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Mobile Tank Hunters with plasma rifles and fusion blasters? MEQ killers with fireknife config? Light armoured masses with flamers and cyclic ion cannon?
I'm loving the Fireknives for killing marines, a great amount of ap, damage ,and range, in mobility. I always want to use some aoe stuff to wipe out large amounts of things , like 'nids, but should I instead just rely on fire warriors to take out standard stuff?

There was a discussion on how different people like to load out their crisis suits here

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/208276.page#252907

the answers you'll likely get:

Fireknives only, anything else is for dummies

Putting burst cannons on a crisis suit is for dummies

deathrains are ok...if you're going to be so dumb to not have fireknives

fusion/plasma or fusion missile is fine if you really need anti tank because you were so dumb you didn't take enough railguns.

While I think all of these suits have uses, and have been playing around with a CIB/Burst HQ for fun recently, the fireknife is the obvious "jack of all trades" choice. But there is nothing wrong with going with more specialized (and almost invariably cheaper) weapon loadouts. I don't like any short range weaponry on a crisis suit because I feel they just get charged and killed, but I play a lot of armies that have no problem closing the 17-18 inch gap to charge me. For other people this isn't a problem, or they're willing to risk sacrificing the crisis suits to, say, a more expensive assault unit to try to leave that unit in the open later to get destroyed by massed firepower.

Some people will say that Burst/Missile is better than plasma/missile on a point for point basis if you insist on staying outside of 12" anyway. But this analysis is always done against MEQ...and there are too many 2+ saves around, I feel you need the plasma.

But yes, if you want lots of shots against softer targets, go with Fire Warriors, or Stealth Suits, or massed SMS fire, or my favorite, Kroot. Kroot suck at shooting, but you sure can have a lot of them sucking together.

in a 6 turn game you will always get another couple turns of shooting with Missile Pods. Pop transports and shake skimmers.

Thanks for the forum Link

I would like to point out something, tau is an interesting army because of the way they are composed. Troops have no special weapons and in the way 40k is played special weapons are what is needed. Tau are competitive with either an mech design or genius crisis layout or a mix of both. By genius I mean something that works with the rest of the army. All that said I would like to point out a unit of plasma carrying broadsides. They are the cheapest way to get plasma into the list, and tau's plasma weapons are the best plasma in the game! str6 ap2 is with no "gets hot" that can rapid fire, all this on a unit that save a 2+ and 4+inv with shield drones. Broadsides In my opinion are the backbone of the army and can handle anything expect maybe swarms, but we have firewarriors for that!


Basically my point is Crisis layout depends on what your list needs to fill the gap. Burst cannons are a no go because your troops are there to handle what the burst cannon would shoot at so adding more is not a suitable choice for any list in my opinion. Some think flamers are good on Crisis but I would say if you are every close enough to use a flamer you are too close. Which leaves Missile Pods, Fusion Blaster, Plasma these are really the only weapons you would ever need to arm a crisis suit with. Your list will dictate which one(s) to use.

Tau have Railguns are one end and S5 at the other.

Missile pods fill an important role in between.

Fireknives are a great build because the S6 plasma goes well with the S7 Missile Pod vs vehicles and MC. It also gets an extra 6" on the Burst cannon, giving the JSJ Crisis suit more options. Against 4+ save or better the Plasma comparable or better than burst and gets twice the shots at 12".

Flamers are good because they are cheap. So if you buy money-wise lots of suits, you have a team of Fireknives and a cheaper team of MP + flamer or Fusion + Flamer or whatever. If it comes down to it, it is better for a Crises team on the line to flame + get the charge than it is to be charged in turn.

If Broadsides are "the cheapest way to get plasma into the list" (how do you figure that, by the way?), then that is because they are the worst place to put plasma in the list. You can't get that plasma where you need it to be the way you can with Crises, and in order to make use of that plasma, you need to give up taking the very handy S&P wargear. Not worthwhile IMO.

And flamers are useful, but only as a hardpoint-filler on a TL weapon suit when the alternative would be to take a system you don't want.

The cost to put plasma on a broadside is less than what it costs for a crisis. I guess play style would dictate how useful plasma is on the broadside. I tend to hold my fireknives in the back to take pop shots on light armor until those nasty cc units get too close and when they do that plasma from the broadsides helps a lot. Say something deepstikes, maybe terminators that extra plasma will be a game winner.

The cost to put plasma on a broadside is less than what it costs for a crisis.

Not really. The Broadside already had an SMS, which you replace with the plasma; the Crisis comes with nothing at all.

I'm not saying plasma is useless on Broadsides, but don't you at least find that you get less use out of it than the plasma on your Crises? Also, isn't it annoying not being able to move to take a shot?

Plasma rifle is not a heavy weapon therefore a broadside can move 6in and rapid fire or not move and shoot 24in. The railgun is but you could equip ASS (sorry) and he could move d6 and shoot. Again all in how a person plays. I play crisis like a watered down broad side. Fireknives hit with MP using JSJ while the broadsides hit heavy armor standing their own with 2+ save and shield drones. Once the fast mean assault teams make their way to my line the suits step up giving them plasma and lots of it.


Another tactic using crisis is a fusion & plasma wielding shas'el with a squad of drones fast attack option JSJ'ing their way down the battlefield. The drones being a separate unit merely guarding the commander.


@tegeus-Cromis, I am curious as to how your list looks? My is quite different from the regular MechTau design. Mine is probably more suited against marines with all the plasma I carry and where I play it has to be.

I know how the PR and ASS work. My point is that you can't move and shoot and fire both weapons unless you HW one of those systems on a team leader. You need to be able to fire both weapons in order for the PR to be worthwhile.

As for "my list", the truth is that this is mostly based on my observations on how other Tau play. My Tau army never really got off the ground (I basically have a couple squads of FWs and some old Stealth Suits moldering in the cupboard). What I guess I'd field (and have proxied a couple of times to decent effect) at 1.5k is this:

HQ

-Shas'el: CIB, PR, TA, HW MT (100)

-Shas'el: MP, PR, TA, HW MT (97)

Elites

-Crisis Team: Team Leader, PR, MP, TA, HW MT
Battle Suit: TL MP, TL (125)

-Crisis Team: Team Leader, PR, MP, TA, HW MT
Battle Suit: TL MP, TL (125)

-Crisis Team: Team Leader, PR, MP, TA, HW MT
Battle Suit: TL MP, TL (125)

Troops

-Fire Warriors: 6 (185)
(-Devilfish: SMS, TA, MT, DL, DP)

-Fire Warriors: 6 (185)
(-Devilfish: SMS, TA, MT, DL, DP)

Heavy Support

Hammerhead: Railgun, SMS, TL, MT, DL, DP (185)

Hammerhead: Railgun, SMS, TL, MT, DL, DP (185)

Hammerhead: Railgun, SMS, TL, MT, DL, DP (185)


Sooo not exactly the most innovative of armies (probably why I dropped it). 5 PRs (2 BS5, 3 BS4), 7 MPs (1 BS5, 3 BS3 rerollable, 3 BS4), 1 CIB, 3 Railguns, 5 SMS. It seems to kill Marines okay, though my main opponent up till recently is always very Terminator-heavy. Mauleed Marines would be a tougher fight.

And yeah, it is kind of funny that I've been mouthing off about Broadsides without any intention of actually fielding them (even in proxy/test games), but like I said, I base my opinion more on experiences against Tau. (As Eldar, FYI.)

I see what you are getting at with the plasma rifle being an upgrade from SMS. I was merely saying that to upgrade it cost less than to buy it for the crisis. The tau list you posted is pretty solid, though I personally am not a fan of CIB, only because marines are more of a regular enemy that I face.

You should try the broadsides some time, but use SDs! They make them worth their points.

Well, you're definitely right about plasma on the Broadsides--I mean, this is an objective fact--but my point is just that cost alone isn't everything. You also have to look at what you're giving up and how well the thing you're getting works on that particular platform. If plas on Broadsides works for you, great, but I just don't see it working very well for or against me (but then again, you are tooling against Marines and not Eldar, after all).

I actually take CIB precisely because I expect Marines. What would you take instead of it that's better, bearing in mind that you already have the PR? I don't really want my commander closing to 12" to use an FB. Come to think of it, I don't want him closing to 12" to double-tap the PR, either. At 18", the CIB is really the best Marine-killing choice.

Oh, I know Broadsides work. I just find it kind of lame having these guys who are almost turrets when you could have skimmers with the same armament (but less of it, of course) instead. If there were other elements that worked well like this, I wouldn't mind it, but everything else wants to move. . . . Purely a preference thing.

Well you have a point about keeping the commander as far as possible away from, well anything, but I ususally run them up behind the warfishes to help keep them from being assaulted.

The debate of what to take between HH or BS is a long and ugly one. I think they are both great and it does all come down to your last line "...Purely a preference thing."

i have played 3 games vs. mech tau this week ( i won all 3 btw) and from what i have seen and talked about with my buddy that uses tau, having a mix of FK and Missle pod\burst is not a bad way to go at all.

i know a lot of people talk about burst cannons being a waste on the suits, but man that many shots on the back armor of falcons (or any tank for that matter) hurts. also even thought MP\burst dont pop MEQ armor, they wound so reliably that you will down them from the odds alone. just not termies...

@tegeus-the only problem of the 3 HH list is that if an army has a decent amount of anti armor, they are dead. also maybe my friends HH hate him or something but they miss, and having that many points miss with its main shot sucks bad. on the flip side, if they cant hurt the tanks, they will be a superstar!

FW are cool, FW with even 1 markerlight=deadly

As been said before, tailor your suits for a role whether that to cover a weakness or push a strength.

I've been playing Farsight for the past year and I tended to load up on fire knives for the 2 HQ squads. I'd have a squad of 2 arrayed death rains and a pair of helios. I run a small squad of stealths as well.

I tend to use the death rains for popping transports early in the game. The 2 HQ will use their missile pods on whatever is left.

At turn 2-3 the HQs are in range for plasma rifles so again they'll fire on whatever seems to be a threat. With this firepower I can remove just about any heavy infantry unit (at least for me).

The helios will usually run as flank support for the Farsight squad. Their close range power will deter many from trying to assault from that flank. Later game they'll usually be trying to pop any remaining vehicles or finish off a remnant heavy infantry squad.

I love my missile pods, especially playing against mech eldar. Getting a makerlight hit really makes my day.

I can't run 3 hammerheads any more but they can certainly be a big factor in the game outcome. I think I'd go for the ion cannons playing huge_eldar though.