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Master of Sanctity

-Crozius Arcanum, Rosarius, Jump Pack

Death Company

 

5 Terminators

-2 Assault Cannons

 

5 Terminators

-2 Assault Cannons

 

5 Terminators

-2 Assault Cannons

 

8 Scouts

-Bolt Pistol, CC

Veteran Sergeant

 

5 Scouts

-Bolters, Heavy Bolter

Veteran Sergeant

 

5 Marines

-Lascannon

Veteran Sergeant

 

5 Marines

-Lascannon

Veteran Sergeant

 

5 Marines

-Missile Launcher

Veteran Sergeant

 

8 Assault Marines

-Bolt Pistol, CC

Veteran Sergeant

-Power Fist

 

Landspeeder Tornado

-Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter

 

Landspeeder Tornado

-Assault Cannon, Heavy Bolter

 

That's 8 assault cannons, 2 lascannons, 1 missile launcher, 3 heavy bolters, 17 power fists, 8 power weapons, 12 storm bolters, 16 bolters, and 16 + however many death company bolt pistols......

A quick question. Terminator Sergeants have terminator honors... thus why they're in terminator armor, have access to the armory, and the plus one attack... do they count as veteran sergeants for death company?

List looks great for a generic marine army but probalby not for BA. When half a squad of terms joins the death co. you'll know what I mean. Looks competetive otherwise.

yeah, while I realise losing a couple of termies to death company could hurt, it won't hurt too badly, as the terminator squads are there purely for their assault cannons

C'mon, dude. Min/max much?

8 assault cannons, 17 power fists? Did you make the land speeders separate squadrons, too?

I hope this list is fun for you to play, because an opponent is pretty much going to want to slash your tires right after picking up all his minis on turn 3.

I'm not trying to be a dork, and I realize this isn't a list for a friendly game, but this list makes the game less fun to play. Why would you want that?

Welcome to the Army Lists forum, Noblesavage.

Expect that any list posted here will be subject to criticism based on its effectiveness rather than its ability to win friends.

Dakkaites need no friends...only victory!

The fun is in learning to beat a list like this. Welcome to Dakka.

That's the perfect definition of "win at all costs", which most people grow out of after hitting puberty.





What's fun about coming up with a list with NINE assault cannons and EIGHTEEN powerfists so you can out cheeze a cheesy list?

I have to tell you, I don't normally try to critique lists, because honestly I'm not that good at it. I have friends who can see where a missle launcher should replace a lascannon because it's 33 and a 1/3 more likely to do so and so... but I really can't. So when I saw the above list, which so clearly build to game the rules, cookie cutter squads, min-maxing, you name it, and closes with a count of "how many power fists and assault cannons I was able to squeeze in here," it screamed beardy. Even to me.

So, "welcome to Dakka," huh?

I guess we play different games. I prefer mine.

You do notice that most of those powerfist are in his terminator squads that he's going to want shooting not assaulting.

There was a thread about terminator sgts going to death company, and the general concensus was that they do get a fist/powerweapon when they go to the DC.

 

I recently played a tournament with WolfWing....had 6 assault cannons...got like 4 rending in total in 3 games. Now granted, I drop podded them so there were fewer rounds of shooting....but I wasn't impressed by any of the assault cannon shots flying around the tables.

My Green Angels would stomp this list. Too much reliance on expensive terminator units which die easily to lascannons. Short range on assault cannons and storm bolters, and land speeders have swiss cheese for armor. Even only glancing them I have a 2/3rds chance of killing them. The only units I fear are the lascannon and missile launcher marines, only because they have the range to shoot me up.

I have similarly failed to be impressed by assault cannons; if you've got loaded dice, maybe they're as effective as billed, but in my experience, not so much.

They're inconsistent. So you get lopsided results very regularly, where some games they are on and some games they are off.

However, that pretty much describes the game of 40k in its entirety. Lascannons will miss when you need them some games and hit when it's superfluous other games.

Eh, my dice aren't loaded, I'm just lucky... I tend to roll what I need to roll... wether it's double ones for that " insane courage" ( which I've done 4 times in three games), or 3 out of four sixes for rending..... the assault cannon is by far the best weapon in the game.... and I'd say the list is rather fair.... I do realise that I only have 5 out of 6 troop choices.... and as for there only being 5 marines in a squad... well that's just common sense.... why waste more bolters when you can only fire the lascannon at a tank.... until they come up with rules for splitting fire that pertains to people other than space wolves... it's five man squads for me. And besides.... I've already got friends..... and I'm not looking to make more during a tournament.... friendly games and competition are completely different

Posted By Angron on 10/25/2006 6:51 PM
I do realise that I only have 5 out of 6 troop choices.... and as for there only being 5 marines in a squad... well that's just common sense.... why waste more bolters when you can only fire the lascannon at a tank

 

A reason for having a 6 man squad is victory points and objectives.  In a 5 man squad if 3 guy die then you are below half.  In a 6 man squad you are still at half, meaning you have not given your opponent any victory points and they need to work harder/waste more shoots to take the unit below scoring.

I understand with DA it will be a bit different because often marines are pulled.  But 6 man squads instead of 5, I think, are a more effective use of points.

Stormboy posted one of my comments, but I'll say it again.

Yea, you can only fire the lascannon at a tank, but you're missing the point about large squads. They take and hold table quarters. Min/max squads fall apart quickly when getting shot at. The inability to take and hold objectsives is going to hit you hard. Speaking of firing, min/maxed units are terrible when it comes to fire supperiority- low unit count means your heavy weapon is going to get picked out fairly quickly.

So will any fast moving army. Min/maxed units are worthless in HTH. You have no transports for them, so the enemy is going to have plenty of opportunity to get into HTH on their terms.

BA are not the best at long ranged shooting due to our raging. If you want long ranged fire power, go with vehicles Razorbacks to go with the smaller support squads, etc. Speeders play to our (I play BA too) strengths. It's hard to build a shooty army that won't stay still. Our strengths are in our close ranged fire fights (bringing a large number of S4 AP5 weapons to bear in one unit), and our HTH.

Fire support units are good in their roll, but they don't do well when comprising an entire army.

Everything besides the lascannon squads are short ranged/ close combat units..... which can move/ rage, and shoot...... and instead of str 4 bolters... I prefer str 6 assault cannons, as for taking table quarters/ objectives..... it's easy to claim a table quarter when your enemy is wiped off the table.... and if not, that's what speeders are for

Err... would the cc squads be the ones with the heavy bolters or the missile launchers? All your tac squads other than the scouts were the ones I was talking about.

Two speeders does not an army make. With no other armor fielded, those two speeders will draw the wrath of all the enemie's anti-tank support. Speeders are powerful at short range but fragile.

IF you want your terminators up close and personal, why not give your Vet Sgt scout a teleport homer? Infiltrate + homer + assault cannons = good times!

The Terminators, assault squad, and HUGE death company would be the CC units.... I think it's because you don't know my style of play that you're confused..... I sit back, shoot the enemy until he comes to me, then he smashes into a wall of terminators and then gets counter punched by the assault squads. The terminators shouldn't be in CC or any of my army should until they absolutly need to.

Ahhh... that's good to know.

Ok, how does this army deal with gameplay that forces you to move forward? Such as Recon, or capture objectives that could be further away from you?

Agree with Moopy and as much as the whole "if I kill everything I won't have to claim table quarters" sounds good it is rarely practical. Angron, you have been posting for a long time and seem very skilled I am surprised by the 5 man squads

Good for you. I try not to judge people by what army they put on the table. I find it to be bad sportmanship.

If you would look at this list objectively you would realize its weaker than it appears on paper. The Blood Angels have a randomness to them that this list doesn't plan for. Assault Cannons are over-rated. And Powerfists are only good if they are still alive. And he has to expose them to danger to use the ACs. Most of these units will be down at least 1 or more guys to start with. Making it easier to drop them below scoring.

Posted By Crimson Devil on 10/27/2006 2:20 PM

If you would look at this list objectively you would realize its weaker than it appears on paper. The Blood Angels have a randomness to them that this list doesn't plan for. Assault Cannons are over-rated. And Powerfists are only good if they are still alive. And he has to expose them to danger to use the ACs. Most of these units will be down at least 1 or more guys to start with. Making it easier to drop them below scoring.

Thank you for saying that, I was trying to do it without sounding rude or condisending, which isn't constructive.  And yea, having your strategy simply be, "kill everyone else and walk in" is too vauge and rarely works; if it were only that easy!

Saying an army has X this and Y that is only part of the picture.  It's how they work together how the units support each other.

well put