Converting my 1850 DA army to the new codex

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**Mannahnin**

I finally got my copy of the codex. If you were already playing mechanized, it's not awful. I took the tournament army I used most recently (December) and converted it over as directly as possible:

I go from this:

<pre>Reclusiarch (85) w/ Terminator Honors (15), Stubborn (5), Bolt Pistol (1), Frag (1), Blades of Reason (5), Jump Pack (20) = 132</pre> <pre>Dreadnought (105) w/Extra Armor (5) = 110</pre> <pre>Tac Squad 10 SM (150) w/ML (10), Melta (10), Vet Sgt. (15) Ezekiel w/Fist (15) and Bolt Pistol = 200 </pre> <pre>in Rhino w/Smoke, Extra Armor, Searchlight (1) =59</pre> <pre>Tac Squad 10 SM (150) w/Lascannon (15), Flamer (6), Vet Sgt. (15) Michael w/Fist (15), Stubborn (5), BP =206</pre> <pre>In Rhino w/Smoke, Extra Armor, Searchlight (1) =59</pre> <pre>Tac Squad 6 SM (90) w/Plasmacannon (20), Plasma gun (10), Sgt with BP & CCW = 120</pre> <pre>In Razorback (70) w/Smoke, Extra Armor, Searchlight (1) = 79</pre> <pre>Tac Squad 6 SM (90) w/Lascannon (15) Plasma gun (10), Sgt with BP & CCW = 115</pre> <pre>Landspeeder Tornado = 80</pre> <pre>8 Assault Marines (176) w/2 Plasma Pistols (10), Vet Sgt (15) Lucius w/ Fist (15) and BP = 216</pre> <pre>Condemning Word- Vindicator (125) w/Smoke (3), Searchlight (1) = 129</pre> <pre>Sacred Judgement- Predator Annihilator (120) w/Lascannon Sponsors (25) = 145</pre> <pre>Devastator Squad -8 SM (120) w/ 4 ML (80), Sgt w/Bolter = 200</pre> <pre>Total: 1850pts</pre> <pre>--------------------------</pre> <pre>To this:</pre>

Chaplain w/(100) w/ Jump Pack (20) = 120

Dreadnought (125) w/Extra Armor (15) = 140

Tac squad -10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Melta (10), Vet Sgt w/Fist (25) and Bolt Pistol = 210

In Rhino w/Smoke, Extra Armor (15), Searchlight =50

Tac Squad -10 SM (165) w/Lascannon (20), Flamer (5), Vet Sgt. w/Fist (25), BP =215

In Rhino w/Smoke, Extra Armor (15), Searchlight =50

Tac Squad -10 SM (165) w/Plascannon(15), Plasmagun (15), Vet Sgt with BP & CCW = 195

In Razorback w/Smoke, Extra Armor (15), Searchlight = 65

Landspeeder Tornado = 100

Assault Squad - 5 Assault Marines (125) w/2 Plas Pistols (30), Vet Sgt w/ Fist (25) & BP = 180

Predator Annihilator (105) w/Lascannon Sponsors (60) = 165

Vindicator (125) w/Smoke, Searchlight = 125

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 4 ML (80), Vet Sgt w/Bolter = 245

Total: 1855pts

So from 1850 the list winds up at 1855, two six man tac squads had been turned to a single ten, an eight man assault squad went to five, I lost three models net, one lascannon, one plasmagun, and 1A and blades of reason on my chaplain. In return I got Frag and Krak everywhere, two vet sgts I don't realy need (but who do help with Target Priority rolls) and the use of the combat squads rule- for three tac squads and a dev squad.

Honestly, it's playable. If I drop Extra Armor from my vehicles, I'll actually wind up 55pts under, instead of 5 pts over.

Next, let's look at what I can do if I actually adapt my list to the codex, selecting units more on the basis of what works and is overpriced now.

**Mannahnin**

What if I drop the formerly-borderline but now almost certainly overpriced Dread? And the jacked-up Pred? Two units which got 20pt bumps for no apparent reason. That's 305pts. I'm already saving 45 pts on the extra armor from the transports. That's 350.

That could buy me: Dev Squad= 10 SM (165), 2 Lascannons (70), 1 HB (15) = 250 with 100 points to spare.

Not bad.

Maybe drop the Lascannon from the Tac squad and replace it with a ML. That's ten points, giving my enough to bump the assault squad up to 10 models. So a possible list might be:

Chaplain (120) w/Jump Pack (20) = 120

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Melta (10), Vet Sgt.w/Fist (25) and Bolt Pistol = 210

In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight = 35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Flamer (5), Vet Sgt. w/Fist (25) and BP =205

In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Plasmacannon (15), Plasma gun (15), Vet Sgt w/Bolt Pistol & CCW = 195

In Razorback w/Smoke, Searchlight = 50

Landspeeder Tornado = 100

Assault Squad - 10 Assault Marines (235) w/2 Plasma Pistols (30), Vet Sgt w/ Fist (25) and BP = 290

Vindicator w/Smoke, Searchlight = 125

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 4 ML (80), Vet Sgt w/Bolter = 245

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 2 Las (70), 1 HB (15), Vet Sgt w/ Bolter =250

**Mr. X**

For the price of two lascannons you can almost get four missile launchers. AP2 is great, but more firepower's probably better. Or how about four heavy bolters in the new dev squad to handle hordes & light vehicles?

**Mannahnin**

It's a good thought. But I do feel like I need SOME lascannons in the list. Monoliths, Russes, and Landraiders are out there.

Next iteration- what if I drop the other unit which sucked a 20pt bump? The speeder. 100pts is a decent amount. Not enough for much by way of units, but I could spend it on things the codex encourages- cheap transports and the mandatory vet sgts. One issue a mechanized list always has in Escalation is starting off the table. With my December army I only started with one Tac squad and the Devs. What if I started with everything off? My opponent has nothing to shoot at. Additionally, in Alpha and Gamma missions, I could choose to either split the guns, or run the Devs with all the guns in one Combat squad and the Vet in an objective-grabbing or assaulting (against Tau, IG, etc.) half, which would actually be mobile.

Maybe something like this:

Chaplain (100) w/Jump Pack (20) = 120

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Melta (10), Vet Sgt.w/Fist (25) and Bolt Pistol = 210
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Flamer (5), Vet Sgt. w/Fist (25) and BP =205
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Plasmacannon (15), Plasma gun (15), Vet Sgt w/Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol = 210
In Razorback w/Smoke, Searchlight = 50

Assault Squad - 10 Assault Marines (235) w/2 Plasma Pistols (30), Vet Sgt w/ Fist (25) and BP = 290

Vindicator w/Smoke, Searchlight = 125

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 4 ML (80), Vet Sgt w/Bolter = 245
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 2 Las (70), 1 HB (15), Vet Sgt w/Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol =265
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

**ender502**

Posted By Mannahnin on 03/27/2007 9:54 AM
It's a good thought. But I do feel like I need SOME lascannons in the list. Monoliths, Russes, and Landraiders are out there.

Next iteration- what if I drop the other unit which sucked a 20pt bump? The speeder. 100pts is a decent amount. Not enough for much by way of units, but I could spend it on things the codex encourages- cheap transports and the mandatory vet sgts. One issue a mechanized list always has in Escalation is starting off the table. With my December army I only started with one Tac squad and the Devs. What if I started with everything off? My opponent has nothing to shoot at. Additionally, in Alpha and Gamma missions, I could choose to either split the guns, or run the Devs with all the guns in one Combat squad and the Vet in an objective-grabbing or assaulting (against Tau, IG, etc.) half, which would actually be mobile.

Maybe something like this:

Chaplain (100) w/Jump Pack (20) = 120

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Melta (10), Vet Sgt.w/Fist (25) and Bolt Pistol = 210
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ML (10), Flamer (5), Vet Sgt. w/Fist (25) and BP =205
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Plasmacannon (15), Plasma gun (15), Vet Sgt w/Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol = 210
In Razorback w/Smoke, Searchlight = 50

Assault Squad - 10 Assault Marines (235) w/2 Plasma Pistols (30), Vet Sgt w/ Fist (25) and BP = 290

Vindicator w/Smoke, Searchlight = 125

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 4 ML (80), Vet Sgt w/Bolter = 245
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 2 Las (70), 1 HB (15), Vet Sgt w/Power Weapon & Bolt Pistol =265
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Manny-

The answer to escalation is to have your stuff on the field at the start of your game. If you want to go with nothing available on the first turn you should drop the devs entirely because they won't be shooting until turn 3.

I would drop the dev rhinos entirely.

Also, is there a differential between the points costs of ML and las cannons in tac squads versus in dev squads? Just wondering if you switch the las to the tacs f you could squeeze out a few more points.

ender502

**davidson**

You save 15 per las cannons by putting it in tac squads, and ML in dev squads.

**ender502**

Thanks for that davidson. Perhaps a switch is in order? I know Manny rarely (if ever ) takes the cheesey route but.... The extra points are something to think about.

ender502

**Chaplain Pallantide**

wow your list looks quite similar to the one I have post below! I usually play at the 1500pt limit, not 1850. I really need to get down to Empire and play a few games with you guys! I wish I didn't live so far away. I guess I'll have to keep my eye out for the next tourney.

I agree with Ender, I would drop the Rhino's from the dev squads. I'd set them up and keep them in cover hoping for some good LOS and cover saves. That would free up some points. I also went with two small Melta squads in Razorbacks, instead of three units of 10 in Rhino's. Another thought I had with my 1500pts army, would be to pick up a Jump Pack Librarian, that way you could split the assault squad into 2 viable threats, and use your Rhino's as mobile terrain to get those squads where they need to be. Just my two cents for what it's worth.

Thanks,

Chappy P.

**davidson**

I ran a 1500 point army with Azriel, Eziekal, 5 termies with an ac, 2 las/plas 10 man tac squads, a 4 hb 10 man dev squad, and a 4 missle launcher dev squad. It did pretty well.

I grouped up Az, Ez and the termies together to maxamize the 4+inv saveand to act as a counter charge/objetive grabber unit.

**Mannahnin**

Thanks for the additional feedback, guys.

While I'd probably prefer to have the lascannons in the Dev squads, you're right that the 15pt savings for putting them in the tac squads is big. I like the Librarian idea too.

Special characters, even in the new "no permission required' versions, do not appeal to me.

Well, if I drop the Dev Rhinos and the two Power Weapons, and change the two Las in the Dev squad to two ML, I save 130. Change all three Tac squad heavies to Lascannons, and I'm down to 105. Add a second HB to the second Dev squad- 90. Drop the Razorback- 140. Exactly enough for a Librarian with Jump pack. So the revised list would be:

Chaplain (100) w/Jump Pack (20) = 120

Librarian (120) w/Jump Pack (20) = 140

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Las (20), Melta (10), Vet Sgt.w/Fist (25) and Bolt Pistol = 230
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Las(20), Flamer (5), Vet Sgt. w/Fist (25) and BP =215
In Rhino w/Smoke, Searchlight =35

Tac Squad - 10 SM (165) w/Las (20), Plasma gun (15), Vet Sgt w/CCW & Bolt Pistol = 200

Assault Squad - 10 Assault Marines (235) w/2 Plasma Pistols (30), Vet Sgt w/ Fist (25) and BP = 290

Vindicator w/Smoke, Searchlight = 125

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 4 ML (80), Vet Sgt w/Bolter = 245

Devastator Squad - 10 SM (165) w/ 2 ML (40), 2 HB (30), Vet Sgt w/Bolter =235

What do you think?

I'd really like to put a Plasmacannon in each of the dev squads to keep Deep-Strikers honest. It'd only be 5pts each if I upgrade from ML. 10 from a HB. I could finance that just by dropping a single plasma pistol from the assault squad. I can't believe they tripled the price of those. Yeesh.

You know what would be nice? If our "we're no old and experienced every squad has a Vet Sgt" chapter had access to some bloody veteran skills.

**ender502**

Manny-

that's looking pretty nasty. I agree about throwing in a plasma cannon. This is looking like a really great army.

ender502

**davidson**

Droping a plasma pistol for a Plasma cannon over a heavy bolter is a pretty good idea. I'd take the extra points and put an extra stormbolter on each rhino.

Looks like a nice list.

**wight_widow**

There's something about a 140 point dreadnought that ISN'T Venerable that is very wrong...I can't really comment on the list too much, not owning Codex: DA, but intuitively you look to be going towards the APC/IFV/medium tank spam that DA are geared to, which, without going too far off-topic, looks like the right direction.

**Longshot**

I think this list would be infinitely better with Sammael as your HQ.

205 pts for an AV14 skimmer with solid guns is sweet and one of the few good buys in the codex as far as characters go.

Something else I thought of for DA that might be playable-

Sammael on speeder, 3 landraiders, 5 man vet squads in razorbacks, and 5 man tac squads with razorbacks, could be decent.