Author |
Message |
 |
|
 |
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/06 14:37:18
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.
Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.
Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.
Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 03:19:01
Subject: Re:Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Longtime Dakkanaut
Cheyenne WY
|
Currently I am leaning towards +2...has Talons, so 6, extra pair? +1, Extra extra pair? +1...seems to read that way anyhow...
|
The will of the hive is always the same: HUNGER |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 04:29:33
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Regular Dakkanaut
|
Anyone look much into the sporocyst? On paper seems pretty good at dishing mortal wounds
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 05:18:42
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Infiltrating Broodlord
|
Drager wrote:I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.
Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.
Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.
Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.
The rule says if you have more than 1 pair you get +1 atk
Not you get +1 per pair
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 05:45:18
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
GodDamUser wrote:Drager wrote:I think more than 1 pair might give you +1 per pair. So +3, making it... 8? I think. Not sure though this is an ongoing discussion in YMDC. Many RAW and RAI arguments.
Best RAW in favour: Matches with Chainsword. Each weapon has the wording, they aren't a set of 3.
Best RAI in favour: 3 sets costs more than 2. If they didn't give more attacks then they would cost the same.
Neither is totally solid and can easily be argued the other way. I don't have a strong stance yet, but am leaning towards +3 for Trygons.
The rule says if you have more than 1 pair you get +1 atk
Not you get +1 per pair
No it doesn't. It says you get +1 with this weapon and all the weapons say that independently. If it said:
"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer is yellow, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights."
Would it get +1 or +1 per pair? That is functionally the same wording with a different condition. Now I'm not saying it's definitely +1 per pair. I am saying it's unclear.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/07 05:46:03
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 05:53:55
Subject: Re:Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Infiltrating Broodlord
|
"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer has more than one pair of (they forgot to say Massive) scything talons, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights"
So it says +1 if it has more than
pretty clear tbh
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 06:07:11
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
Yes it says +1 if the bearer has more than one pair. Each weapon says this. This is equivalent to the hypothetical I posted, but I replaced the trigger. Does that make sense?
Should probably move this talk to ymdc where there is a thread.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/727792.page
|
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/07 07:44:42
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 07:09:54
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Infiltrating Broodlord
|
I wonder why they lowered the save of the T-fex from to 2+ to 3+?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 07:45:22
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 08:32:19
Subject: Re:Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Norn Queen
|
GodDamUser wrote:"You can re-roll hit rolls of 1 when attacking with this weapon. If the bearer has more than one pair of (they forgot to say Massive) scything talons, it can make 1 additional attack with this weapon each time it fights" So it says +1 if it has more than pretty clear tbh You keep cutting out the "With this weapon" part that is also there and very important. In 8th you can split your attacks up with different weapons. So if a model gets 4 attacks and uses 1 pair of Scy Tal with 3 of those attacks it gets +1 attacks "With this weapon." If it then uses the other 1 attack with the other pair it also gets +1 attacks "With this weapon". Each weapon gets the bonus for having 2 pairs.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/07 08:34:54
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 08:47:45
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Fully-charged Electropriest
UK
|
You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".
It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.
The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/07 08:49:05
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 08:50:57
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Norn Queen
|
Loopstah wrote:You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".
It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.
The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.
Which is a fair interpretation but amounts to the same thing. Each weapon would still be granting 1 more attack individually for 2 extra attacks.
|
These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 09:01:38
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
At this point I think we should just shif tthe ScyTal thing to YMDC. My conclusion: Ambiguous, needs FAQ.
What do people think of using 2 GSC Primus guys with a unit of 20 Purestrains and a Patriarch (Supreme Command Detachment) as a bolster to a nids force? The rerolls to the cult ambush rule make it pretty reliable and that many attacks popping up and charging is tasty.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 09:05:51
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Servoarm Flailing Magos
|
Man, Onslaught is terribly worded. It's trying to say everything at once. Was there a limited amount of space left on the page or something?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 09:38:37
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Locked in the Tower of Amareo
|
Lance845 wrote:Loopstah wrote:You are misunderstandings the use of "this weapon".
It doesn't indicate a requirement to attack with that weapon, it indicates that the extra attacks uses the profile of that weapon.
The only requirement for the extra attacks is that the bearer fights, and this requirement can be triggered for every weapon with that rule if you have multiples.
Which is a fair interpretation but amounts to the same thing. Each weapon would still be granting 1 more attack individually for 2 extra attacks.
But is important for stats of attack if you have weapon A as well as the pair with weapon A being better. Extra attacks would be with scything talon stats. Similar to how power fist and chainsword marine can attack with all attacks with fist except the bonus attack that's on chainsword stats.
And yeah tactical marine with 2 chainswords would have 3(1 base+2 for 2 chainswords). Logic gets screwed with at least chaos terminators(who have wording similar to scything talons) that provides +1 when armed with pair of lightning claws(so +1 total) and warp talons that get +1A per lightning claw(so 2 total).
|
2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 09:47:25
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sneaky Lictor
|
Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?
|
A Song of Ice and Fire - House Greyjoy.
AoS - Maggotkin of Nurgle, Ossiarch Bonereapers & Seraphon.
Bloodbowl - Lizardmen.
Horus Heresy - World Eaters.
Marvel Crisis Protocol - Avengers, Brotherhood of Mutants & Cabal.Â
Middle Earth Strategy Battle game - Rivendell & The Easterlings.Â
The Ninth Age - Beast Herds & Highborn Elves.Â
Warhammer 40k - Tyranids.Â
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 10:49:16
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Fully-charged Electropriest
UK
|
AaronWilson wrote:Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?
Better than being forced to attack with it like the Trygon is.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 10:58:36
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Regular Dakkanaut
|
Quick question. Looking at the Hive Tyrant, it says it may take wings but I didn't see a power increase for it, nor points. Am I missing something or is it just a completely free upgrade. Also if it's free, why would you not take them?
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 11:12:13
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
The Winged Hive Tyrant has a different point cost (170) in the table at the back.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 11:18:08
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Infiltrating Broodlord
|
Drager wrote:I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.
Very, considering they were overpriced in the past and have had their cost readjusted like the other larger TMCs. It seems weird to have them still be somewhat overpriced and takeaway their 2+
They're literally 1 of the only things in the Index that isn't either good or amazing so I'm not too phased.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 11:46:51
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Regular Dakkanaut
|
Drager wrote:The Winged Hive Tyrant has a different point cost (170) in the table at the back.
Thanks, figured I was missing something.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 11:48:36
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Beautiful and Deadly Keeper of Secrets
|
Zande4 wrote:Drager wrote:I hadn't noticed that, good question. Maybe to just bring it in line with the other monsters? It is a little odd.
Very, considering they were overpriced in the past and have had their cost readjusted like the other larger TMCs. It seems weird to have them still be somewhat overpriced and takeaway their 2+
They're literally 1 of the only things in the Index that isn't either good or amazing so I'm not too phased.
They may have overestimated it's power in the new edition due to the ability to fire at multiple models.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 13:14:47
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
|
I think it's because the Tyrannofex gained some rules, like the Rupture Cannon becoming AP -4 if both shots hit and being able to fire each weapon twice if it remains still.
Still kinda overcosted at 200+ points. I think they may have raised the cost due to the rupture cannon being one of the only Tyranid ranged weapons that has high AP and damage (it's essentially a +1 strength 2 shot lascannon if both shots hit) when nids rarely ever get something like this.
|
Gwar! wrote:Huh, I had no idea Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines posted on Dakka. Hi Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can I have an Autograph!
Kanluwen wrote:
Hell, I'm not that bothered by the Stormraven. Why? Because, as it stands right now, it's "limited use".When it's shoehorned in to the Codex: Space Marines, then yeah. I'll be irked.
When I'm editing alot, you know I have a gakload of homework to (not) do. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 14:26:07
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Sinewy Scourge
|
The thing is for a minimal investment we can take Guard with lascannons via GSC if we want. Kind of makes it superfluous.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 14:32:52
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Fresh-Faced New User
|
AaronWilson wrote:Question - What's the point of giving a Trygon prime a useless tail attack when you're never going to attack with it?
Increasing its cost. You can trade the biostatic rattle for one of the worse versions (toxispine or prensile pincer tail) which are slightly cheaper, but force you to use them at least once.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/07 15:14:56
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
|
Drager wrote:The thing is for a minimal investment we can take Guard with lascannons via GSC if we want. Kind of makes it superfluous.
I think it may be for those really narrow occurances where you must have them all be Tyranids, not with GSC allies. That would be my guess. Still though I'm not that torn up. Even the 5th Edition Dark Eldar codex (widely considered one of the best codexes ever written for it's time) still had it's Mandrakes.
|
Gwar! wrote:Huh, I had no idea Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines posted on Dakka. Hi Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can I have an Autograph!
Kanluwen wrote:
Hell, I'm not that bothered by the Stormraven. Why? Because, as it stands right now, it's "limited use".When it's shoehorned in to the Codex: Space Marines, then yeah. I'll be irked.
When I'm editing alot, you know I have a gakload of homework to (not) do. |
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/08 08:33:33
Subject: Re:Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Oozing Spawning Vat
|
where are you guys finding this stuff isnt the book not out yet?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/08 10:00:49
Subject: Re:Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Longtime Dakkanaut
|
Goob89 wrote:where are you guys finding this stuff isnt the book not out yet?
All the books were leaked a week or so ago. Plus many stores have preview copies now.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/08 10:01:05
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/08 14:34:04
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Dominating Dominatrix
|
Hopefully in the full codex we will get the Lord of War that is not resin model from FW. Maybe the rumours about plastic Dominatrix will come true?
|
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/08 14:36:24
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2017/06/08 14:35:45
Subject: Tyranids in 8th Edition
|
 |
Insect-Infested Nurgle Chaos Lord
|
They will probably announce a Dominatrix Model only to reveal that it's a new SoB unit
Or do the reverse.
|
Gwar! wrote:Huh, I had no idea Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines posted on Dakka. Hi Graham McNeillm Dav Torpe and Pete Haines!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can I have an Autograph!
Kanluwen wrote:
Hell, I'm not that bothered by the Stormraven. Why? Because, as it stands right now, it's "limited use".When it's shoehorned in to the Codex: Space Marines, then yeah. I'll be irked.
When I'm editing alot, you know I have a gakload of homework to (not) do. |
|
 |
 |
|