme state this succinctly then:
The.Press.Were.Not.Adversarial.To.The.Obama.Administration.
Those issues, if they occurred during a GOP administration, the press would rightly have gone DEEP THROAT on their asses.
Yes. In fact, it is your patriotic duty as Americans.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt), who campaigned hard against the Trans-Pacific Partnership in last year’s Democratic presidential primaries, praised President Trump for an executive order to officially pull the United States out of the deal.
“I am glad the Trans-Pacific Partnership is dead and gone,” Sanders said. “For the last 30 years, we have had a series of trade deals – including the North American Free Trade Agreement, permanent normal trade relations with China and others – which have cost us millions of decent-paying jobs and caused a ‘race to the bottom’ which has lowered wages for American workers. Now is the time to develop a new trade policy that helps working families, not just multinational corporations. If President Trump is serious about a new policy to help American workers, then I would be delighted to work with him.”
Most Democrats in Congress opposed the TPP, putting them at odds with the Obama administration until its final day in office. During the campaign, Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton came out against the TPP after praising the negotiations that had resulted in it. After the election, Sanders and others saw Trump’s victory as the stake through the heart of the trade deal.
And today, Democrats who like Sanders had campaigned against Trump joined him in saluting the executive order.
“I support President Trump’s issuing of an executive orders that will pull the U.S. out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) and his recent steps to renegotiate the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA),” said Sen. Bob Casey (D-Penn.) in a statement. “NAFTA has adversely impacted middle class families in Pennsylvania and the TPP would have cost jobs and hurt income growth, which is why I voted against fast tracking the deal in 2015.”
Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-Wis.) shared a similar reaction on Twitter:
Withdrawing from #TPP & moving to renegotiate #NAFTA are good 1st steps from @POTUS, but more must be done to keep his word to WI workers.
— Sen. Tammy Baldwin (@SenatorBaldwin) January 23, 2017
Like Sanders, both Baldwin and Casey are up for re-election in 2018. Unlike Sanders, both watched their states break for Donald Trump in 2016, after decades of solid Democratic wins.
That victory not only emboldened the trade skeptics in the Democratic Party, but stirred a sense of urgency for the party to abandon any “neoliberal” tendencies. With Hillary Clinton defeated, and Barack Obama in retirement, no leading Democrat now supports major international trade deals. In an interview this month with the Washington Post, former Obama administration Secretary of Labor Tom Perez, now a candidate to run the Democratic National Committee, pointedly declined to say what the end of the TPP meant for workers.
Other forces on the left have gone further, asking that they, not Trump, get the credit for the turn against the TPP — and pointing out that by the end, it was Republicans in Congress who wanted it passed. In a statement today, AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka said that “a powerful coalition of labor, environmental, consumer, public health and allied groups came together to stop the TPP,” giving little credit to Trump.
“Today’s announcement that the US is withdrawing from TPP and seeking a reopening of NAFTA is an important first step toward a trade policy that works for working people,” said Trumka. “While these are necessary actions, they aren’t enough. They are just the first in a series of necessary policy changes required to build a fair and just global economy. We will continue our relentless campaign to create new trade and economic rules that end special privileges for foreign investors and Big Pharma, protect our planet’s precious natural resources and ensure fair pay, safe conditions and a voice in the workplace for all workers.”
And in his own statement, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer insisted that “TPP was dead long before President Trump took office.”
“We await real action on trade,” he said.
I don't really know enough about the TPP... only that lots a people don't like it.
Re-negotiation of trade deals may be a good thing from time-to-time as economic realities may have changed since it's implementation.
There you go again, posting stuff from "the media". You sure like to hate on them while at the same time using them to make your observations. We can't trust it. It is from "the media". They have agendas.
They *do* have agendas... that's my whole point.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:47:39
On the one hand, I believe that violence in lieu of speech is wrong, even against Nazis (assuming the nazis are being peaceful, or about as peaceful for any group that advocates genocide).
On the other, to see that Nazi feth get punched and then completely wuss out did my heart good.
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
whembly wrote: *Long list of stuff that has nothing to do with your original argument*
You know what, I'm just going to stop humoring your Trumpian technique of not every actually seeing a single argument to completion. And this entire post has nothing to do with your argument, and offers no actual support to it.
You don't get to make the claim that the press was always soft on Obama and after 8 years if finally adversarial again, and then simply switch to another argument the moment you get called out on it, and then repeat the original argument the next month, only to switch to another different argument when you get called out on it again.
That's how every argument goes. You state A, then switch to "but B", then "what about C" and "yeah but D did E".
So just for this single time, give the thread that has put up with your underhanded arguments and refusal to ever see an actual argument to completion the common courtesy to see your argument through to the end instead of just switching the subject the moment it falls apart.
So let's be clear, for the argument of "the press was soft on Obama" it doesn't matter even one tiny little bit what Obama did because the argument was not about him. The argument is about the press and your claim that they were not adversarial to the Obama administration. It's not about Benghazi, it's not about about any other number of pet causes you have, it's about a single actor "the press" doing a single action "not being adversarial to Obama".
So finish that one argument before jumping into three different ones.
So... I post some stuff that actually supports my assertions... but, you wanna ignore them because, seemingly, it's too inconvenient for you...
What gives man?
Lemme state this succinctly then:
The.Press.Were.Not.Adversarial.To.The.Obama.Administration.
Those issues, if they occurred during a GOP administration, the press would rightly have gone DEEP THROAT on their asses.
On the one hand, I believe that violence in lieu of speech is wrong, even against Nazis (assuming the nazis are being peaceful, or about as peaceful for any group that advocates genocide).
On the other, to see that Nazi feth get punched and then completely wuss out did my heart good.
Well Supremecists, KKK, American Nazis no because they aren't nazis.
Real NAZIS - put a bullet in their brains. But as the Nazi party died Spring 1945, they would be 90+ now...
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Team Trump got the Press (and all you) to piss and moan over it the last few days, massively diminishing the coverage of the Women's March and other issues.
I think you're giving Trump too much credit. He is simultaneously not that dumb, nor that smart (in the words of Coke's ceo). Calling so much attention to his own lackluster crowd only makes the horde that descended on Washington the next day even more apparent, and made Trump look like a complete egotist with no grasp on reality for the trouble.
At some point people are going to have to stop blaming everyone but Trump for the stupid stuff Trump does (the party of personal responsibility on full display).
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/23 20:58:06
