Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

After reading about Ultramarines only deploying to battle with a few dudes, I checked out the film Ultramarines: A Warhammer 40,000 Movie to learn more about Ultramarines.

Ultramarines 2nd Company Captain Severus (who becomes a Knorne Daemon) only heads out to visit a world where an entire company of Imperial Fists bought the proverbial farm, with 13 guys and what appears to be an empty Battle Barge.

So, it's apparently standard operating procedure for Ultramarines to send a Captain and a Squad to investigate highly dangerous situations.

The more I think about it... the Codex is just old episodes of Star Trek.

Step 1. Send the Captain and some support staff to investigate first.

☆

A couple questions though.

1. Why does the the Chaplain's Crozius Arcanum shoot lasers?

2. Why is 2nd Company Captain Severus not mentioned elsewhere?

3. Do battle standards typically glow when daemons are around, or is that just an Ultramarines thing?

4. When someone asks if they have ever made a Warhammer 40k movie, should I lie and say, "Nope" ?

Good observations. However, the Ultramarines movie isn't some polished piece of cerebral handling of 40k background. Eisenhorn or Shira Calpurnia it is not.

But more importantly, it commits the cardinal sin of being boring and empty. What the hell?

A Warhammer 40'000 movie should not be boring. It could deal with Inquisitorial investigations or administrative rigmarole or Rogue Trader dynasty intrigues or whatever, but let's lower our expectations to dumb and fun action alone.

A 40k movie is fine if it's shallow and filled with speedy action and dumb fun. But this is a dumb movie that is empty and boring. Yawn.

Also it's probably not worth picking up background clues from it, but I like your sharp eye here.

1. Crozius Arcana do not shoot lasers, that's artistic license but let's assume this particular Crozius Arcanum is specially crafted by some artificer to do that. It's not beyond the realm of the reasonable.

2. As to Captain Severus of the 2nd Company, assume that he is a predecessor to Captain Cato Sicarius, in effect this must have happened a while back. Captain Severus is not mentioned elsewhere since he was invented for the Ultramarines movie, and apparently no writer thought it worthwhile to develop further with future references as far as I know. Most of 40k history is essentially empty of details between the Horus Heresy/the Scouring and late M41, and there exist no list of captains through the ages.

3. Battle standards do not typically glow when Daemons are around, but let's assume that this particular battle standard has some unusual blessed history that makes it glow in Daemonic vicinity. That kind of thing has plenty of precedent sprinkled throughout the background, even if there is no special connection to Ultramarines in this regard. Blood Angels would have been more of the usual suspects for their vendetta with Daemons.

4. Never lie. It's a 40k movie. Just don't recommend it if you found it to be bland. It's a surprisingly boring 40k movie, and shallow at that. Ultramarines the movie fails to meet low expectations indeed, and that's all there is to it. It could easily have been halfway decent with lots of more action. Hell, even C.S. Goto could have whipped up a more exciting draft, even while playing fast and loose with the background. Cutting down the runtime and concentrating on the action would have salvaged the movie without demanding more resources.

And as to small troop deployments of Astartes, assume these to be the results of game format or movie budget restrictions rather than reflecting how things usually work. Still, small kill teams do get deployed like that and a single Space Marine is effectively a walking tank, so let's not brush it all off. The Star Trek comparison is apt. Sure it could happen, especially under the pressure of limited resources and recent casaulties. Deploy what little is available, gun hard for the objective, and trust in the Emperor.

Cheers

It's a surprisingly boring 40k movie, and shallow at that. Ultramarines the movie fails to meet low expectations indeed, and that's all there is to it. It could easily have been halfway decent with lots of more action.

I haven't watched it in years, but I remember thinking at the time that the movie seemed like it might be suffering from a painfully low polygon count.

Like, the models didn't look amazing, but they were okay for what the movie was in the context it was made. But you'll notice that there are tons of moments where it seems like someone went out of their way to limit the number of characters you see on screen at a time.

Chaos marines charge out of the fog in ones and twos. The smurfs split up so that there are fewer of them in one place at a given time. Most of the battles are duels that only involve 2 or 3 characters at a time, etc.

So with all that in mind, I kind of got the impression that maybe they realized somewhere along the way that whatever software or hardware they were using had a serious bottleneck in terms of what they could actually put on screen so they ended up building the rest of the story/shots around those limitations.

The only good thing about it was John Hurt voicing the Imperial Fists Chaplain.

 Wyldhunt wrote:

It's a surprisingly boring 40k movie, and shallow at that. Ultramarines the movie fails to meet low expectations indeed, and that's all there is to it. It could easily have been halfway decent with lots of more action.

I haven't watched it in years, but I remember thinking at the time that the movie seemed like it might be suffering from a painfully low polygon count.

Like, the models didn't look amazing, but they were okay for what the movie was in the context it was made. But you'll notice that there are tons of moments where it seems like someone went out of their way to limit the number of characters you see on screen at a time.

Chaos marines charge out of the fog in ones and twos. The smurfs split up so that there are fewer of them in one place at a given time. Most of the battles are duels that only involve 2 or 3 characters at a time, etc.

So with all that in mind, I kind of got the impression that maybe they realized somewhere along the way that whatever software or hardware they were using had a serious bottleneck in terms of what they could actually put on screen so they ended up building the rest of the story/shots around those limitations.

Agreed. While the movie had many flaws, at least some of them could be laid at the feet of the technology they were using.

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
So, it's apparently standard operating procedure for Ultramarines to send a Captain and a Squad to investigate highly dangerous situations.

Not really. In the attached comic strip, Captain Severus is leading the 2nd Company against a Tyranid invasion on the planet Algol (they allude to this in the movie). The war is going slowly, and then Severus recieves a vox message from the Imperial Fists asking for aid on Mithron. He knows he can't withdraw his whole company, but needs to honour his oaths to help the Imperial Fists. What does he choose? He leaves the mission on Algol to his second-in-command, takes his bestest buddy Apothecary with him, and ad-hoc promotes a squad of Scouts (aka, MOST of the Ultramarines in the movie) to be led by the Sergeant (also newly promoted, previously just a regular Battle Brother in the 2nd Company) to go investigate.

Basically, he's leading the mission to act as diplomat/to show that the Ultramarines are serious about honouring this oath, but only taking least experienced Marines so that the main mission isn't being too hamstrung. Remember, all they know is that the Imperial Fists called for help. They don't know what from, or what the status of the Imperial Fists are when they arrive. They don't know it's a "highly dangerous" situation, outside of knowing that *anything* could be a dangerous situation. In any case, Severus takes enough Space Marines to say "yes, we're honouring our oath", while also not screwing over his allies at the previous warzone.

Out of universe, it's not exactly the most "canon accurate" movie, and shouldn't be taken seriously, outside of just being mindless fun, with some very cool scenery and sound design. And John Hurt and Terence Stamp.

The more I think about it... the Codex is just old episodes of Star Trek.

[i]1. Why does the the Chaplain's Crozius Arcanum shoot lasers?

It doesn't really shoot lasers. It has the time dilation effect, which stuns the Black Legion in time for the rest of the squad to gun them down. This isn't based in any other depiction of a Crozius, but would totally work for a Librarian. For this, it could be fluffed as a unique Crozius only carried by Karnak. Or, it's just a movie thing.

2. Why is 2nd Company Captain Severus not mentioned elsewhere?

Because they invented him just for the film. He can't even be a predecessor to Titus/Sicarius/Acheran, because GW recently backfilled the lore of the 2nd Company up to and after the 1st Tyrannic War. The Ultramarines movie takes place at least during the 2nd or 3rd Tyrannic War, because the company is fighting either Hive Fleet Kraken or Leviathan (I don't remember which). In any case, there isn't really a world that GW presents where Severus could have existed, so he likely doesn't.

3. Do battle standards typically glow when daemons are around, or is that just an Ultramarines thing?

Likely just a movie thing, but the idea of sacred relics reacting to daemonic presences is probably canon somewhere in 40k. It's a cool idea regardless.

4. When someone asks if they have ever made a Warhammer 40k movie, should I lie and say, "Nope" ?

Nope, the movie exists, and we don't need to pretend it doesn't. It's not really "canon", but as long as you're going into watching it for the vibes, and not as some kind of concrete lore addition, then it's fine. Consider it as a bit of cheesy fun to poke fun at, in the same way cowboy films aren't really reflective of the actual American West.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gert wrote:
The only good thing about it was John Hurt voicing the Imperial Fists Chaplain.

Terence Stamp slander will not be tolerated.

Plus, the choral chanting and sound design (and architecture!) are really nice. The biggest issues are it's place within wider 40k, the iffy character models (when stood still, they look great, when moving, not so much), the story, and the way that the Black Legion are thrown aside as expendable mooks.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:


... and the way that the Black Legion are thrown aside as expendable mooks.

I thought this was the most accurate part of the whole movie.

Indeed. There seems to be many Imperium stories where Chaos Space Marines are treated as relatively easy to kill.

And yeah, Ultramarines movie was bland, the story, the landscape, the characters, all just "meh". It felt like 70 minutes of videogame cutscenes.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Terence Stamp slander will not be tolerated.

Forgot he was in it.

 Gert wrote:

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Terence Stamp slander will not be tolerated.

Forgot he was in it.

The guy who played Stick, the blind master in Elektra (2005)?