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Does the farseer roll 4d6 and take the 3 lowest? Do they roll 3d6, with any total over 12 being perils of the warp and then take the 2 lowest to see if the power works? Or perhaps they do something else entirely.

I think a better question is: What do you do when a Farseer has Runes of Witnessing and a Tyranid player has Shadow in the warp....

Capt K

The rules are contradictory. Both ask you to roll 3d6, but require you to sum different, incompatable sets of dice to determine the results of the psychic test.

There's no way to resolve it by the rules as written. I expect most players will just decide that the runes cancel each other.

But it may not happen very often. Since runes of witnessing increase the odds of a PotW attack, I don't expect very many experienced players will take them anymore (unless they know in advance they're playing another Eldar player with runes of Warding).

It's a good question, though.

Since the rules do contradict each other, our group resolved it by having the eldar player just roll 2D6 vs. tyranids. It's easier for everyone, and definitely gives a slight advantage back to the Eldar player by decreasing their PoW attacks.

Capt K

Canceling each other out is the common sense route.

I don't think they have to be contradictory. Runes of warding says enemies test at 3d6, and results of 12 or above count as a perils attack. Note that it does not say that they test with an extra die, it specifies 3. Runes of witnessing says you test on three and toss the highest. The only way those are incompatible is if you assume that there has to be 3 dice left to add at the end. Nowhere in the description of runes of warding is that assumption supported. Basically, from what I read, runes of witnessing trump runes of warding.

If you want a fluff explanation for why that it, it makes sense that eldar runes of warding woudn't work against other farseers who are tooled to cast powers.

It's not an assumption; it's explicitly stated in the main rulebook page 5 that you have to do it this way:



So when the runes of warding rule says "Psychic tests must be taken on 3D6," it means the *sum* of 3 dice according to the D6 notation rules set up on page 5 of the main rulebook.

If you throw out one of the dice as dictated by the runes of witnessing rule, then you are no longer taking your test on 3D6--you're taking it on 2D6 selected from a pool of 3 dice.

So if you apply one rule, you're breaking the other rule--a contradiction.

You ARE taking a test on 3d6 with runes of witnessing, you simply have a special ability to throw out the highest dice. The only way a contradiction exists is if you insist that there have to be 3 dice left at the end to add together. The rules for runes of warding dont say this, so we are left with your quote above. The psychic test description gives a guideline of how these tests are usually taken, but they do not pre-empt a codex from having a way of modifying this set of rules.

Runes of witnessing and warding are more specific, and thus in the event of a contradiction with the main rulebook, the more specific rule would take precedence. Rulebook says you roll the number indicated and add them all. Codex says you roll 3 and throw out the highest. This is just another example in a long list where the codex for different armies differs from the general ruleset.

On a side not, I think it is a rookie mistake of GW to have 2 items of wargear on the SAME PAGE that don't function together smoothly, and I am not posiitve how they were intended to work (although I would personally guess that warding should always add an extra die instead of making all tests on 3, and witnessing should add a die and throw out the highest - thus meaning in this situation you would roll 4 dice and sum the lowest three for your test), but if you are playing by the rules we have, I believe in my above argument.

Aha, but the rules for runes of warding *do* say this, Cort.

"Psychic tests must be taken on 3D6"

The notation "3D6" means not just "three dice," but rather "the *sum* of three dice." I don't insist it--the rules for runes of warding insist it.

Mathematically there no way that [the sum of three dice] can be equal in value to [the sum of two out of three dice]. There's nothing in specific codex rules for runes of warding that allows you to alter the specified roll of 3D6 (remember that if the rules don't say you can do it, then you can't), so the equally-specific rune of witnessing rules contradict that when they tell you to alter the total.

OK, Tom, so if this comes up in a tournament tomorrow, how would you handle it? You said above that you would just have them cancel out, but really that isn't a solution that comes from a rules standpoint, that's just a workaround. Would you play it the way I described above (roll 4d6 and sum the 3 lowest) so that both items are having an effect, or would you disregard them entirely?

A contradiction can't be resolved by interpreting the rules as written. It's in the nature of literal reading.

You have to come up with a workaround, or ignore both rules, or make up a house rule. It doesn't really matter to me what the outcome is--I'm just arguing that the rules as written are contradictory.