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Hello everyone,

I am struggling a bit with painting my CSM army right now. You see... I really like the Emperors Children and everything and the colors for them are nice and all.

My problem is, that I really cant afford X armies with different color schemes, so if i want to play black legion or thousand sons some day i cant really use my army in all Pink, can I?
At least that is what I see in tournament rules a lot, that if you dont fit the correct color code there might be VP deductions or something. (or you have to explain why that is etc.)

What is your take on this?
Is there maybe a possibility to come up with my own look (like Space Marine successor chapters) and just go "this is XY" whenever I want?

How would you feel about this, if you would have to fight against an army like that?

I hope I could get my problem across ^^
Thanks for helping me out!

Paint whatever you want and call it whatever army you want. They're your guys, anyone who cares shouldn't.

Event rules vary by event, there is no consistent standard. If you want to play in a specific event you'll need to ask them about their policies.

Outside of tournaments most people are happy to play against a non-standard paint scheme as long as it's a reasonable scheme that could plausibly exist in 40k (no MLP marines, etc) and if you have two different sub-factions in your list they each have a different paint scheme to clearly identify which is which. Very few people will insist that you match the canon scheme, most of us are just happy that you bothered to paint your models at all.

Im a firm believer that nobody should be punished because they chose the wrong color scheme. Paint them as whatever and then run them as whatever. They're all Marines, so you'll be fine.

For others: I don't care what colors my opponents forces are painted.

For myself: I paint my stuff to please me. Sometimes that'll match something GWs done at some point, sometimes it might be close (likely by accident), other times.... not so much. If someone else/GW doesn't like that? {shrugs}

Outside of Historicals & any restrictions on the use of some iconography (Ex: Swastikas) I would not play in an environment where others get to dictate how I paint things.

Solutions? Play with reasonable people. Don't play with those/in events that dictate how you paint.

Whatever makes you happy

The only minor issue might be if all the marines in a given army are the same colour but are from different legions with different rules, not sure if thats a thing anymore with chaos, and even then that's only a concern for organised play (which usually have requirement stated before hand)

Considering that CSM got screwed on not having custom subfactions despite being the one that should absolutely have them, do what you want.
You can't have your own rules to match Your Dudes so you have to use established Legion traits so paint Your Dudes however you see fit.

Well, I only play my EC as EC, but they're like a million different colours(on purpose) a veritable riot if you will.

But who cares, paint whatever whichever however you like and if they don't like it, you wouldn't want to play them anyway...

Like Shock G said..."do whatchya like"

Events at Warhammer World require you to play the army that matches your paint scheme (i.e., if your painted as Ultramarines, you must use the Ultramarines rules). As long as you don't plan on playing there, then it most likely won't be a problem...

Once you leave Space Marines most people can't tell one official subfaction scheme from another at all. Heck some are nearly impossible - all the official schemes for Daugthers of Khaine are just different subtle shades of red cloth.


Most events don't care either as long as you don't rock up with a clearly Blood Angles Space Marine army and call them Ultramarines. Though even some of that was mostly when an edition let you mix and match subfactions so much that people were running multiple subfaction armies under the same paint scheme which could get confusing.


In general no one cares. A few events can be picky, but they tend to be rather elite events and honestly most clubs do not care one bit.




Personally I hate the idea that if you use an official scheme you are bound to that subfaction only, but if you used your own you could pick and choose (keeping in mind your own could be 1 colour change from an official scheme)



Again this only mostly rears its head with Marines because their subfactions have unique models, upgrade parts and are basically fully fledged armies in their own right (With their own internal sub-sub factions).

If I am willing to play against an unpainted army, why would I refuse playing against an army painted in any colour?

Only thing which might be confusing would be if your army included a lot of faction specific units proxying as something else than what their WYSIWYG look is suggesting. That can become confusing real fast.

Being a nitpick about a coloursheme is silly behaviour. Might as well start bitching about someone not painting realistically enough, or using derpily proportioned miniatures or overly skull decorated terrain on the table "ruining muh immersion" LOL

As long as nothing's confusing you'll be fine. A single unified colour scheme isn't going to confuse anyone. Tying army rules to paint was a stupid idea in the first place anyway.

LeRufus wrote:


My problem is, that I really cant afford X armies with different color schemes, so if i want to play black legion or thousand sons some day i cant really use my army in all Pink, can I?

Why the hell not?

Use whatever justification you want - 'oh yeah, the black armour is being washed, they're using their other suits and all that was left was the gaudy pink ones. It makes them even ANGRIER too....'

Or don't justify. Your models. Play them and paint them however the hell you want. And screw the haters. There's enough rubbish in the world without needing to bother yourself with what some nerd thinks of you :p

LeRufus wrote:

At least that is what I see in tournament rules a lot, that if you dont fit the correct color code there might be VP deductions or something. (or you have to explain why that is etc.)

Screw tournaments? Screw those elitists?

Not all red marines are blood angels after all. Successor chapters are a thing.

if someone deployed a csm army, and on then informed me that he is rolling 1ksons powers, I would be mildly confused.

Karol wrote:
if someone deployed a csm army, and on then informed me that he is rolling 1ksons powers, I would be mildly confused.

Well, yes, those are different armies which (mainly) don't share units and where the models being used don't match the datasheet.

We're talking about different subfactions for the same army, where the basic datasheet is the same and the models are the same, but the subfaction / paint scheme gives different bonuses. It's a completely different situation.

That is a fair point for the OP though - 1KSons, Death Guard, and (soon) World Eaters are their own things and not core CSM. You can use CSM models as 1KSons if you want and if your opponent's happy with it, but that does cross the line into proxying IMO.

Karol wrote:
if someone deployed a csm army, and on then informed me that he is rolling 1ksons powers, I would be mildly confused.

Well that's legit as they're two different books. If you wanted to run your Black Legion painted guys as Night Lords, Iron Warriors, or something else from the same book then by all means go for it. I would recommend however that you make it pretty clear beforehand.

Slipspace wrote:
Tying army rules to paint was a stupid idea in the first place anyway.

Yes this was the primary bad move by GW on the topic of painting and it creates a conflict that will never go away: yes they are your models paint them how you want, but no you should not deviate from the army rules tied to the faction of your painting choise. That is where for sm/csm successor chapters comes into play with more colour options.

LeRufus 806621 11421835 wrote:
My problem is, that I really cant afford X armies with different color schemes, so if i want to play black legion or thousand sons some day i cant really use my army in all Pink, can I?
At least that is what I see in tournament rules a lot, that if you dont fit the correct color code there might be VP deductions or something. (or you have to explain why that is etc.)

Considering your forces feel at home in the warp, tell the TO that the warp does strange unexplainable things and they should be lucky it's pink and not some horror-invoking unimaginable color that would leach their soul out through their eyeballs.

Why not just use your Pink Spikey Marines as Pink Spikey Marines if it's Pink Spikey Marines that you like, and not worry about maybe not being able to optimise them as Black Spikey Marines or Blue Spikey Marines?

Slipspace wrote:
As long as nothing's confusing you'll be fine. A single unified colour scheme isn't going to confuse anyone. Tying army rules to paint was a stupid idea in the first place anyway.

I'm reminded of the days when all the wargear options had to be modeled (including favored enemy). Granted, back in those days I played with paper circles lol (now I play with digital paper circles )

The official stance on it by GW changed over time, but not so long ago (hey, only 5th edition) they even wrote it into the Space Marine codex:
"This is Pedro Kantor, he is a Crimson Fists hero. If you don't play CF but still want to use the model, just come up with your own name and use his rules."

This is the only sensible approach imho. Use your colors, use your own background and possibly own model conversion, use the official rules.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Why not just use your Pink Spikey Marines as Pink Spikey Marines if it's Pink Spikey Marines that you like, and not worry about maybe not being able to optimise them as Black Spikey Marines or Blue Spikey Marines?

It may not have anything to do with optimising at all. Am I supposed to believe that Blood Angels (and successors) are the only Marines in the whole galaxy that put their Scriptors into Dreadnoughts? Space Wolves the only chapter who uses beast cavalry?

The only logical conclusion to your approach is to collect the same army several times over because I'd like to play with a chapter specific unit every now and then. It is more clear with units, but the same applies to the different legions with their different Warlord traits, equipment, psychic powers and so on.

Seconding the notion that painted mini's without clear difference could be construed as a possible "modeling for advantage". Just make sure to clearly distinguish "your toys" from each other. Don't make the mistake I made, of trying to kit bash a Company Commander with something else to make a primaris Psyker, and your opponent not being able to spot it at a glance as what it is.

Karol wrote:
if someone deployed a csm army, and on then informed me that he is rolling 1ksons powers, I would be mildly confused.

is it really that confusing?

Legionnaires = rubrics
Terminators = scarab occults
Magic wielding HQ = exalted sorcerer & co.
DP = DP

a_typical_hero wrote:
The official stance on it by GW changed over time, but not so long ago (hey, only 5th edition) they even wrote it into the Space Marine codex:
"This is Pedro Kantor, he is a Crimson Fists hero. If you don't play CF but still want to use the model, just come up with your own name and use his rules."

That last bit doesn't work nowadays. Pedro Kantor's rules define him as a Crimson Fist via Keywords and would be handicapping yourself unnecessarily. You would need to use him as a 'counts as' model for a unit that works with your chosen army.

 Ghaz wrote:

a_typical_hero wrote:
The official stance on it by GW changed over time, but not so long ago (hey, only 5th edition) they even wrote it into the Space Marine codex:
"This is Pedro Kantor, he is a Crimson Fists hero. If you don't play CF but still want to use the model, just come up with your own name and use his rules."

That last bit doesn't work nowadays. Pedro Kantor's rules define him as a Crimson Fist via Keywords and would be handicapping yourself unnecessarily. You would need to use him as a 'counts as' model for a unit that works with your chosen army.

Or just do what what everyone else does and designate your homebrew chapter as Crimson Fists regardless of colour scheme.

 Ghaz wrote:

a_typical_hero wrote:
The official stance on it by GW changed over time, but not so long ago (hey, only 5th edition) they even wrote it into the Space Marine codex:
"This is Pedro Kantor, he is a Crimson Fists hero. If you don't play CF but still want to use the model, just come up with your own name and use his rules."

That last bit doesn't work nowadays. Pedro Kantor's rules define him as a Crimson Fist via Keywords and would be handicapping yourself unnecessarily. You would need to use him as a 'counts as' model for a unit that works with your chosen army.

he's basically just a chapter master with powerfist and mastercrafted combibolter, right?

Back then special characters for SM were the way how you customise your army.

Pedro for example unlocked Sternguard Veterans as troops iirc. So only CF could do it back then. Or you came up with your own character for your chapter and used the rules.

There is nothing preventing you from using your Marines of any color as count as and make use of that chapter's special units and rules. The keyword system does not block it in any way. You only can't 'count as' a character like Mephiston while using the rules for Ultramarines for example. At least not officially.

Just paint your models in a way that you like and that you think is cool. Pick alt. colors if you want to stay somewhat close to a specific faction, legion or chapter. It hardly matters.

I will say that picking a cool theme and colors will feel a lot more universal to me than a variant of a specific color set. But that's just me.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

Karol wrote:
if someone deployed a csm army, and on then informed me that he is rolling 1ksons powers, I would be mildly confused.

is it really that confusing?

Legionnaires = rubrics
Terminators = scarab occults
Magic wielding HQ = exalted sorcerer & co.
DP = DP

If they are pink, and I saw the person play the game before as csm ? Yes, I think I would be mildly confused.

I have a kustom paint scheme for my Orkz which heavily involves purple. If at anytime someone says I can't run them as a specific klan because their color scheme isn't exact i'll politely tell them to go fondle a grot