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Just finished a local RTT tonight, so I figured I'd throw out my results and thoughts on my army.  Only 3 games long, and with short time for each game and so many models to move, I didn't really get a chance to take detailed notes, so it will be more of a synopsis on tactics and such.

I'd been kicking around various IG builds, and finally decided to do something a little odd for a change.  The tourney was standard missions with gamma rules, so I figured I'd try to use that to my advantage.

The list:
Doctrines: Jungle Fighters, Drop Troops, Special Weapon Squads, Close Order Drill, Veterans

HQ
JO with CCW/LP, 4 plasma gunners
SWS with 2 melta and demo charge
SWS with 2 melta and demo charge

6 vets with 3 melta guns
6 vets with 3 melta guns
6 vets with 3 plasma guns

 1st Plt
Plt HQ with JO with plasma pistol, 4 plasma gunners
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun

 2nd Plt
Plt HQ with JO with plasma pistol, 4 plasma gunners
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun

 3rd Plt
Plt HQ with JO, 4 plasma gunners
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun

 4th Plt
Plt HQ with JO, 4 plasma gunners
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
 
 5th Plt
Plt HQ with JO, 4 plasma gunners
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun
SQD with jungle fighters, heavy flamer, plasma gun

So, 37 plasma guns, 10 melta guns, 10 heavy flamers and 160 models.  I had never tried an army like this before, but it seemed to me the jungle fighters and heavy flamers would help counter one of the bigger threats to the list...horde armies.

As I arrived, however, I found I needn't have worried...of the 8 players there, I was the only non marine/chaos player.  In the past there had been much more variety (and more players), but for whatever reason (weather, timing), much lower turnout.  I was also dismayed to see several of the armies appeared to be very troop heavy...

Game 1 Recon vs. Blood Angels
My first game was on a board that would be well suited for city fight.  A brief picture of his army:

Chaplain with jumppack
Named dreadnaught
Dread with TL lascannon
5 terminators
10 assault marines
10 assault marines
10 tactical marines
10 tactical marines
5 scouts
5 scouts

I think that was it.  He ended up with 10 guys in the death company with the chaplain.  He spread out along the deployment area, which gave me some great places to drop in, but the cover saves hurt the effectiveness of my plasma.  He had both assault squads on one side, and the death company on the other...with feel no pain and all. I figured I'd target the regular assault guys first and try to avoid/limit the death company's options.

Overall, things went pretty well...the deployment area got crowded when 90+ models come in, but deviating into death was pretty rare.  All my games turned out to like this one, with me killing lots of stuff as I dropped in, but the limited opponents easily killing my weak, bunched-up guard.  I easily dispatched the regular assault guys, but the death company was, ultimately, the death of me.  They ended up jumping up the board into my deployment zone, moving across the table, and then back up into his zone, in a big "U" shape of destruction.  The chaplain's grail made it tough to isolate him,  feel no pain limited most of my weapons' effectiveness, and they stomped me.  I ended up with 1 infantry squad in his deployment area and a few broken squads, while he had 4 scouts in my deployment zone, the chaplain and 5 death company and 8 tac marines.  I think it would have been a "solid victory" for him, but for this tourney, the magnitude of win wasn't important, just win-tie-lose.

Game 2 Recon vs. Regular marines

My army took a lot more concentration than I had expected, so my notes were even more vague than the first fight.  As I recall, this list was something like:

1 grand marshal on bike
1 chaplain on bike
4 dev squads of 5 with 2 missiles or lascannons each
2 squads of 6-8 scouts
2 squads of 6-8 bikes
2 techmarines

Terrain was supposed to be like a wasteland, mostly open with craters and some rock formations.

I keep thinking there had to be something more...maybe a small tac squad or two?  Apparently, he plays drop IG with the (forgeworld?) Elysian rules, so was kind of familiar with what I would be attempting.  He ended up going first, which he used to turbo boost his bikes.  He set himself up for trouble, though, in that he totally scattered his army.  The scouts were on either end of my deployment area, bikers towards the center, some marine squads were hoofing it to the craters in the center of the board, and others were sitting in craters/hills in the back.  This gave me plenty of space to drop in and overwhelm parts of his army, and he eventually had to assault with the bikes, which let me drop the next wave of stuff in to hurt them.  Another see-saw battle, but with his fewer numbers of expensive troops I was able to overwhelm him.  I had 3 squads and a platoon HQ in his deployment area, along with a few other squads running around, while he was down to his marshal, a techmarine and a lone dev marine if I recall correctly.

Game 3- Secure and Control vs Chaos of some kind
I fight chaos so rarely, so I'm sure some of this will be off, too:
Large demon prince
1 Oblit
2 10 man squads of chaos marines
1 large dev squad with missile launchers
predator with autocannon and h.bolters sponsons
10 marines in rhino...something was different about them
8-10 infiltrating marines, one of which turned into a huge demon when killed.  Also able to control when/where demonettes could drop in (nearby)
10 demonettes
Lt? on bike with 4-6 marines

Standard "temperate" terrain with hills, forests, 2 buildings.  5 loot counters set pretty much across the middle of the board.

He, too, seemed a little perplexed on how to set up, and set up in a fairly straight line across the front of his deployment area, with the infiltrating squad in a building in my deployment area.  He quickly became alarmed at how many models he lost when I dropped in at the bottom of the second (probably 20+).  He lost several to heavy flamers in addition to the usual plasma.

I was able to isolate his flanks fairly well, as well as the area around the house in my deployment area, killing the rhino squad on my left, demon prince in the center, and a tac squad and the devs on the right.  His bikers, however, were always assaulting or in a bad spot to drop, so they caused some major problems.  His oblit, next to a tac squad buried in the center of his deployment zone, was also a thorn in my side.  We eventually whittled the tac squad away, but it and the oblit took several rounds of fire, and assaulted several squads.  We had to end at the end of turn 5, which gave me the game...his final round would have probably been enough to assault one squad I had on an objective with his bikes, while moving close enough with the huge demon spawn to possibly assault 2 units I had near objectives on the other side.  On raw points from units, he had me slightly, but I had 2 more objectives than him, which gave me the win.


LESSONS LEARNED

I think a lot of this army's success has to do with surprising your opponent.  With only three rounds, and as an pretty much unknown face, I hoped I'd be able to get opponents to deploy as if against a standard army (i.e. spread out), so I could drop in and take them apart piecemeal.  This time, it worked.  I think if someone knew what was coming, they could deploy appropriately (castle, probably, as FotD isn't a concern) and cause some major problems. 

Even without facing any hordes, I was fairly pleased with my heavy flamers.  I easily wiped out 3 of the 4 scout squads I faced, and they were a decent source of consistent wounds against marines.  I put them on the large base, like any other heavy weapon, so when the squad deviated, I could easily place him wherever I needed on the outside ring of the squad's deployment to get much closer to the enemy.  Very handy...usually averaged about 4-5 hits with them per drop, which isn't bad.

Need an efficient carrying case to rapidly deploy sorted units from...something like several trays on top of one another with a handle on top.  Also probably need color-coded bases on the models, to keep them straight on the battlefield.  With so many models, in various states of being shot up, it's tough to tell sometimes who a particular unit on the field is.

Iron discipline might have been handy.  I've always like it, but dropped it for the other doctrines.  Several times I had small groups of troops running away, and an officer with ID could have rallied lone meltas, plasma and flamers.  I think, at least.  I know I had several broken squads routing, but my leaders dies pretty quickly, so I don't ever remember if they would have been close enough to do anything.

Demo charges are probably a must.  I hate taking a doctrine slot for just 2 special weapon squads, but the demo charges are pretty handy.  I had some great targets for them (large death company, for example)  and they usually performed exceptionally well.  Had a few bad scatters, of course, but on the whole they filled a critical niche in the list.

Close order drill may go.  These guys SUCK in melee...even if I raped an enemy squad with fire, the remaining 1-2 marines could easily assault my squad and kill them all.  The absolute WORST thing, though, would be for the enemy to stay locked in combat and wipe me out on my turn to assault again.  I think trying to make these guys viable to melee is a losing prospect, so I'm thinking the solution to this is to lose melee as quickly as possible, take the (many) casualties from base to base contact, and hope to break away.  More partial units for those ID officers to rally. 

I found myself (shock) wanting more plasma and fewer heavy flamers.  It's not that the flamers weren't handy, but with most of your army arriving on the first drop, it became very hazardous trying to land if, say, 4 platoons came in together.  Scattering onto the 80+ friendly models out there kills you troops the same as landing on the enemy, so many large units are a problem.  The majority of killing is done by the special/heavy weapons, and the troops die so easily, that maybe smaller, more expensive units (like storm troopers) might be just as effective in limited numbers.  There's probably a happy medium somewhere...although if I'd faced anything other than marines, I'd probably say I couldn't get enough heavy flamers.

The 4 squads with melta guns were sufficient for all my anti-armor, supplemented by my plasma guns (who killed the chaos rhino).  It seemed about right, balance-wise...I would expect to see many landraider-heavy armies, but if I did, 1-2 squads might not be enough.

Don't know how I ranked overall...it was getting late, so they announced the winners and will (I assume) post the rest of the results on the store's web forum.  Seemed like a lot of points were put into soft scores (nice player/sportmanship/army appearance)...right, wrong or indifferent.  I hurt myself there, with my army not nearly as nice looking as some of the others, but most of my opponents seemed to enjoy playing me and facing something a little different...not only a non-power armor army, but an all drop IG to boot!

Did you finish all your games before time was called?

Glad to hear your AAR you identified some issues playing the army. My own experience yielded the same. I've had trepidation playing against horde armies (tourneys) as I rarely can finish a game in time and lots of times, my opponent had a hard time figuring out who belonged in what squads.

Good luck next time. And yes, it is a good thing to see a non MEQ on the table.

My last game ended at the bottom of 5, although the last turn would have only taken 5-10 minutes with what few models were left. Most games had 2 hours allotted, although the last was a bit short (1:45 if I recall). I think the first game went all 6 round, and my second went through 4, and maybe 5.

It would go much faster if I had a better organized system for my troops, I think, so that's something I need to work on. It's not quite as bad as some horde armies, as the whole first turn involves no movement from my side, and stuff dies very quickly either from bad scatter rolls or horrific enemy return fire. I really hadn't practiced with the list at all prior to going into this event...I think should be easy for it to finish 5 rounds, and possibly 6 in two hours with some practice. Other little things could streamline the process, including:

- having several pairs of different colored dice so I can roll all 4 plasma gunners (and possibly JO with plasma pistol)
together

- having sets of dice set aside for standard squads (16 dice for lasgun shots, 2 for plasma, some red for heavy flamer hits)

Great report. I appreciate the added "tactical knowledged" gained. It is always interesting to hear people's thoughts about how there army functions and how to make it better.

ender502

I'd much prefer to have fully detailed battle reports with diagrams and such like I've done in the past...much more entertaining for the readers, and they can provide better feedback on tactics and such...but with the time constraints and concentration it took playing with a completely foreign army, I just couldn't take time for detailed notes.  The notes at the end are really the thrust of the thread, I guess...lessons learned for other IG players out there thinking of oddball lists.  The jungle fighter/drop pod combo seems fairly useful, but I'd never seen it proposed before, so maybe my attempt and notes will inspire some advice from the Dakka experts.


edit: A thread in the tactics section got me to thinking about adding a few sentinels to the list.  Something to add firepower to the list, but they can hang back and not crowd the drop area directly near the enemy.  The enemy will be busy killing the mass of troops in their face, so the sentinels should get several turns of shooting in.  Maybe even throw improved comms on one or two to better control the drop rate?  Of course, then the question becomes: how many, and which weapon (and what to drop in exchange...)

Posted By Grimaldi on 03/11/2007 10:19 AM
- having sets of dice set aside for standard squads (16 dice for lasgun shots, 2 for plasma, some red for heavy flamer hits)

You know, that is a damn good idea.  I'd never thought of that before.  I'm going to swipe it, if you don't mind.

Nice batrep.  The first thing I thought when I saw it was "oh man, he's going to lose a lot of squads to deviation".  Did you have much of a problem there?

best line out of the whole shebang.
Sounds like a fun list. What is your strategy if you play Alpha and/or can't Deep Strike?

I really didn't lose too much to deviation...at least not enough to feel I really crippled myself.  I think I lost about 2-3 squads per game.  Certainly not good, but I never felt like I lost so much that I screwed myself before the game ever started.

Sadly, I don't play enough to know enemy armies like I should, and I'm too cheap to buy all the codexes  =)   My opponent's army looked pretty nice, and the leader of that squad had a neat mutated arm...whether it actually meant something besides looking cool, I can't recall.

The tournament was all gamma-level missions, so I had no trouble taking the list.  If alpha missions were a possibility, the list would need a MASSIVE overhaul.  I don't think an all drop guard army would work if alpha missions were present.  You have to tool your troops so much to engage at under 12" that you have no meaningful long range firepower...and that's not a good thing for guard in an alpha scenario.

Dropping guard is a lot of fun, very unpredictable. I highly recommend the sentinals with inproved comms. Well worth the points, and the improved comms even works when the guys are off the table. Your other thoughts are right on the money. You want your guys running away. after close combat so that they can be shooting next turn.

And what would you recommend I drop to get sentinels in? I could drop an entire platoon, switch the vets to all plasma (net gain of plasma) and drop 4 sentinels with lascannons and missiles. Normally not a good layout for sentinels, but with the amount of troops dropping in, they would be relatively safe from return fire for several turns. I could go with multilasers, of course, but the lascannon would be much more versatile.

I say drop one platoon, keep the vets with melta guns, and also keep the sentinals as cheap as possible, inproved comms, and multi-lasers. You really do not need the lascannons. Rapid firing plasma up the tail pipe or a melta in the face will do for 99% of the tanks in the game, and 4 bs3 lascanns is not enough to take out a monolith reliably. However the multi-lasers are great against troops, and av10 and 11. Nasty against skimmers. Add in the fact that they drop too, and they really fit in the army. The only other option is to take autocannons on the sentinals. they cost more, but the 48 inch range is useful when they can be contesting a quarter, but still providing support (provided there are no 48 inch heavy weapons in line of sight to toast them)

The Chaos dudes in the Rhino were probably Possessed Marines. Really nice list, btw.

Glad to hear BA came out on top.

- Greenie

What a fun list! I have dropping guard and they are a blast to play, i really enjoy the army. Mine includes tanks, but the infantry are all airborne.

I go with the heavy flamers too, and i find them to be invaluable. they are better against marines in cover than the plasma, and too bad you didnt get to play any non 3+ armies, you would see just how awesome those heavy flamers can be.

I agree too, the demo charges are crucial, you toss one on a tightly packed squad of marines and it just puts a smile on your face.

another trick i have found to work well is to use remnanat squads with a special weapon. one 5 man squad with a speical is scoring and can pop a tank if you give them a melta. You can take a ton of the little guys and over load your opponant with targets which ensures more of them will fire more than just the turn they come in. I have had a lot of success with that.

also, the improved comms is a must, since you roll for an entire platoon at a time, it makes a big difference. You want as much of your army coming in on the same turn as possible. a sentinal with a hevay flamer for cheap is good, or the autocannon is a great choice for reasons already stated. I personally use a bassie as it enables me to hit targets that are too dangerous to drop next too.

cool report, i hope you use them again, i love my gaurd army.

Drop troops for IG are okay but nothing I would bank on in a tournament since you need the special rule for inflitration.

- Greenie

Also, on the topic of squad organization, you are totally correct. I pack my army in my army transport by squad so that they go in and come out one squad at a time. also, i pain unit markings on the back of the base, like A1 for platoon A, squad 1. hope that helps.

I agree with you, they are not a tourny winning army, but they are a lot of fun to play. It just depends on what you are trying to do. And if you get an alpha level mission, good night, the army just toally blows.

Walking gaurd at a gunline is suicide.

It seems many of the tournaments around here are random missions, but all at gamma level, so an army like this is feasible under those circumstances. It certainly wouldn't work if Alpha missions were a possibility. As is, it was a blast to play for me, and I think my opponents had a good time, too. Again, every game was a real roller coaster, with horrific casualties on both sides and plenty of good and bad luck, and all were close right to the finish.

Yeah, that is what i love about that army myself, so much stuff dies! It really is a super fun army to play.

Thanks for the battle report. I am building an IG army with a drop troop element, and your report has given me some food for thought.

What is your opinion on the Special Weapon teams? Did the Meltaguns do all right? Or would you rather have had flamers? I can see either being useful: the meltas because you might scatter away from the enemy and need the extra range, the flamers because you will primarily be shooting at troops due to the presence of the demo charge.

I had plenty of flame weapons, so a few more weren't really necessary. The melta guns were much more useful. The unit was originally intended for hard infantry targets like marines and terminators, so a few extra melta shots are much more useful than a pair of flamers. For example, the Death Company was an ideal target, and nothing but str 8 stuff would help overcome that problem. The team also served as a back-up AT system for the 2 melta vet squads.

The range also helped if the team survived the first turn after its drop, or even if it was shot up and started retreating, it could easily pop off a few more turns of melta shots with the 12" range. The SWS squads with meltas and demo pack are highly recommended for drop armies...you can get flamers for anti-horde duty elsewhere.

A single squad of heavy flamer setinals with imp comms may be helpful. They have the added benefit of exploding half the time and hurting even more marines. I wouldn't bother giving them the extra attack.