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Don't use Primaris Marines, and don't use too much Mk7/8.

If Mk7 is being used, mix it up with other patterns to make it non-production Mk5. Back in't day, we didn't have fancy plastic kits for the Heresy patterns and made do with what we had which was Mk7 with shaved chest aquilas, Death Company Mk3+4 heads, Armour Through The Ages and the odd Mk6. If you were more flush with cash, you might have some of the proper FW models.
For example, a chunk of my Iron Warriors and Iron Hands use Mk7 bodies but I've mixed in Mk3/4/5/6 heads, shoulder pads, arms, and backpacks.
Hell, some even have OG 3rd Edition Marine backpacks and 2nd Edition Bolters.
I have a Flamer and Missile squad each of the 3rd Ed Marines, because they have the Heresy weaponry and are relentlessly adorable models (they are so short it makes one of my group twitch a bit).

What people don't get is that it isn't about rivet counting (for some people it may be but I've yet to meet one IRL), it's about matching the vibe. I have more respect for someone who has a lot of conversions or customs in their army and a "that'll do pig" paint scheme than I do for someone with a perfect paint scheme but stock models.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
As a side note, how important is the armour marks for the Legions in Horus Heresy?

Do players care that your force is using the right version of armour?

The impression that I get is that Marks are less important, since all the Legions were pressing all sorts of armor into service due to stupidly-high attrition. Some Legions may show preference for certain styles, but I think you can get away with pretty much anything on that front.

It's very strange when someone complains about colour scheme if it not historical miniature or things lice HH where colours represent legion. Or if it offensive by itself like nazy for example. I seen two guys playing big game like 4k points of ultramarines each, with GW "recommend" colours. Iirc in turn 3 they start miss if it their or opponents miniatures. It's modelling and painting hobby in grim dark power fantasy. It's ok to follow some guidance from gw. But complaining some one not follow them is stupid. It's Not scale modeling where you trying reproduce a copy.

I mean if you're painting your Space Marines with Nazi iconography it tells me all I need to know about you as a person.

Allowing that sort of casual acceptance of Nazism is why Warhammer has its bad social rep. Combating it at every turn is important.

I always wondered if FLGS or Warhammer shops police offensive paint schemes.

I can't imagine someone showing up to a shop with a nazi 40k army and thinking that it's okay to play.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
I always wondered if FLGS or Warhammer shops police offensive paint schemes.

I can't imagine someone showing up to a shop with a nazi 40k army and thinking that it's okay to play.

It would depend on the individual stores. I don't think GW have any explicit written policies about it but the store manager's word is law, and I doubt they'd want to deal with the reputational damage. Hell, I've been to GWs where they didn't want you playing with the Juan Diaz daemonettes because boobies

FLGS though? Depends on the owner.

As far as other weird colour schemes go, Salamanders canonically have a yellow and black striped camo scheme. You can justify pretty much anything

When I was a youngling I hated any sort of homebrew Space Marine theme. As i got older I realized I thought that way because the small circle of similar aged kids I was around that made up homebrew chapters always had lore to the effect of "these space marines are, like, totally the best space marines ever. they never lose a battle and better/stronger/faster/bigger even than other space marines and no, you cant win when we play because that wouldn't happen because they never lose."

As I got older and got away from the thought process that homebrew always = childish nonsense I really came to appreciate it. As I got better at painting and learned how hard it is to paint *really well* I gained a lot of appreciation for painted armies painted to almost any standard.

I guess now i still have a bias, but my new bias is - if you have a problem with homebrew paint schemes, thats a "brand" of rules lawyering and is just kind of silly.

Marvel Multiversal Crossovers?

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Marvel Multiversal Crossovers?

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Marvel Multiversal Crossovers?

When you mention that Callidus, it got me thinking about the reverse of that, something that was not intended to be a reference, but something comes out later that makes it seem like one.

For example, my Callidus Assasin is painted up with purple hair, and looks very similar to Rumi from the recently released K-POP Demon Hunters in her black leather hunter outfit. I painted that model years ago, but now that's all I can see when I look at my Callidus.

My Eyes!

This is what I was talking about when I mentioned eye searing models...

Rumor has it that Robin Williams used to own an Ork army that was flower themed. I've never seen it but that's what I heard.

 vipoid wrote:


Is this a common thing outside of WW2 settings?

i saw a nazi space marine army on this website's (dakkadakka) photo gallery thing years ago along with made up fluff for why they were nazis, maybe during 6th or 7th. besides the fact he ruined his models with offensive symbols, what i couldnt believe were the comments complimenting him on a job well done

edit: paint doesnt really matter to me unless its real world like america marines, breaks immersion. i would play a HH camo army, not a pink one though, id just say im too tired for a game. play for narrative, not for gw's gameplay - better games out there to spend my time on. doesnt matter though i only play with friends

all long as not mk vii or primaris, any period armor mark is fine by me for HH

IMMORTAN_AL wrote:

 vipoid wrote:


Is this a common thing outside of WW2 settings?

i saw a nazi space marine army on this website's (dakkadakka) photo gallery thing years ago along with made up fluff for why they were nazis, maybe during 6th or 7th. besides the fact he ruined his models with offensive symbols, what i couldnt believe were the comments complimenting him on a job well done

Not to excuse it, but I think there's a generation where the idea of Nazis was taken less seriously by many because they mostly showed up as cartoon villains in media, such as Raiders of the Lost Ark. They were, to many, just a thing of the past with little connection to modern society, and more easily dismissable.

Times have changed.

 Gert wrote:
I mean if you're painting your Space Marines with Nazi iconography it tells me all I need to know about you as a person.

Allowing that sort of casual acceptance of Nazism is why Warhammer has its bad social rep. Combating it at every turn is important.

I have been in this hobby since 1992 and have never seen an actual model with Nazi symbology. I have seen a few Space Wolves with some Black Sun-esque designs on some of the armor, and one guy with some pointy blue kinda SS-ish lightning bolts (so it was really just paired lightning bolts), but in 33 years, that is it.

I don't know where this pro-Nazi meme stuff comes from... I guess from the interwebz?

-STS

slade the sniper wrote:

 Gert wrote:
I mean if you're painting your Space Marines with Nazi iconography it tells me all I need to know about you as a person.

Allowing that sort of casual acceptance of Nazism is why Warhammer has its bad social rep. Combating it at every turn is important.

I have been in this hobby since 1992 and have never seen an actual model with Nazi symbology. I have seen a few Space Wolves with some Black Sun-esque designs on some of the armor, and one guy with some pointy blue kinda SS-ish lightning bolts (so it was really just paired lightning bolts), but in 33 years, that is it.

I don't know where this pro-Nazi meme stuff comes from... I guess from the interwebz?

-STS

I've seen an Iron Skies(a crappy B movie) themed Guard army.
So yeah, Guard with Swastikas, German WWII esque tanks, and several 3d printed flying saucers straight from the movie.

The most I've seen is a Chaos army from way back in the day using some Panzer IVs as Predators. No symbols or anything, just a cool looking tank.

I remember a bunch of people unsure if we should buy Steel Legion since they had a very "German" look.

The closest I've ever had to an army based on any real unit from our world was that I painted my armoured company up like U.N. Peacekeepers: White tanks, khaki fatigues and lightblue helmets/armour for the troops.

slade the sniper wrote:
I don't know where this pro-Nazi meme stuff comes from... I guess from the interwebz?

-STS

From the guy who showed up at a tournament in Spain (I think) a couple of years ago with Nazi Orks, and a small handful of other would-be edgelords who have done it.

 BorderCountess wrote:

slade the sniper wrote:
I don't know where this pro-Nazi meme stuff comes from... I guess from the interwebz?

-STS

From the guy who showed up at a tournament in Spain (I think) a couple of years ago with Nazi Orks, and a small handful of other would-be edgelords who have done it.

Nazi Orks? Doesn't seem like the first choice for a fascist theme...

Hopefully the TOs sent him packing.

When I started this thread, I had no idea that the edge-lords had created nazi paintjobs on 40k models and tried bringing them to stores and tournaments.

My faith in humanity has taken another unpleasant kick to the crotch.

 Insectum7 wrote:

Not to excuse it, but I think there's a generation where the idea of Nazis was taken less seriously by many because they mostly showed up as cartoon villains in media, such as Raiders of the Lost Ark. They were, to many, just a thing of the past with little connection to modern society, and more easily dismissable.

Times have changed.

the Views on "Nazis" are and were not the same all across the world. Like with all things. For example GW , I think, finds communists goblin revolutionary army funny. And it is their right, as they are set in a specific culture in a specific time and space. But not everyone finds soviet/communists as fun. And it is so across all the world. There is a historical game played on a scale similar to imperials, but historical. I never go in to it, besides watching it being played, but it is rather popular at my dorm. See one day, one of the guys from my floor almost came to blows with another one, after a 10min lecture on how Turkish culture, esthethics,etc is the best. What we didn't know at the time that the guy who got a "bit" upset was a Kurd from Iraq, whose half family got executed in 2015, so for him "turkish" and "good" wasn't an acceptable combo.

In the end like with all things taste and culture based. It depends. As long as the army is clear in what is what, and which unit is which, a lot of people won't care how or even if stuff is painted. Just don't bring stuff covered with Truzubz or Hammer&Sickles, if you want to play me. Real world stuff is also why I avoid real world games.

 BorderCountess wrote:

slade the sniper wrote:
I don't know where this pro-Nazi meme stuff comes from... I guess from the interwebz?

-STS

From the guy who showed up at a tournament in Spain (I think) a couple of years ago with Nazi Orks, and a small handful of other would-be edgelords who have done it.

There was a guy at the recent Gamescon tournament that got kicked out for having a Nazi Krieg army. I didn't see him or the army personally, but I was at the event and everyone was talking about it at the end of day one.

With the important caveat that I'm almost certainly not refsuing a game because of a paint scheme, I do have a pretty strong opinion on this.

Generally, I think that any paint scheme that is meant to be a person's view of their army within the 40k/30k universe is fine. It's a big creative sandbox with plenty of blank space. I don't care how garish or weird or even controversial your stuff is, if it doesn't break immersion, I'm into it. Classic example: https://fightingtigersofveda.com/ Some eye watering paint schemes, dodgy female conversions, and and buckets of lore, but it's clearly something that could exist in 40k.

What I don't like is directly looking like something from out of the universe. This can be historical or from another property, but either way I'm out. I don't mean influenced by an outside property, so like the deadpool painted callidus is still clealry a callidus in a specific color scheme. But when you start to look more like the outside thing, I don't enjoy it.

This is really tough with historical, because so many design choices in 40k are based on real world history,. Krieg's adrian helmets are a classic example, but so are the Death Gaurd Puckelhelms, tthe Mongol aspects of White Scars or Attilans, the templar aspects of templars, or the heraldry of Knights. There are also pop culture easter eggs in the game (sly marbo most famously,) but still, all of these have been reconstituted and remade into the universe.

Synthwave Necrons or Pastel Tau are still necrons or tau, while MLP marines to are poneys and that's not what I'm into.

Karol wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

Not to excuse it, but I think there's a generation where the idea of Nazis was taken less seriously by many because they mostly showed up as cartoon villains in media, such as Raiders of the Lost Ark. They were, to many, just a thing of the past with little connection to modern society, and more easily dismissable.

Times have changed.

the Views on "Nazis" are and were not the same all across the world. Like with all things. For example GW , I think, finds communists goblin revolutionary army funny. And it is their right, as they are set in a specific culture in a specific time and space. But not everyone finds soviet/communists as fun. And it is so across all the world. There is a historical game played on a scale similar to imperials, but historical. I never go in to it, besides watching it being played, but it is rather popular at my dorm. See one day, one of the guys from my floor almost came to blows with another one, after a 10min lecture on how Turkish culture, esthethics,etc is the best. What we didn't know at the time that the guy who got a "bit" upset was a Kurd from Iraq, whose half family got executed in 2015, so for him "turkish" and "good" wasn't an acceptable combo.

In the end like with all things taste and culture based. It depends. As long as the army is clear in what is what, and which unit is which, a lot of people won't care how or even if stuff is painted. Just don't bring stuff covered with Truzubz or Hammer&Sickles, if you want to play me. Real world stuff is also why I avoid real world games.

^Spot on post. Yes, different subjects take on different "weights" depending on locale and context. Growing up my media landscape had them typically as silly villains or the butt of Monty Python jokes.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:

Nazi Orks? Doesn't seem like the first choice for a fascist theme...

Hah! Have you seen the original Stormboyz models?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/eyx463/2nd_edition_stormboyz_are_umm_interesting/

Their 2nd ed fluff, btw, is that during Ork adolescence they become less wild and crazy like normal orks, and instead become "smart and well disciplined". The other Orks find all their "parading and boot polishing" silly. I think there's something about how they're inclined to copy the humans they see too. As in, the Stormboyz look like nazis because the humans they see are like nazis. . . a.k.a the Imperium.

In that thread btw, someone links to a chart of Ork glyphs, and the one for "Orky/good" looks a lot like a blocky swastika. I just checked my 2nd ed book and that's not the glyph in there, although what is in there could be seen as a more abstracted version. It's sort of a pinwheel framed in a larger square. I'm curious as to what's in the earlier publications such as 'Ere We Go.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
I've seen some posts online where nontraditional paint schemes haven't been well received in HH, but I've yet to see that in "real life."

Honestly I've never really seen that in any wargame anywhere online.
Does it happen - sure - but its something you'd likely have to go looking for to find. By and large wargamers are INSANELY self supporting and positive about other people painting their models.



Now sure if you go "Here's my Loyalist Ultramarines in official scheme how did I do" and they are bright pink with green highlights- yeah - that's going to get people calling them out as getting it wrong. Because the OP outlined them as being a force with an officially designed and designated scheme and then went way off the rocks.
But if that same army were "Here's my Loyalist Space Marine Army" 100% fine.


So yeah it happens; its bonkers rare and by and large wargamers are insanely supportive.





the ONLY time this kind of broke a bit was when GW were all in on having allied detachments and people were fielding single scheme armies with multiple sub-army detachments at the same time. So you'd have a whole army of blue Ultramarines with the same scheme, but one group would be White Scars because they have a bonus to something those units do really well. So that did happen for a bit and GW tried to make it so that "your paint scheme defines your rules"; but that was basically one edition of the game and people did it kind of for a clear communication aspect, but it was never really popular as a policy.
Thankfully that is long gone now.

 Overread wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
I've seen some posts online where nontraditional paint schemes haven't been well received in HH, but I've yet to see that in "real life."

Honestly I've never really seen that in any wargame anywhere online.
Does it happen - sure - but its something you'd likely have to go looking for to find. By and large wargamers are INSANELY self supporting and positive about other people painting their models.

It would take a very interesting person to tell somebody in person that their paint scheme sucks. People feel much more comfortable being negative online.

I remember one situation where a person was showing off their custom army that had just terrible ideas. It was bright blue and lime green, with ham fisted converstions using out of scale parts. The thread got pretty toxic (although plenty of people were supportive in a way), and the OP got upset, and even posted that everybody at his store complimented it. One guy finally asked the OP if he got actual compliments, or if people said things that sounds positive but aren't speciifc, like "what a creative army" or "wow, those colors are vivid!" or even "I wouldn't have though to combined those!" The poor guy had taken all of the vague back slapping he got from people as actual gas that what he made was great.

i'm not saying we should be meaner, just that it's a lot harder to tell a person their work sucks to their face than it is to bash something online.

in 40k, yes, in HH no. I mean... HH is more of a "historical" game than 40k is, alternative color scheems feel wrong

Man, that's super interesting because that's the total opposite of what our local was like.

Compliments abound but we all called it like we saw it. Helpful and nicer to new people but God forbid you became a permanent fixture in the group because you would be flayed alive.
It was very much a case of "you dish it, you take it" so nobody ever got bent out of shape. It helped there were only about 2 actually good painters in the group but they couldn't play to save their lives so they still got their licks.

Then again, it is Scotland so normal rules don't apply.

BanjoJohn wrote:
in 40k, yes, in HH no. I mean... HH is more of a "historical" game than 40k is, alternative color scheems feel wrong

I think it depends how alternative. Painting Iron Warriors in pink, yellow, and purple synthwave would be jarring, but painting them in a rust color with black trim because they failed on a mission and are fighting to regain their heraldry would be pretty cool.

 Insectum7 wrote:

Karol wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

Not to excuse it, but I think there's a generation where the idea of Nazis was taken less seriously by many because they mostly showed up as cartoon villains in media, such as Raiders of the Lost Ark. They were, to many, just a thing of the past with little connection to modern society, and more easily dismissable.

Times have changed.

the Views on "Nazis" are and were not the same all across the world. Like with all things. For example GW , I think, finds communists goblin revolutionary army funny. And it is their right, as they are set in a specific culture in a specific time and space. But not everyone finds soviet/communists as fun. And it is so across all the world. There is a historical game played on a scale similar to imperials, but historical. I never go in to it, besides watching it being played, but it is rather popular at my dorm. See one day, one of the guys from my floor almost came to blows with another one, after a 10min lecture on how Turkish culture, esthethics,etc is the best. What we didn't know at the time that the guy who got a "bit" upset was a Kurd from Iraq, whose half family got executed in 2015, so for him "turkish" and "good" wasn't an acceptable combo.

In the end like with all things taste and culture based. It depends. As long as the army is clear in what is what, and which unit is which, a lot of people won't care how or even if stuff is painted. Just don't bring stuff covered with Truzubz or Hammer&Sickles, if you want to play me. Real world stuff is also why I avoid real world games.

^Spot on post. Yes, different subjects take on different "weights" depending on locale and context. Growing up my media landscape had them typically as silly villains or the butt of Monty Python jokes.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:

Nazi Orks? Doesn't seem like the first choice for a fascist theme...

Hah! Have you seen the original Stormboyz models?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/eyx463/2nd_edition_stormboyz_are_umm_interesting/

Their 2nd ed fluff, btw, is that during Ork adolescence they become less wild and crazy like normal orks, and instead become "smart and well disciplined". The other Orks find all their "parading and boot polishing" silly. I think there's something about how they're inclined to copy the humans they see too. As in, the Stormboyz look like nazis because the humans they see are like nazis. . . a.k.a the Imperium.

In that thread btw, someone links to a chart of Ork glyphs, and the one for "Orky/good" looks a lot like a blocky swastika. I just checked my 2nd ed book and that's not the glyph in there, although what is in there could be seen as a more abstracted version. It's sort of a pinwheel framed in a larger square. I'm curious as to what's in the earlier publications such as 'Ere We Go.

From waargh ORKS.

Famously used on ghaz’s banner, very stylised but clearly it is what it is. Especially when shown on the sleeve on the banner.