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From the description of the Collar of Khorne:

I saw this in another thread, and it made me think.  How much of this is missing? According a RAW reading, this could be used to nullify Synapse or Psi Scream, as long as they were in the area of effect.  You could even say that it could nullify Shadow in the Warp. 

If the bearer of the collar is in the area of effect of a psychic power, they can nullify it on a 2+. 

The area of effect of Synapse is 12" from the model with the power. 

So can a model with a collar of khorne within 12" of a tyrant nullify synapse on a 2+?  How long would the nullification last?  Till the bearer's next activcation?  Till the Tyrant's next activation? 

No.

A model with the collar of khorne, even one within 12 inches of a synapse creature, is not within its "area of effect". Since, of course, synapse only affects tyranid creatures.

Of course its within the area of effect. Just because it can't be affected doesn't mean its not in there. Friendlies aren't affected by FOTD, but they are still in the area of effect if they are within 12" of the psychic.

Nope, the area of effect of synapse is not a circle around the synapse creature, but is the creatures themselves.

Same deal with FOTD. FOTD does not create a circle, but rather the enemy units themselves are the area of effect. Anything that is not an enemy unit within 12" of the Librarian is not within the area of effect.

No where within the description of the power will you find wording that indicates that the power extends into the empty space around the model.

Template powers are the exception.

Only tyranid broods within 12 " of a Synapse creature are affected by Synapse

That model with the Collar of Khorne is not a Tyranid creature.

Synapse does not include the Collar of Khorne model within its area of effect.

I don't know how to explain it any more clearly.

I do.








No.

Hmm, it still seems that for a psychic power to affect something X distance away, it would have to have an area of effect with a radius of at least X.

FOTD affects all enemy units within 12". The enemy units are the target, not the area of effect.  I don't see why a model has to be affected by something to qualify as being in its area of effect. 

I'm arguing devil's advocate here. I play Tyranids and I do not want to see itused this way.

Oh, and DaIronGob? Thankx for that well thought out and backed-up response. I'm so happy I could provide an opportunity for you to get a boost to your postcount. 

Sorry I was just being sarcastic in regards to this particular question.

I found it best that sometimes, the best answer is the simplest one. As is the case on dakka, over winded answers fair less better than just saying 'no'.

When we find the 95 percent of the universe that's missing, we will find a huge mass of socks, house keys, puzzle pieces, youth and perfectly readable and playable GW rules.

With that said, Synapse does not have a 'radius' of effect. It has a direct effect meaning that it links the Synapse creature directly to the unit. It doesn't just 'pulse' the 'synapse power' outwards for 12" in hopes that something comes along.

How would the Collar be able to "stop" the Syanpse power? The Synapse creature will still be 'exuding it' therefore even if the collar rolled it's 2+, the power would automatically still be there. It's not 'cast', it is always there. There is no stopping it from happening. See?

Posted By DaIronGob on 01/09/2007 12:50 PM
With that said, Synapse does not have a 'radius' of effect. It has a direct effect meaning that it links the Synapse creature directly to the unit. It doesn't just 'pulse' the 'synapse power' outwards for 12" in hopes that something comes along.

How would the Collar be able to "stop" the Syanpse power? The Synapse creature will still be 'exuding it' therefore even if the collar rolled it's 2+, the power would automatically still be there. It's not 'cast', it is always there. There is no stopping it from happening. See?

I want to believe this, but it still looks like you're making the 'if the creature isnt affected it isnt in the area of effect' assumption.  You're making claims about Synapse that just aren't in the rules.

The rule for the Collar of Khorne says 'included in the area of effect'.  It doesn't say anything about activation being necessary.  That's why I wanted to know if it could work.  The way it's written it looks like it could affect continuous, non-activated psychic powers.

No I am saying that you get to roll the 2+ only once, but the nid player never has to 'recast' Synapse.

It is always on. Even if your claim is true and you did in fact roll a 2+ there is no way to gauge the length of time that the collar is in effect.

You made your 2+ roll. But the Syanpse creature still has Synapse and it is still working... they aren't targetting anything or sending out a 'psychic pulse' meaning you can block the power when it is being attempted to cast. It is always there. The creature is not casting synapse.

The ruleset is permissive. Since the Collar of Khornes rules do not specify how long psychic powers are nulled there is no way to tell just how long to stop the Synapse for.

EDIT:

You could house rule it... but that's it.

Beef make simple answer. Its meant to styop people casting pyshici powers or using force weapons on the model with the coller. Its not meant to stop synapse as synaps does not affect the model with the collor. If you still dont get it carry on and play how you want.

Also, if you claimed that it nullified Synapse all together then you would have to rule that the Synapse creature itself no longer had Synapse after you made your 2+ roll.

Again, there are no rules supporting this issue.

There it is. It's always on. If you stop a psychic power from being cast, they can't cast again in the turn. But if you stop Synapse, or any other continuous effect, it just happens again right after. Good. Thankx.

Isn't there an FAQ (to the BGB, if my memory serves) that states that psychic powers which do not require a psychic test may not be nullified?

If that's the case, then whether it's a warlock using "enhance" or a tyranid creature using "synapse" neither of them can be nullfied.

No, but it is mentioned in the Tyranid Codex (p31).

"... include him in their area of effect are nullified..."

First let us look for an objective definition of area of effect. To be honest the ones I have read in this thread come across as totally bogus. From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:

Area of effect,
Area of effect (or AoE) is a term used in many role-playing games to describe attacks or spells that affect multiple targets within a specified area.

?For example, in the role playing game Dungeons & Dragons, a fireball spell will deal damage to anyone within a certain radius of where it strikes. This term is not limited to role playing games, however; in most first-person shooters and tactical strategy games grenades, rockets, and other explosive weapons have an area of effect that will damage anyone close to where they strike.

?Area of effect can also refer to spells and abilities that are non-damaging and non-explosive. For example, a powerful healing spell may affect anyone within a certain range of the caster (often only if they are a member of the caster's party). Many games also have what is sometimes referred to as "aura" abilities that will affect anyone in the area around the person with the ability. For example, many strategy games have hero or officer units that can improve the morale and combat performance of friendly units around them.

?The inclusion of AoE elements in game mechanics can increase the role of strategy, especially in turn-based strategy games. The player has to place units wisely to mitigate the possibly devastating effects of a hostile area of effect attack; however, placing units in a dense formation could result in gains that outweigh the increased AoE damage received.?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_of_effect


So the common perception for the term area of effect is an actual area and often is defined as a circle with a radius centered around the psyker casting a psychic power.

- Greenie